Forced descent in Blue Hole

[victor]

I would love to see the response to this question from some of the people who are posting on this thread.
http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?t=141651&page=6

From my very limited point of view it's the air management that must be a nightmare for the DM.

Scenario: Say 4 inexperienced divers (2 buddies pairs) in a new group of 12, There air consumption is high but have a few dives in this week already so can descend quickly. Fairly quick descent, maybe lost a minute waiting. 6/7 minutes or so at 135ft all looking good when 1 diver gives the signal for 500 psi, followed quickly by 2 others, (been 2 busy to look at their guages).
All 4 look at the DM, what do we do now?

How many spare octo's does the DM have?
How much air is on his back?
Even given a smooth ascent some of this group are going to be out of air before they hit the safety stop.
Can he get the more experienced divers together to support him on the ascent?

What should he do? and how can he accomplish it?

 

[1RUSTYRIG]

Diving is not a handholding sport...sometimes you have to have thick skin and realize that some things are told AS IS...diving is not a sport for whiners.

This is one of the best posts I have seen on this board and should be mandatory reading for new divers.

As far as the Blue Hole dive...A 3 hour boat ride is possible depending on where you launched from, how rough the water is, wind, etc.. That is part of "Boat" diving and if these gals were "experienced" divers they would have known that. Every dive op I spoke with prior to my trip down to Belize indicated that the Blue Hole dive was an ENTIRE day. You leave around 5:30 in the morning and don't get back until just before sunset (so they can navigate the reef in the daylight).

I dived w/ Amigos Del Mar last time and I will be diving with them again this June. Top notch establishment and they serve a damn fine panti ripper (coconut rum + pineapple juice) on the way back to port.

 

[Web Monkey]

A deep dive without "(a)dvanced" procedures isn't an advanced dive. It's a stupid dive.

I like that.

140' in an overhead environment, planned as an NDL dive on (I assume) a single 80 is way outside of my "happy place."

Terry

 

[1RUSTYRIG]

I would love to see the response to this question from some of the people who are posting on this thread.
http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?t=141651&page=6

From my very limited point of view it's the air management that must be a nightmare for the DM.

Scenario: Say 4 inexperienced divers (2 buddies pairs) in a new group of 12, There air consumption is high but have a few dives in this week already so can descend quickly. Fairly quick descent, maybe lost a minute waiting. 6/7 minutes or so at 135ft all looking good when 1 diver gives the signal for 500 psi, followed quickly by 2 others, (been 2 busy to look at their guages).
All 4 look at the DM, what do we do now?

How many spare octo's does the DM have?
How much air is on his back?
Even given a smooth ascent some of this group are going to be out of air before they hit the safety stop.
Can he get the more experienced divers together to support him on the ascent?

What should he do? and how can he accomplish it?

There were a lot of other dive operators at the blue hole the day we went. All of them had multiple tanks submerged at the deco stop. Amigos Del Mar, our operator, had a platform at ~20 with 4 tanks and regs.

This falls into basic deep dive planning. If you are going deep, have a deco station setup in the event that you need additional air.

 

[TheRedHead]

I was in that group and I voiced my opinion already: New divers shouldn't do this dive. I would want at least 100 cu ft of air and 120 for my experienced buddy, and both of us would sling a pony. I wouldn't do this dive with more than 6 divers - all of them experienced with deep diving. If I were planning the dive, I would require a deep diving specialty or proof of recent deep dives. The DM should carry 120 cu ft of gas with a long hose. He has plenty of time (3 hours) to give a detailed dive breifing and that should include the discussion of planned stops, including deep stops.

I'm glad I read this thread because I want to avoid at all costs going on this dive with a bunch of inexperienced divers. If I ever do this dive, I would question the dive op and find out their policies and make sure they were sensible before getting on the boat.

 

[Christi]

A responsible DM will choose dive site based upon the level of training and experience the divers have. A good DM will make divers who want hand holding feel secure and expand their skill level in the divers comfort zone. A good DM will NOT bring people they KNOW can't do a certain dive to a site just because the diver has a c card. A good DM who is faced with a diver who wants to do a certain dive with the Divemaster and the DM doesn't feel the diver is up to it will not take them. The diver is free to find another who will.

EXACTLY!

 

[fairybasslet]

I have to agree with TheRedHead. I remember doing my first wall dive to 120 in GC. You went down with the group and stayed with the group. I don't exactly remember the briefing about not waiting for someone to equalize, but you knew you had limited bottom time so you had to get down, and do your dive pronto. Anyway, my late-husband was newly certified and hyperventilated on descent. He couldn't get down. So we just hung out on the line waiting for the group to come back. Next time we tried, he was fine.
I have to say this. If a DM said something to be about equalizing, because sometimes I do have trouble, it would kind of freak me out and for sure, I'd have trouble on that dive because he put it into my head. If I do ever do that dive, I think I will go with ADM from what you guys have said. I can descend pretty quickly usually, but if I had a slight comfort zone of knowing I had 4 minutes to do it (I think that's what I read in a previous post) then I know I'll be fine.

 

[1RUSTYRIG]

If I ever do this dive, I would question the dive op and find out their policies and make sure they were sensible before getting on the boat.

You should question a dive op about their policies and procedures EVERY time regardless of the dive. Its common sense.

The Blue Hole is a good starting point for divers to get deep water experience. The visibility is good, there isn't a current to contend with, and the deco stops are well stocked with additional air and regs (I guess this is dive op dependant).

 

[TheRedHead]

1rustyrig, this is outside of anything in my experience in the Caribbean (mostly Cozumel). I'm particular about my dive ops and I always question their policies. However, I am surprised that any dive op would take a new diver on a deco dive. I think relying on a deco platform is risky, particularly with divers who have never used one. I prefer to bring my deco gas with me.

 

[1RUSTYRIG]

However, I am surprised that any dive op would take a new diver on a deco dive. I think relying on a deco platform is risky, particularly with divers who have never used one. I prefer to bring my deco gas with me.

Our entire sport is risky!

How is a deco platform risky to a diver who has never used one? It is almost like buddy breathing (taught in basic OW) without the short leash of the buddy.

Lets take a look at a couple things from the thread starter:

1) All this information is second hand

2) The title is "forced descent" which, last time I checked, is impossible unless you are tied to the anchor when it goes over.

3) The divers were "experienced" yet question the boat ride time.

4) Being told to return to the boat if you cannot "get down" in the required time window isn't out of the ordinary but it appears everyone involved was "shocked" by this.

I highly doubt that they were told to go "straight down" to 135 feet. Everyone I talked to indicated they got the same treatment at the Blue Hole as I did when diving with Amigos Del Mar: Exit the boat into roughly 25' and group up to begin the descent to 135. If during the descent you cannot equalize you need to return to the boat. This is A) common sense for this kind of dive and B) common courtesy to your fellow divers so you don't ruin their dive.