Fire on dive boat Conception in CA

[Scuba-74]

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A ScubaBoard Staff Message...

It is always best to read an entire thread before commenting but due to the length of this one we are providing a summary for topics already covered.

The following has been established as credible based on information provided by people with experience as qualified mariners or experience on the Conception and similar boats. While we believe this information is credible it can not be established as proven facts prior to the completion of the investigation.

Conception was found compliant with USCG requirements on her last inspection which implies
Approved fire alarms
Approved fire fighting equipment
Escape routes met current standards

Nitrox system was a Membrane system
Only O2 on board would be in First aid tanks or stage bottles. All tanks were aft and aft was last to burn

One body remains missing
4 bodies were found floating shortly after the sinking. All bodies will be identified by DNA.

There was an anchor watch normally posted in the wheelhouse. People from previous trips have reported meeting the "watchman" at various times during nocturnal trips to the head etc
There were no locked doors to the galley, salon or berth area.

It has been reported that at about 2:30 crew member finished up in the galley verifying all heating elements were out and cold etc. Then went upstairs.
Between 3 and 3:14, a crew member awoke hearing a bang. Thinking someone had fallen went to go down but stairs already afire.
The Captain first Mayday from the Bridge documented at 3:14am.
Captain last to leave with so much smoke around him crew thought he was on fire
Another Mayday call was made from the Grape Escape.. The calls have been linked together causing confusion

5 crew members were in the wheelhouse two levels above the berth area. One crew member was in the berth below and did not survive.
The crew tried to reach the passengers from both doors to the galley and from forward front windows. They were driven back by the fire (some were injured in the attempt)
Forced from the boat by the fire they swam aft to the dingy, sought help from the nearby boat. The Captain returned to look for others with no success.

There has been suggestions from many sources the fire could be related to charging batteries either in the Galley or possibly berth area
It has been established that electrical fires are often a factor in boat fires

Safety briefs were regularly conducted at the first opportunity when all on board were available normally the first morning of the trip

The above topics have been covered extensively. Please refer back in the thread for those discussions.

Discussion of legal aspects should be made here Legal considerations for the Fire on dive boat Conception in CA

Condolences posted here Santa Cruz Dive Boat Fire Incident Condolences

Donations here Dive Boat Conception Missing Divers Relief Fund

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I'm glad that this post has been written, as it does summarize a lot of discussion points in this thread very well.

I can't help but notice, however, that it leaves out the entire discussion on the configuration of the egress routes. It is a fact that was established in this thread, that the only emergency escape hatch was a square whole in the ceiling compartment straddling two 3-level bunks, slightly larger than 2x2', the fact that investigating authorities were "taken aback" by. It is a fact that in case of fire or flooding up to 46 people were expected to exit either through that hatch, or through the narrow staircase leading to the front of the galley, requiring them to travel the full length of the galley back to get to the open deck, or shutter the windows in the front.

These facts may not be known to readers/posters who didn't have time to read the entire thread, and who I believe are the intended audience of this summary.

Also, not a fact directly related to the accident per se, but a fact nevertheless: USCG requirements currently lack specific measurable metrics that would remove subjectivity from the inspection process. Specifically, the time required to evacuate all passengers, and the "easiness" of access to exits are not defined in the code, leaving it to the inspecting officer to subjectively interpret very vague verbiage.

I'm not pointing it out simply because I believe the design of egress routes is one of the biggest contributing factors here, which I absolutely do, but because there was a lot of extremely useful info in this thread such as pictures, videos, and deck layouts of the Conception, as well as links to relevant sections of the USCG code.

 

[ijdod]

If you read some of the reports, the first 4 bodies they found, on Monday, floated up from the boat when it sank, so I do not think anyone jumped off the boat except the 5 crew. It sounds like everyone perished on the boat. I am anxious to read a complete summary of events, on this thread they are pieced together by reading all these posts.

That was about the surviving crew, and a reported sequence of events.

 

[cerich]

3 thoughts I'm wondering about now:
- was there no fire extinguishers available at the top deck for the crew to use? Nothing's mentioned so far in all the interviews with them that they did use any to clear the way down to dive deck instead of jumping and then trying to clear at least the short distance from the galley door to escape hatch

fire extinguishers only work on small fires, an engulfed stairway would likely be too much for an extinguisher. The short distance to the escape hatch in an engulfed space, even if "cleared" of fire, the second you stop clearing it, will fill back in with fire. Even with a 2" hose on a main

 

[DavidFL]

short distance to the escape hatch in an engulfed space, even if "cleared" of fire, the second you stop clearing it, will fill back in with fire. Even with a 2" hose on a main

And this fire 'reflashed' repeatedly after Coast Guard first put it out, even with all that water from 5" (?) hoses on fire fighting boats.

 

[S R]

It sounds plausible that passengers may have never woken up ( I hope so ). If my memories from nights on the Vision are correct, each bunk had a vent. I think this has been mentioned 3 times already but with no discussion. Does anyone know where the intake for this ventilation system was? Might it be worth looking at integrating smoke/CO detectors into this ventilation system?

 

[Steelyeyes]

I'm having some issues picturing this. The stairway from the top deck is at the rear, as is the main entrance to the salon ("double door"). If that stairway and the salon entrance is already engulfed in flames, how would you be able to jump down? Especially given that the middle of the dive deck isn't clear (engineroom cover, etc), and wind blowing front-to-back at anchor. I'm wondering if some things were 'lost in translation' in this report, as it were. The earlier reports of the crew jumping overboard, swimming to the back make more sense.



Yes. One of the main problems is that you typically do not really know how and when a cell was made. A of of cells are rebranded, even by reputable vendors, and popular (and/or reputedly trustworthy) cell brands are commonly forged. Basically, think all the worst rumours of Chinese manufactoring, unfortunately.

Since one crewman had a broken leg and another had a twisted or sprained ankle I'd think that they didn't get that from jumping into water.

 

[Bob DBF]

To me it doesn't add up - it was a dark night and foggy, how would you not spot a blazing inferno under you from the top deck, regardless if which direction you were looking? Especially wit the fog that would light up all around the boat.

As one member commented, the boat is well lighted, except for the bear thing area. Also the boat is anchored into the weather, which means any breeze is going fore to aft, moving any smoke aft, away from the wheelhouse.

In addition, the wheelhouse is made for viability foward and to the sides. The view of the lounge / galley is the overhead (roof). The skipper has to go out of the wheelhouse to see the side of the boat, fore to aft, when docking

So to see the flames, the fire would have to blow out the lounge / galley windows, which means it would be fully engulfed.

The nighttime pictures of the burning boat did not show thick mist, although this may have been different when the fire started

Mist and light fog will not be seen on night vision equipment which I saw in the first news video. Also a large light source like a big fire will easily be seen through mist without recording the mist or fog.

All that electrical gear could go up but the table and the curtains shouldn't continue to burn once the flame has died down

It's a matter of time and intensity how long it takes a non-metal table to burn. My concern would be whether it would fire the Fiberglas and the electrical draw on the circuit. If the braaker did not trip and the electrical draw was high enough to start a fire in the wire run.

I would think that should be called "Adding insult to injury." Legal, but outrageous!

The insurance company is making this claim, not Truth Aquatics. Read the thread!

Unfortunately the legal system works on a different schedule, and without the empathy and compassion for the individuals involved, sometimes that is a good thing, regardless of how it looks to those involved, and concerned parties.

The crew of this boat did everything humanly possible to save lives.

That is the impression I got from that crew and crews on other SoCal dive boats I have gone out on. Having spent time at sea, I know how a professional crew should work, and I look for that because my life may depend on how well they do their job, and keep their boat. I have been pleasantly supprised, and impressed, by the professionalism of the crews of all the SoCal boats I have used.

And this fire 'reflashed' repeatedly after Coast Guard first put it out, even with all that water from 5" (?) hoses on fire fighting boats.

And ultimately sank it. I did not see or hear if was still burning or re-igniting when it sank.




Bob

 

[markmud]

fire extinguishers only work on small fires, an engulfed stairway would likely be too much for an extinguisher. The short distance to the escape hatch in an engulfed space, even if "cleared" of fire, the second you stop clearing it, will fill back in with fire. Even with a 2" hose on a main

Hi cerich,

Your post is right-on. I hope people read it again. Which is why an anchor watch/fire watch person needs to take their job so seriously. Minutes count. Once the fire had reached a conflagration point, there really wasn't anything that anyone could do.

During the daytime, a battery fire would probably be dealt with in a few moments. Wookie has written that he occasionally disposed of smoldering or burning batteries overboard.

Here is what I would think if I witnessed Wookie chucking a smoldering/burning battery overboard:

"No big deal, it is done, nothing to see here".

"Whew...thank God the smoking battery issue is resolved...could you pass me The Macalan Scotch...after that near miss I am done diving for the day" (TA boats are BYOB)

As someone opined in an earlier post, boats like this have a "boatload" of ignition sources. And the boat is full of fuels, including the upholstery and hull material.

Does your clothing meet the flame-out test that Diving Dubai mentioned that the Fire Martial performed on his stage gear and costumes?

Your belongings add to the fuel load.

Minutes count.

markm

 

[ijdod]

Mist and light fog will not be seen on night vision equipment which I saw in the first news video. Also a large light source like a big fire will easily be seen through mist without recording the mist or fog.

I was referring to the pictures taking by the fire fighters and other responding ships, such as this one. There's a couple like that. There are of course many reasons why fog would or would not show, it's just that this does not strike me as particularly foggy; given that the question is if a crewman should have been able to see the fire in the fog.

Hi cerich,

Your post is right-on. I hope people read it again. Which is why an anchor watch/fire watch person needs to take their job so seriously. Minutes count. Once the fire had reached a conflagration point, there really wasn't anything that anyone could do.

Question what the role of the person awake is. And if that is actually firewatch, where I fully agree minutes count, why would a decentralized smoke alarm be sufficient? suspect the watch is not a firewatch in the very strict sense of the word.

 

[Akimbo]

Does anyone know where the intake for this ventilation system was? Might it be worth looking at integrating smoke/CO detectors into this ventilation system?

Ventilation was touched on in this post:
Fire on dive boat Conception in CA, Post #1129

Related but not directly in response the the quote above:
CO has been mentioned several times as being undetectable (without sensors), which is true. However, there would be so many other noxious fumes mixed in with the CO on a vessel fire that it is unlikely that the odors and smoke would not wake most people up due to coughing. Caustic fumes are even generated on all-metal combat vessels with minimal habitability combustibles such as upholstery, carpet, false overheads, and wood trim and paneling.

Outgassing in a fire is a huge human safety problem with only marginal practical solutions. This applies to every fire, not just on boats.