Freediving fins might help

[tomfcrist]

Long blades have been primarily designed with full footpockets and warm water divers. I guess mainly because deep free diving would be much harder in cold water. More weight, more wetsuit etc etc.

But I would guess JD at Moana or some others would be willing to incorporate an open heel with a long blade. There are many combinations of blade stiffness, as Dan mentioned, and thickness and stiffness of the footpocket tendon.

For scuba, they work fine for me. You can go just as slow as with any fin. Yes, back kicking is probably not possible but as someone mentioned about hiding behind wrecks or ledges in a strong current, I feel the same about back kicking. Just rotate 180 and face the current. Much easier,

But like a knife, or extra light or ....Spare AIr....GASP....did I say that? haha....you normally won't even use...but.when you do need that extra speed of long blades, you probably need it pretty bad. In a pinch, I would ditch my scuba unit and weight belt. Having the extra speed to get across the venturi point of a ripping current will be a real plus. Use your head and get into the back eddies.

I hunt in currents every week. We LOOK for the strong currents because that's where the fish are. Going back to scuba type fins is like going from Duck Feet to bare feet.

Then Longblades will probably work for you.. They dont work for me. I dive wrecks, inside them generally...In heavy currents because thats where the wrecks are...Longblades inside a wreck is more dangerous than believing that a spare air will actually do you any good when diving the Doria.

 

[danvolker]

Then Longblades will probably work for you.. They dont work for me. I dive wrecks, inside them generally...In heavy currents because thats where the wrecks are...Longblades inside a wreck is more dangerous than believing that a spare air will actually do you any good when diving the Doria.

Hi Tom,
I don't push freediving fins for wreck penetrations...Myself, I have enjoyed both wrecks and reefs for a very long time....and have found that MOST wreck penetrations that I do, are better handled with freediving fins......because of the far better ease of getting to the wreck in a high current area, and because if I am shooting video , the long blades allow me to pace with more stability inside the wreck, for better video quality--and I have NEVER, EVER silted in a wreck....There are some penetrations we have, where I will not use a long blade fin, due to low ceilings --and while it is simple to avoid silting the floor in a silty wreck with long blades, avoiding a low ceiling also--can become a problem....

Here is a typical wreck I would use DiveR freedive fins inside of...as I did when I filmed this video...this was a moderate current day..you can see how I get blown along the out side of the wrecks, the jewfish moving around are out of the current, in the eddy behind the wreck.... and then the taught line to the surface buoy.....you will see that once inside, there are lots of big fish--which is what gets me into a penetration....there is a floor and room below this main big room...that has a very low overhead, and is not nearly so pretty...but if I want to go in there...you have real tech level penetration planning, and, I would be wearing Extra Force Fins due to the tight constraints of the tech level penetration.....

[video=youtube_share;vGB8XNq8QF0]http://youtu.be/vGB8XNq8QF0[/video]

 

[djtimmy77]

Could you imagine the people tripping/falling over each other on a cattle boat full of vacation divers with freediving fins trying to get off the boat when the captain calls "DIVE DIVE DIVE"?

That being said I am planning on trying freediving fins out some day. Most of my diving focuses on going slower rather than faster so my F1's are more than adequate at the time being. I have tried splits and found them to be grossly inadequate in current to move my large mass.

 

[ams511]

I asked that question in a different thread that devolved into a "every fin except freediving fins sucks" derailment. The answer I received was to purchase a specific model of Force Fins that will accommodate a drysuit boot. ... Bob (Grateful Diver)

So basically a person can only use freediving fins in warmer waters that only require a thin sock to be comfortable. That is what I thought. I know Dan likes the Excelerating Force Fins also, but they are $400 (without the whiskers) and the "whiskers" appear to be an entanglement hazard.

 

[Hank49]

Then Longblades will probably work for you.. They dont work for me. I dive wrecks, inside them generally...In heavy currents because thats where the wrecks are...Longblades inside a wreck is more dangerous than believing that a spare air will actually do you any good when diving the Doria.

I don't understand why longblades would be more dangerous. Does this mean being 6'8" and diving wrecks is more dangerous than being 5'4"?
You can easily do a modified butterfly type kick with long fins that directs the water upwards and not down into the silt. I don't silt up outside a wreck with them....so why would I silt INSIDE a wreck? (I don't do deep penetration wreck diving so pardon my ignorance here)

Yes, I agree, they're not for everyone and everyone can choose. But just about everyone I know who tried them didn't go back to stumpy fins. (just kidding) Dive safe amigo.

 

[danvolker]

So basically a person can only use freediving fins in warmer waters that only require a thin sock to be comfortable. That is what I thought. I know Dan likes the Excelerating Force Fins also, but they are $400 (without the whiskers) and the "whiskers" appear to be an entanglement hazard.

No...this is wrong info you must have gotten from Bob

Many of the makes of freedive fins, come in several different stiffnesses of blades to accommodate different fitness levels or planned duration of diving.....and with this, you have multiple foot pockets available....and the Riffe Silent Hunter foot pocket, is an open heel design which is actually better than any full foot pocket I have tried, in the way it transfers power....and it allows normal booties, and even use by dry suit divers--I got these to use with my TLS350 DUI suit....and now use this open heel pocket on my long blades even in summer with wetsuits or just a bathing suit.

As to the whiskers being an entanglement hazard on the Force Fins....if you are running lines in a dicey place, and this is a real concern, then you would just not use the whiskers...they are active primarily when you decide to kick really hard--as they channel more water flow at high effort.....making the fin almost turbo charged...but even without the whiskers, the Excellerating Force, and the Extra Force are light years beyond Jets or Hollis fins.....and..they cost a lot less than a Gavin or Halcyon scooter

 

[tomfcrist]

and I have NEVER, EVER silted in a wreck....

Then you havent been wreck diving long enough, and/or consider swim throughs to be penetration.

There are some penetrations we have, where I will not use a long blade fin, due to low ceilings --and while it is simple to avoid silting the floor in a silty wreck with long blades, avoiding a low ceiling also--can become a problem....

Most wrecks i dive in are just flat out silty. Floors heavy silt, ceilings and bulkheads moderate silt. There is no freaking way that with 3 feet of fin hanging off your back end that you will not silt out these wrecks.

Here is a typical wreck I would use DiveR freedive fins inside of...as I did when I filmed this video...this was a moderate current day..you can see how I get blown along the out side of the wrecks, the jewfish moving around are out of the current, in the eddy behind the wreck.... and then the taught line to the surface buoy.....you will see that once inside, there are lots of big fish--which is what gets me into a penetration....there is a floor and room below this main big room...that has a very low overhead, and is not nearly so pretty...but if I want to go in there...you have real tech level penetration planning, and, I would be wearing Extra Force Fins due to the tight constraints of the tech level penetration.....

[video=youtube_share;vGB8XNq8QF0]http://youtu.be/vGB8XNq8QF0[/video]

Unfortunately, im at work, but as soon as i get a chance i promise that i will take a look at this video.

---------- Post added February 20th, 2014 at 01:28 PM ----------

I don't understand why longblades would be more dangerous. Does this mean being 6'8" and diving wrecks is more dangerous than being 5'4"?
You can easily do a modified butterfly type kick with long fins that directs the water upwards and not down into the silt. I don't silt up outside a wreck with them....so why would I silt INSIDE a wreck? (I don't do deep penetration wreck diving so pardon my ignorance here)

Yes, I agree, they're not for everyone and everyone can choose. But just about everyone I know who tried them didn't go back to stumpy fins. (just kidding) Dive safe amigo.

Refer to my response to Dan. Your ignorance is pardoned.

 

[tracydr]

This is not really about what these divers did right or wrong...it is about what happens if you are in a place with extreme conditions going on, and there is no boat....

So the questions are :

1. How do you decide what object to swim for...and what vector to use to reach it...
2. How will you use the gear you have to attain the objective....If there is a short area that could be crossed quickly, that could give you massive assistance in gaining safety-but crossing quickly means getting to the bottom and going hand over hand with the air left among your group...this is a theoretical strategy and problem solving issue divers need to deal with....or, if they all just go to maximum crusing pace at 10 feet below the surface, with the remaining air they have left, and follow a compass heading (OR LEAD DIVER DOES) until they have reached the safe point....knowing that this is far more efficient for speed and distance than swimming on the surface would be....and ten feet from the surface does not use up much air compared to at 60 feet....If the run is not long to safety, and missing the run target could mean being swept out to sea for a hundred miles, and their are at zero air left.....do they dump the high drag BC and tanks, and dump the weight belt, and go for max speed on the surface to try to save themselves from days at sea, with almost no hope of being seen for days?
3. If they have split fins, then they will need to know the vector that will work for them...Even a freedive fin diver, needs to have a sense of what is the optimal crossing path to the target. You can't go with unthinking brute force, when your life is at stake.

I don't see how discussion of gear and strategies for future trips--in adventure areas like this....is not something that everyone would see value in!!!?????

I do see where discussion of how to cross in currents is of value. I usually choose to get 10 feet below the surface to do any significant swimming in the ocean. If surge or current are wicked, I've gone to the bottom after taking a compass heading and cross, sometimes hand over hand in more wicked situations.
In Galapegos and Africa crossing on the bottom was preferred. Trying to surface swim is crazy, if you have air and weights. If you've been floating on the surface for hours with any significant exposure protection, you've most likely dropped any dumpable weights. So submerging may be impossible. Also, if you've been in churning, surgy water with high waves, you very likely have used up all your air, unless water was smooth enough for a snorkel or nothing. I suspect that air supplies were used quickly with the conditions these divers encountered.
Granted, I'm not a believer in split fins but they do have their purpose. Divers with bad knees find them much more comfortable. I used a pair of splits for years but mine were stiffer and gave me decent propulsion. I did switch to 100% paddle fins when I started drysuit diving as the splits wouldn't push the extra drag around with any sort of current. I've saved my split fins, mainly for use as loaners when my husband teaches or the kids want to play in the pool. However, I would consider using them again, with the knee issues I'm having, once the arthritis gets severe enough that I can't comfortably kick my "Hollis lookalikes". I wouldn't choose the splits for Bali, Africa or Galapegos, or any cold water diving with drysuit.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I'm still waiting for him to mention how you're going to die if you wear drysuits. We don't know if these women had drysuits on. 75 degree water there's a fair chance that they might.

Given the descriptions I've read about their sunburns, I had the impression they were either in shorties or just bathing suits. I wore a shorty on my first trip to Indonesia and it was plenty warm enough ... but after getting introduced to fire coral I've since opted for a full 3/2 wetsuit ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[MAKO Spearguns]

Could you imagine the people tripping/falling over each other on a cattle boat full of vacation divers with freediving fins trying to get off the boat when the captain calls "DIVE DIVE DIVE"?

That being said I am planning on trying freediving fins out some day. Most of my diving focuses on going slower rather than faster so my F1's are more than adequate at the time being. I have tried splits and found them to be grossly inadequate in current to move my large mass.

I am hesitant to step into this thread because the tone has gotten somewhat intense, but I might be able to add something specific to the discussion of freedive fins. Freedivers move reasonably quickly through the water because they are very streamlined.

Generally a freediver's goal is to move efficiently rather than "fast". Rarely will a freediver kick their fins "hard" or try to swim at a speed that is anywhere near their maximum (while in open water).

A spearfisherman MAY use a burst of power and speed to manhandle a large fish, but in generally they too are much more interested in time or distance underwater, rather than speed.

So even though a pair of freedive fins (that fit well and have a blade stiffness that matches the physical characteristics of the diver) can allow a diver to swim fast in the water, the primary benefit of a freedive fins is their efficiency. They may be clumsy on a boat, but in the water, most divers will move more easily and with less effort while wearing long blade fins.

Good luck with your freedive fin experiments!