GUE Fundamentals Class Report (22 APR 2019)

[MichaelMc]

I'm saying that from the time I began diving, 3 person buddy teams were frowned upon but obviously, that position has morphed over the years.

Context matters.

In a highly trained team, 3 has advantages. Redundancy, extra brains, more muscle to drag/tow. The down side of more people clutter and harder sight lines seems worth it. This is the 3 is good context.

In a lightly trained cluster, 3 means everyone thinks someone else is watching the others and no one is. This is the 3 is bad context, where that has not changed.

 

[CAPTAIN SINBAD]

Again, I'm not saying there's anything wrong with it. I'm saying that from the time I began diving, 3 person buddy teams were frowned upon but obviously, that position has morphed over the years.

I understand. My thought is that there have always been two cultures in diving. Mainstream recreational diving culture that frowned upon 3 person teams VS the DIR community that stressed technical diving skills and mindset in recreational diving. These two are as divergent as ever with the former moving towards solo/ self reliant diver certifications while the latter emphasizing team protocols. Both address the failure of buddy system in mainstream recreational scuba.

 

[Ayisha]

OK, I'm just saying that the mantra used to be no 3 person teams.

See PfcAJ's post. He's probably old school

My personal preference is 2 person teams as well. A 3-person team will necessarily be less efficient because every drill or procedure will be repeated 3 times instead of 2. It also of course takes more effort to maintain 3 than 2.

But none of the above make it bad practice. We are actively taught to function as a cohesive team of either 2 or 3.

Outside of GUE/DIR, a trio has never been considered a good practice. It's often considered a liability due to the way it's practiced.

 

[chillyinCanada]

My personal preference is 2 person teams as well. A 3-person team will necessarily be less efficient because every drill or procedure will be repeated 3 times instead of 2. It also of course takes more effort to maintain 3 than 2.

But none of the above make it bad practice. We are actively taught to function as a cohesive team of either 2 or 3.

Outside of GUE/DIR, a trio has never been considered a good practice. It's often considered a liability due to the way it's practiced.

Fine you guys but back in the day, GUE/DIR folk actively eschewed 3 man buddy teams. I'm talking late 90's and very early 2000's.

 

[barth]

It depends on the situation and goal of the dive. My personal preference is a 3 persons team in most cases.

When cave diving I would never use 1/3 for penetration in a team of 2. Worst case situation 1 diver would lose his gas and then there is just 1/3 for each diver to exit. In a team of 3 divers there is more gas available. In a team of 2 divers I would use 1/4 for penetration and in a team of 3 divers 1/3 for penetration.

But also for wreck diving I prefer a team of 3. When 1 person is out of gas and 1 person is sharing gas the third person could launch a smb. When 1 person has a broken mask strap and there is a lot of current 1 diver can help the diver with the broken mask strap and the third diver can prevent the team for not leaving the wreck when there is al lot of current. It is nice to do skills at a lake at a fundamentalls course, But At the Northsea with a lot of current and low visibility is much harder. And if you lose the wreck at the bottom you won't find it again. If you don't launch a SMB or to late you can get lost at the surface at the north sea.

For goals like measuring a torpedo tube I also prefer a team of 3, 2 persons can do the measurement and the third person can write down the dimensions in his/het wetnotes.

Scootering with poor visibility would be better in a team of 2. Searching for shark tooth or doing a cleanup dive would also be better in a team of 2.

 

[RayfromTX]

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A ScubaBoard Staff Message...

The discussion of best mix vs standard gasses has been moved to its own thread in the Technical Diving Forum. It can be found here. Best Mix VS Standard Gasses (split from a GUE fundies course report)

Please try to keep this thread on the subject of the excellent class report on his GUE Fundamentals course by
@PullYourselfTogetherMan

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[PullYourselfTogetherMan]

Thanks for that, @RayfromTX

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Fine you guys but back in the day, GUE/DIR folk actively eschewed 3 man buddy teams. I'm talking late 90's and very early 2000's.

I think the disconnect is in training. GUE does an excellent job in teaching diving in teams. That is quite apparent in fundies. Buddy diving is a mixed back in the mainstream agencies.

 

[chillyinCanada]

I think the disconnect is in training. GUE does an excellent job in teaching diving in teams. That is quite apparent in fundies. Buddy diving is a mixed back in the mainstream agencies.

But I'm not talking about the other agencies.

 

[Ayisha]

But I'm not talking about the other agencies.

I didn't start paying attention to GUE until 2003 and didn't take Fundies until 2014, so I was not aware of any changes in the team approach that may have happened. I looked through the "Fundamentals of Better Diving", the Fundies manual, which was originally published in 2000. Under "Unified Team", I could not see any preference for 2 or 3 divers in a team. These are some of the statements:
"A dive team is not an arbitrary collection of individuals but a group that acts with the team’s interest in mind. Each member must first be independently capable or they will only burden the buddy team".
"Diving with qualified dive buddies is much safer and far more rewarding than diving alone. Right, three divers enjoying a shallow recreational reef dive with scooters".
Some screenshots: