go tec or stay rec

[ams511]

You make a good point, but it begs the question why the recreational student isn't more discerning.

My theory is this, students place a priority on the outcome not the knowledge it represents. You see it in universities where students gravitate to easy instructors where they can get an A, even if the education is sub-standard. In the OW case, the students want the C-card and the easier they can get it the better. Of course there are serious students which actually look for quality and rigor but they are the minority.

 

[mdb]

"Tech" is yesterdays "Rec"

 

[Sphyrnidae Amicus]

Also, OP, one thing you're missing is that diving at this level in the beginning can be very stressful. It's hard, there's a lot to follow. There's a lot to be mindful of. It's sometimes stressful. Right about the time it all falls into place, the stress starts to fall away. Things are really starting to click. You're really starting to enjoy yourself. Diving is becoming amazing, even beyond anything you could imagine.... Then you start teaching at this level and all the stress comes back. Why? Because all the fear and stress and worry you had for yourself, you now have for your students. ​

Absolutely! Most of the best dives I've done here have been technical (down deep we have a LOT more groovy big stuff!), I've seen some truly stunning creatures that I wouldn't have missed for all the world. Next week I'm teaching my first tech course and I'm pretty certain I won't be looking at much that isn't my student...it's going to be fun but in a completely different (and very stressful) way. I never dreamed of teaching tech until I'd logged a lot of tech dives (and including ones that hadn't gone strictly according to plan) and even then it took me a long long, time to decide I was ready to teach it.

 

[DevonDiver]

As for becoming a tec instructor, to my impression you other tec instructors do not think that a 4 month intensive internship is enough to begin teaching technical diving? If not, what do you recccomend?

As some others have mentioned, teaching technical diving isn't merely an extension of teaching recreational diving. It's hard to convey the difficulties you'll encounter until you've had a taste of technical diving at diver level.

The task loading with tech is immense. Most find it a significant challenge (at diver level)...and that includes 'seasoned rec instructors' when they first make the transition. The additional loading on a tech instructor is even more significant - it demands that all of the necessary skills, drills, protocols are ingrained to an entirely unconscious level - thus freeing up capacity for effective situational awareness needed to ensure personal and student safety, whilst allowing the relentless problem solving necessary to achieve very refined instructional goals with students.

One shouldn't assume that potential students will be clueless. That's a luxury only afforded in recreational instruction. Many technical diving students will have conducted extensive research and personal pre-study prior to enrollment. Many will be 'seasoned dive pros' themselves - or may have already accumulated decades of diving experience. A 'bluffer' (one who expects to teach directly from the manual with a limited breadth of supplementary knowledge and experience) will become apparent very rapidly. With technical diving, reputation and personal history is far more important than in recreational diving (where an 'anonymous' instructor can work in dive centers and suffer little professional impact from low-quality teaching). In technical diving, your name can become 'mud' very quickly in the circles that matter. A bad reputation takes a lot longer to clear, than establishing a good reputation in the first place (which is itself a very slow process).

Bag the internship, drop 1500 on a course that will give me 12 ow dives... or spend a bit more and get proper training. Sure I will walk away a DSAT instructor, but that sure doesn't mean I am going to be running around bending out people... I am hoping to EXPAND my possibilities as an instructor...

It sounds like you'll be getting a good deal/price on the internship. You also have a job offer in place. That deals with any issues of return-on-investment. One of the biggest concerns otherwise would be getting meaningful employment as a tech instructor following a zero-to-hero transition...

The biggest insights you'll gain will come from the training itself. Not just the course syllabus, but your opportunity to inter-act and observe your new peer group at both tech diver and tech instructor levels.

The best advice I can give is to keep your eyes open and be brutally honest with yourself in how you compare with those peers. Also, be brutally honest in self-evaluation of your true competency at tech diver and tech instructor level.

My own experience was that I remained at tech diver level for over 6 years before becoming a tech instructor. I was a qualified rec instructor throughout that time. I had also gained technical qualifications through several different agencies and instructors - it's good to have a wider breadth of understanding beyond the limits of a single agency program. Having then done the training, passed the evaluations and gained the plastic to be a technical diving instructor, I then manually elected to remain as an assistant-only for several more years. I believed that gave me a very comprehensive foundation. Experience counted for much more than the plastic cards I held.

As an active technical instructor for several years, I see many differences between recreational and technical instructors. It is not uncommon for technical diving instructors to contact each-other and discuss students that are being 'passed on' from one instructor to another. The level of success, or failure, you have with a student will be immediately apparent to successor instructors. That's your reputation on the line. Word of failure, or low standards, gets out pretty quickly. Once out, it stays out. Plastic instructor-qualification cards are irrelevant; I am judged professionally on the basis of my students competency, the application of their skill-set, their mind-set and the level of expertise I can provide them with. I am happy to be judged that way - as should any self-respecting tech instructor.

Likewise, your former students will judge you based on their experiences once they enter the tech community and/or enroll on subsequent tech training with other instructors. Any short-comings in their training will be immediately and obviously apparent to them (not so with recreational divers). Personal reputation and word-of-mouth recommendations are a...no...the.... critical marketing tool for a tech instructor. Do a bad job and you'll get professionally stagnant quickly....and stay stagnant a long time.

For sure, get the training. Put the cards in your wallet. However, remain realistic about your competency for both technical diving and technical instructing. Let your decision to teach reflect that realism, rather than financial or egotistical factors. That decision can have long-term impacts; both positive and negative for your subsequent career. Technical diving is a tough...and sometimes harshly critical and unforgiving... industry and community in which to succeed professionally as an instructor. It's an industry/community that thrives on perfectionism. Not many will be apologetic about that.

I really feel from some of the users on hear that they are the only ones suited to be tec instructors

You need to accept that, as it stands, you are an unknown entity as a technical diver, let alone a tech instructor. Not just for us, but for yourself. It's hard to be encouraging and supportive when such little is known. From those with experience, realistic advice can be a bitter pill. Don't view it as discouragement - but rather as a challenge.

The tech mindset is necessarily very different to that you've encountered in recreational diving... even as an experienced dive pro. Don't expect to commute any respect and credibility you earned as a recreational instructor into the tech community. It's time to put the 'noobie' hat on again... and talk of rapid progression to instructor-level has the same sort of impact as a yet-to-qualify OW student talking of how they'll become an instructor themselves 'in a few weeks'. I hope that makes sense and doesn't sound elitist... it's just a reflection of reality.

 

[Dr. Lecter]

The internship allows me 4 months of hands on training, conducting courses, under the supervision of extremely well versed tec instructors. So, by the end I will have the experience, hopefully at least 50-100 deco dives as a dive, safety diver and support diver.

You think that's an "extreme amount of experience" such that you should be teaching others about technical diving? You seem to be under the impression that your extensive OW diving and less extensive OW instruction experience will somehow carry over to tech and that once you have very minimal deco diving experience plus some classroom time, you'll be good to go even though a newly minted tech diver with 50-100 basic deco dives under their belt would be (properly) laughed at for wanting to teach.

Speaking as someone who doesn't teach any form of diving (or have any wish to) but who does have a couple hundred more tech dives under their belt than you hope to after your internship, I think you're overestimating the relevance of your prior experience.

 

[Ste Wart]

Moving away from the general theme at the moment.


Dahab is very chilled place to hang out. I made a lot of friends there (most of which have moved on due to the revolution and downturn in tourism) and made dozens of memorable dives.
For instance there are seahorses hanging out in the bay just a few metres from where Team Immersion is based. The lighthouse; the main training reef, can throw up some surprises every now and again.. guitar shark anyone!. The Bells to Blue Hole is one of the most stunning wall dives in the world. The Boat dives to Gabr El Bint easily beat some sites down in Sharm El Sheikh. Then there is Tiger Cave, the Canyon, Deep Canyon. You name it Dahab has a lot of opportunities for great dives.
The main strip has some great restaurants. Hopefully Nok and Antoine are still running Blue House, the best Thai outside of Thailand. There is an Indian Restaurant close to Team Immersion that is a treat to the senses. Talk to the locals who know where to find the best felafel in town where you pay pennies to fill you up. While Popeyes Sandwich hut is the best thing after a long dive, solid stodge for bargain prices.
If your there 4 months you should be able to find your own place in Assalah for around $150 a month. So you will have your own place rather than stay in the Hostel Camps for the duration. There is a magic fish restaurant there.
No doubt you will introduced to the 'furry cup' (technically Blue Beach Bar) the instructors main hang out, where social networking gets done.
You can do day trips to the Thistlegorm and Ras Mohammed, and Petra (in Jordan) where you can do your best Indiana Jones impression.

And if your unlucky enough you'll even meet me as I'm trying to plan a holiday there later in the year Learn Ratio Deco and we'll go for a dive.

 

[pholife]

Moving away from the general theme at the moment.


Dahab is very chilled place to hang out. I made a lot of friends there (most of which have moved on due to the revolution and downturn in tourism) and made dozens of memorable dives.
For instance there are seahorses hanging out in the bay just a few metres from where Team Immersion is based. The lighthouse; the main training reef, can throw up some surprises every now and again.. guitar shark anyone!. The Bells to Blue Hole is one of the most stunning wall dives in the world. The Boat dives to Gabr El Bint easily beat some sites down in Sharm El Sheikh. Then there is Tiger Cave, the Canyon, Deep Canyon. You name it Dahab has a lot of opportunities for great dives.
The main strip has some great restaurants. Hopefully Nok and Antoine are still running Blue House, the best Thai outside of Thailand. There is an Indian Restaurant close to Team Immersion that is a treat to the senses. Talk to the locals who know where to find the best felafel in town where you pay pennies to fill you up. While Popeyes Sandwich hut is the best thing after a long dive, solid stodge for bargain prices.
If your there 4 months you should be able to find your own place in Assalah for around $150 a month. So you will have your own place rather than stay in the Hostel Camps for the duration. There is a magic fish restaurant there.
No doubt you will introduced to the 'furry cup' (technically Blue Beach Bar) the instructors main hang out, where social networking gets done.
You can do day trips to the Thistlegorm and Ras Mohammed, and Petra (in Jordan) where you can do your best Indiana Jones impression.

And if your unlucky enough you'll even meet me as I'm trying to plan a holiday there later in the year Learn Ratio Deco and we'll go for a dive.

Ste Ward, thanks man, I don't know much about Dahab. Ideally, I've been thinking of spreading the training over 6 months (which is cool with guys at TBI) and hoping to do some freelancing and line something work wise (don't worry ya'll just normal padi teaching) as to keep an income to cover living costs and keep my student counts coming in... How difficult is it for an American (able to teach in English and Spanish) to line that up there?

Dahab seems great, and I'm keen on getting the training, not just the ticket, doing it all DIR!

Thanks for all the feedback guys, I appreciate the honesty and experience you are sharing with me.

-G

---------- Post added June 27th, 2013 at 03:46 AM ----------

Moving away from the general theme at the moment.


Dahab is very chilled place to hang out. I made a lot of friends there (most of which have moved on due to the revolution and downturn in tourism) and made dozens of memorable dives.
For instance there are seahorses hanging out in the bay just a few metres from where Team Immersion is based. The lighthouse; the main training reef, can throw up some surprises every now and again.. guitar shark anyone!. The Bells to Blue Hole is one of the most stunning wall dives in the world. The Boat dives to Gabr El Bint easily beat some sites down in Sharm El Sheikh. Then there is Tiger Cave, the Canyon, Deep Canyon. You name it Dahab has a lot of opportunities for great dives.
The main strip has some great restaurants. Hopefully Nok and Antoine are still running Blue House, the best Thai outside of Thailand. There is an Indian Restaurant close to Team Immersion that is a treat to the senses. Talk to the locals who know where to find the best felafel in town where you pay pennies to fill you up. While Popeyes Sandwich hut is the best thing after a long dive, solid stodge for bargain prices.
If your there 4 months you should be able to find your own place in Assalah for around $150 a month. So you will have your own place rather than stay in the Hostel Camps for the duration. There is a magic fish restaurant there.
No doubt you will introduced to the 'furry cup' (technically Blue Beach Bar) the instructors main hang out, where social networking gets done.
You can do day trips to the Thistlegorm and Ras Mohammed, and Petra (in Jordan) where you can do your best Indiana Jones impression.

And if your unlucky enough you'll even meet me as I'm trying to plan a holiday there later in the year Learn Ratio Deco and we'll go for a dive.

Ste Ward, thanks man, I don't know much about Dahab. Ideally, I've been thinking of spreading the training over 6 months (which is cool with guys at TBI) and hoping to do some freelancing and line something work wise (don't worry ya'll just normal padi teaching) as to keep an income to cover living costs and keep my student counts coming in... How difficult is it for an American (able to teach in English and Spanish) to line that up there?

Dahab seems great, and I'm keen on getting the training, not just the ticket, doing it all DIR!

Thanks for all the feedback guys, I appreciate the honesty and experience you are sharing with me.

-G

 

[Ste Wart]

Ste Ward, thanks man, I don't know much about Dahab. Ideally, I've been thinking of spreading the training over 6 months

Good plan. More for enjoying Dahab than the training

and hoping to do some freelancing and line something work wise to keep an income to cover living costs and keep my student counts coming in... How difficult is it for an American (able to teach in English and Spanish) to line that up there?

Spanish isn't a big teaching language in Dahab. German and Korean are probably still (been a while since I left) the main tourists after English speakers.
Technically it is illegal to work without a work permit in Egypt and they have clamped down a bit post-revolution. Talk to the guys at Immersion and see what is happening and who will turn a blind eye. I know many in Dahab who have been there more than a decade on a tourist visa! Spend some social lubrication hours in the Furry Cup and see what turns up.


Talk to Sam at the dive center next to Sea Dancer (I forget the name as it's new) he's been Tech diving in Dahab for ages and will probably know a few cheeky sites to do. Actually talk to Steve at SeaDancer as well; he's the manager, he knows Dahab inside and out.

 

[flots am]

I know many in Dahab who have been there more than a decade on a tourist visa! Spend some social lubrication hours in the Furry Cup and see what turns up.

So what happens when you show up at the airport with your expired-years-ago visa?

Will the new government say "We hope you enjoyed your stay" or will they invite you to spend some time in one of their prisons?

Governments many times have unexpected responses to these types of problems. Especially governments that just had a revolution and are still figuring things out.

I worked with a guy who overstayed his visa in the US. He just got sent home. A lot of others aren't so lucky.

flots

 

[DevonDiver]

I'm guessing that those on a tourist visa continue to renew that tourist visa.