GUE Cave Training?

[Teller]

Thanks for all the answers. I understand there are caves outside of FL, I was trying to plan for the worst though. Chances are I wont get two great assignments back to back and Ill be stuck somewhere where they have never heard of scuba let alone cave diving. I have been pleased with all of my TDI classes and I know its mostly the instructor anyways but I have heard so many great stories about GUE classes being very informative and challenging its drawing my attention. Thanks again to all who responded.

 

[TSandM]

Well, you would have to take GUE Fundamentals to do the cave courses anyway . . . Why don't you do that, and decide whether you like what you see?

If you get hooked on cave diving, I suspect you'll find your vacation time will be planned for somewhere where you can swim into holes in the ground. At least mine are . . .

 

[kathydee]

3 years is quite a bit of cave diving. If you are attracted to caves, why not seize the opportunity while you can, and not worry about future diving.

A GUE foundation will benefit any diving, and cave skills will be quite useful for wreck penetration, etc.

 

[Teller]

3 years is quite a bit of cave diving. If you are attracted to caves, why not seize the opportunity while you can, and not worry about future diving.

A GUE foundation will benefit any diving, and cave skills will be quite useful for wreck penetration, etc.

I am for sure going to seek out cave training while in FL. Im just trying to decide whether to stick with TDI or go with GUE. I will prob take fundies and then decide as mentioned above. Thanks.

 

[Rhino2]

Just going off what another poster referenced as far as recertification requirements, it appears you could achieve your initial re-certification dives before leaving Florida. At least you could effectively put in the bank the dives you would need and get yourself recertified after leaving. In fact, the longer you wait to get a cert and the 25 dives after cert, the further out your recert would last, i.e. getting C3 6 months before you leave and getting the dives in during the remaining time before you go. I'm not a GUE diver and I am sure someone will correct me if I am wrong.

 

[TSandM]

It's true -- we had almost done enough to recertify at C1 by the time we left MX after our Cave 1 class. But it does defeat the purpose of the recency requirement, which is to make sure you are really safe to continue diving at that level.

 

[vicp]

Why in the world would you go with an agency that FORCES you to recertify?

The most important thing to consider is the insructor and most of the best certify through multiple agencies. Beware of those that sell you certs that expire and impose configuration limitations. These are basically money mills - training and probably travel are the only money makers in the dive business.

Find a good instructor, take your training in increments (cavern then intro to cave, etc.) with plenty of practice between classes. Don't get hung up on the agency (GUE, NACD, or whatever). In the end, after full cave, it is worth to have a card from a technical agency (TDI, NAUI, IANTD,etc.) and one from a cave society such as NSS-CDS (hard to recommend NACD these days). This will give you access to most dive sites. Take your refresher training when YOU feel you need it.

 

[PfcAJ]

Re-certify or remain current?

GUE requires you to remain current (like most licenses or certifications out there, the diving world being a glaring exception). Let's call it what it is and not make up things.

 

[TSandM]

Beware of those that sell you certs that expire and impose configuration limitations. These are basically money mills - training and probably travel are the only money makers in the dive business.

All you have to do to keep your cave cert active is do 8 or 9 cave dives a year, or 25 in a long, single trip every THREE years. If you do this, there is no need to retake a class. Personally, I don't think that's excessive. I know that, with my one or two cave trips a year, I get rusty between times, and my first dive back in the caves is my "bull in a china shop" dive. I also know, from having let two years go by between my classes, that my memory of emergency procedures had gotten foggy. I think it's a GREAT idea to provide a motivation for people to stay current. If you took a cave class and then didn't cave dive for ten years, would you think you could go right back to it? Having a day or two of checkout from an instructor would seem to me to be a very good idea.

Yes, this makes a tiny bit of money for GUE -- maybe -- because you pay a fee for the new card. But that's not why the requirement is there. It's part of the overall attitude of the agency, to make sure the divers they train are on top of their game.

 

[vicp]

TS&M - a lot of what you say is good and true.

All you have to do to keep your cave cert active is do 8 or 9 cave dives a year, or 25 in a long, single trip every THREE years. If you do this, there is no need to retake a class.

But if you don't, it will probably be expensive to get your ratings back.

I think it's a GREAT idea to provide a motivation for people to stay current. If you took a cave class and then didn't cave dive for ten years, would you think you could go right back to it? Having a day or two of checkout from an instructor would seem to me to be a very good idea.

My motivation in cave diving is to enjoy the caves, the skills challenge and to be safe (and stay alive). When I feel rusty, I will go to a pool, find a mentor, and do fairly conservative dives until I am once again confident. I even retook a course (different instructor - different agency) after a 7 year absence from diving. My original cert (NSS-CDS) was still valid. As a cave divers, we learn and are trained to be aware and self-reliant. I do not feel I need an agency (GUE) to tell me what I need to do and when to do it.

Good and safe cave (and other) divers do not pop out of classes, no matter how good the instruction. They need to incorporate and integrate what they have learned and evolve through experience. It is also said that it may be a good idea to not have the same instructor in subsequent classes as to learn and experience different viewpoints and approaches. While the training GUE provides may be superb (I still believe that the instructor is the key factor), I am not inclined to follow a single path (or agency) and have them make decisions for me. I have been diving for 40 years and have seen a lot of changes to believe in any one system.

Yes, this makes a tiny bit of money for GUE -- maybe -- because you pay a fee for the new card. But that's not why the requirement is there. It's part of the overall attitude of the agency, to make sure the divers they train are on top of their game.

While this is a noble sentiment, I am cynical enough to not believe it. Any agency's primary function (whether stated or not) is self-preservation and perpetuation, regardless if it is a church, political party, government, etc. Many of the diving agencies have policies that are basically CYA - that is, to limit their liability and I believe, to generate revenue. GUE 3-year expiration, NACD and NSS-CDS temporary doubles and apprentice levels are examples of these. TDI has cavern, Intro-to-Cave, Full Cave (no apprentice or configuration exclusions). NAUI and IANTD have Cave1, Cave2, etc. It seems that the path to full cave certification has been obfuscated by lawyers and the desire to feed the training cash cow.

If the OP desires GUE training, he should pursue it. I would actually love to take a GUE class if the cost was not so high and they did not require back-mounted doubles instead of sidemount (another silly artifact of institutional cement). I just caution against taking ANY organization too seriously.