Question First CCR question

[JMBL]

Is it not a double Liberty?!

You may be right, I haven't read again the article about the latest Font Estramar dive.

 

[JMBL]

When diving your Triton, do you use a backmounted diluent or just sidemount? I suppose it varies according to the type of dive -- after all, you have the choice

Right, it's always BM, because it's what I know best. I'm not SM trained yet, and don't plan it in the near future, I prefer building up experience with my machine.

 

[happy-diver]

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Equipment – Wrecked in my rEvo

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[stuartv]

Sorry, but diving a CM CCR (Triton), I will agree to disagree. I'd say carrying my rebreather is easier than any BM unit, just like a handbag, even on a inflatable boat, cluttered with diving equipment, I can keep it in my lap, without getting angry stares from buddies (try that with an AP Inspiration or a Revo). As far as clutter is concerned, I find dividing equipment between back and chest is must more convenient and comfortable.

Definitely agree to disagree.

I dive a rEvo and a Choptima, depending on what I'm doing. I'm wider than either one, so I don't notice getting angry stares from people on a boat when I'm diving my rEvo. If I'm sitting on the side of a boat, waiting to backroll off, why would it bother anyone else if I have my rEvo on my back versus a CM on my front?

If it's a recreational dive, I'll just have one AL40 of BO, side mounted, on my rEvo, or 2 x LP50 of dilout sidemounted on my CM. So, not especially wide, whether rEvo or CM. And if it's a technical dive, everybody will have multiple cylinders and nobody is going to look twice at my rEvo.

Just curious: Are you certified on other units besides the Triton? If so, what and how many hours on them? If it's many, just pick the top one or two back mount units.

In my experience, a guy diving an Inspiration won't dive a Revo, or any other rig and the reverse is true also.

That is definitely not my experience. I've been diving a rEvo for 5 years. I got a Choptima and added that to what I dive 1 year ago. I'm also working on a crossover to the Meg. Not because I think I want to change to Meg, but because I want to experience other units. I don't plan to ditch rEvo for Meg, but I'm also not closed-minded to it, either. And, several of my Meg friends are lined up for me to cross them over to the rEvo, so they can do the same thing - get experience on a unit they have not dived before. Several of them also dive multiple types of units.

Really, I don't think I personally know any CCR divers that simply would not dive another unit if they had the opportunity.

 

[stuartv]

I'm considering my first CCR whether is it BM or CM (choptima). My question is the scrubber size I see the choptima is 2.2kg and some BM units have bigger size. Does size matters? I can imagine it's related to the duration. What else? Tks

Yes, size matters. Bigger scrubbers allow longer dives.

If your intention is to proceed as rapidly as a good, safe training regimen allows to doing expedition-level cave dives, then *maybe* a Choptima scrubber is not big enough for your end goal. In that case, you might want to start with something that has the option to let you use a bigger scrubber.

However, unless you are already doing expedition-level cave dives on OC, then I don't think scrubber size/duration should be a factor in your first CCR purchase. It will be a WHILE before you get to doing those kind of dives. Meanwhile, anything on the market will have adequate duration for you. And, as @kensuf already pointed out, a bigger scrubber means you're likely going to just waste more sorb.

I think it is wise to regard your very first CCR as your "starter CCR". It is the unit you buy to learn to dive CCR, including learning what you like and don't like, so that your next CCR is just right for you. If you get really lucky, your first CCR might turn out to be your "forever CCR". But, better for that to be a nice surprise than to be disappointed because you EXPECTED your first CCR to be the one for you forever, and then you learn that it is not.

 

[Wibble]

Right, it's always BM, because it's what I know best. I'm not SM trained yet, and don't plan it in the near future, I prefer building up experience with my machine.

The Triton would certainly makes a good travel machine

Standard BP+wing, standard longhose+backup reg, clip on a rebreather et voila! Only trouble is sourcing the oxygen and lime, plus somehow bringing the small oxygen cylinder on a plane and through customs.

 

[JMBL]

The Triton would certainly makes a good travel machine

Right on the button ! Designed especially for travelling, even a page on the subject on the manufacturer website.

 

[JMBL]

Definitely agree to disagree.

I dive a rEvo and a Choptima, depending on what I'm doing. I'm wider than either one, so I don't notice getting angry stares from people on a boat when I'm diving my rEvo. If I'm sitting on the side of a boat, waiting to backroll off, why would it bother anyone else if I have my rEvo on my back versus a CM on my front?

If it's a recreational dive, I'll just have one AL40 of BO, side mounted, on my rEvo, or 2 x LP50 of dilout sidemounted on my CM. So, not especially wide, whether rEvo or CM. And if it's a technical dive, everybody will have multiple cylinders and nobody is going to look twice at my rEvo.

Well, as I've already stated : choosing a rebreather is a highly personal matter, and experiences vary from a diver to another. I dive in France mainly, habits are different there, especially as far as rebreathers are concerned : fewer units, fewer models (compulsory to be CE compliant), still regarded as "weird contraptions" by many divers, even pros. This situation must account for a part of my opinion and feeling at least.

Just curious: Are you certified on other units besides the Triton? If so, what and how many hours on them? If it's many, just pick the top one or two back mount units.

No, not certified on any other unit. My available diving time is way too limited for that, so is my bank account, and the number of rebreather friendly dive centers as well. In such a context, it wouldn't make any sense.

I've been interested in rebreathers for years, before I took the plunge. Tried several : Meg, Inspi, Revo, but none were right for me. Tried the Triton just for the fun of it, and it clicked. It's the right unit for me, but maybe not for you, as I've already stated.

Really, I don't think I personally know any CCR divers that simply would not dive another unit if they had the opportunity.

Diving several different CCR means you have to master different procedure, it's interesting, but time and money consuming, I fear it's opportunity limitatting.

 

[gordonscuba]

Really, I don't think I personally know any CCR divers that simply would not dive another unit if they had the opportunity.

Agree -- most if not all of the really advanced CCR instructors and/or folks using them for exploration have significant experience on several different models of rebreather. It's not uncommon for a CCR instructor to be certified to dive on 6 - 8 different models, and certified to teach 2 - 4 of them. I believe GUE has standardized on the JJ, but the instructors are free to try whatever they want in their spare time. I've accepted the reality that if you love rebreathers, you'll probably go through a series of them, but it's considered good practice to pick any solid unit as your first, and put in the work to get super comfortable with it before moving on.

Among the most popular technical BM eCCRs, there seems to be a standard configuration that you see over and over. Specifically, among the JJ, Inspo, Meg, Prism2, X-CCR, they tend to use Shearwater electronics with Petrel controller, three galvanic O2 sensors, a large cylindrical scrubber in the center packed with Sofnolime 797, oxygen and dil bottles on the sides, and the attachment to your body is by two large bolts 11 inches apart onto a completely standard backplate / harness. The O2 sensors are exactly the same, analytical industries 'R-22D' type with Molex 3-pin connector. The breathing loops are usually similar too: thick corrugated hose leading to DSV or BOV, with minor differences like how many valves or dumps are present in the counterlungs, whether to use oetiker clamps or regular clamps. The inspo uses dual proprietary controllers: the vision system, as opposed to Shearwater.

Then there are the more innovative units... rEvo is just a really clever design all the way around. I haven't dived it, but based on reading the manual and watching teardown videos, I have to say I really like the scrubber / counterlung design on the revo. Liberty has highly redundant and fault-tolerant electronics, and can make use of helium sensors once you graduate to trimix dil -- the computer can calculate the oxygen content based on the measured helium concentration and decide which of the oxygen sensors is in working order, which is pretty cool.

 

[evandroairton]

Agree -- most if not all of the really advanced CCR instructors and/or folks using them for exploration have significant experience on several different models of rebreather. It's not uncommon for a CCR instructor to be certified to dive on 6 - 8 different models, and certified to teach 2 - 4 of them. I believe GUE has standardized on the JJ, but the instructors are free to try whatever they want in their spare time. I've accepted the reality that if you love rebreathers, you'll probably go through a series of them, but it's considered good practice to pick any solid unit as your first, and put in the work to get super comfortable with it before moving on.

Among the most popular technical BM eCCRs, there seems to be a standard configuration that you see over and over. Specifically, among the JJ, Inspo, Meg, Prism2, X-CCR, they tend to use Shearwater electronics with Petrel controller, three galvanic O2 sensors, a large cylindrical scrubber in the center packed with Sofnolime 797, oxygen and dil bottles on the sides, and the attachment to your body is by two large bolts 11 inches apart onto a completely standard backplate / harness. The O2 sensors are exactly the same, analytical industries 'R-22D' type with Molex 3-pin connector. The breathing loops are usually similar too: thick corrugated hose leading to DSV or BOV, with minor differences like how many valves or dumps are present in the counterlungs, whether to use oetiker clamps or regular clamps.

Then there are the more innovative units... rEvo is just a really clever design all the way around. I haven't dived it, but based on reading the manual and watching teardown videos, I have to say I really like the scrubber / counterlung design on the revo. Liberty has highly redundant and fault-tolerant electronics, and can make use of helium sensors once you graduate to trimix dil -- the computer can calculate the oxygen content based on the measured helium concentration and decide which of the oxygen sensors is in working order, which is pretty cool.

Just to get clear the inspo use dual proprietary controllers: the vision system