Feb 19 2017 Cozumel diving fatality

[Brianh1]

I stand corrected if the couple who found her said she had half a tank then she had half a tank. That couple were clearly very upset and in my opinion were the only people who did everything right that day. They found the diver, tried to help but could not reconnect her bcd inflator and so surfaced immediately to get help.
The last boat to arrive on scene was the deceased's boat some minutes after she had been located from the surface by one of our divemasters.

 

[boulderjohn]

Let's not be too quick to make any judgments on her air supply. Here's what we have so far:

1. We have the statement of a witness who said it happened near the end of the dive, he did not see the signal that preceded the ascent, but he assumed it was a low on air situation because the ascent followed the protocol discussed prior to the dive, they were near the end of the dive, and the rest of the group ascended shortly after.

2. We have the statement from someone else near the scene who was told that she had ascended because she was low on air.

3. We have the statement from the person who found her that "she had a half tank of air." I do not believe that statement was meant to be precise, and I hope we can get a more precise response before continuing along this line of thought.

 

[Bob DBF]

Just to reinforce what Boulder John just said, we ferried the rest of the deceased's party to shore and one of them said she surfaced because she was short on air

Was this just an assumption? I got that idea through reading the the thread, and the fact that she ascended alone, that she had no buddy.


Bob

 

[Brianh1]

Boulderjohn,
From your para 1, he was a she, one of two young ladies who was diving with the lost diver, para 2 the witness may have been me as I reported what I was told by the witness in 1. Para 3 comes from the couple who found the lost diver and her expression from memory was "plenty air ". Whether this was 1500 or 750 lbs does not really matter.

Bob BDF, she had no buddy, from the group on the boat, one couple dived with a divemaster and the group of three dived elsewhere with a second divemaster. Whether short on air or feelng unwell was the reason, she surfaced alone (or part way with the divemaster) and then alone. No-one will ever know what happened next as the local aurhorities are keen to make it a stroke or the bends.
If the deceased were a UK citizen and there was any suspicion of an unlawful death there would probably be a UK inquest. This has recently happened in the cases of several tourists killed by terrorists in Tunisia.

 

[ChrisM]

In this particular case the victim's inflator hose fittings apparently didn't match. I suppose one could try to oral-inflate her BC...

Ok, so in all this, after reading 28 pages, I have this question.
The diver had her weights on when found. She hadn't run out of air, but was unresponsive with her regulator out of her mouth.
The divers that found her couldn't safely get her to the surface. I had read on we that if possible, removing the victim's weights would have made the job easy(ier). But would there have been a risk of an uncontrolled ascent at any point?
What would be the correct procedure, for getting this diver to the surface, given the conditions?
I am looking to learn.
One of my friends actually lost her husband off Long Island in a similar situation. But I think the fellow who found him was able to bring him up and there was a fixed line, not a free ascent.

Please (said with sincerity) do yourself and your dive buddies a favor, and take Rescue. IMO other than OW it's the most useful cert there is.

You can't really learn how to do this on a message board. There will be a lot going on, beginning with the fact that it's a highly stressful situation that will only add to the task overloading. You have to deal with keeping someone else more or less neutrally buoyant, as well as your own buoyancy, meaning you've got one hand on them, one hand on their regulator, one hand available to dump air from your own BC, one hand to dump air from theirs (although here it would not have been an issue), one hand to watch your gauges... you may have picked up on the conundrum by now. It's a highly task loaded situation that you (we all ) need to learn how to do

At it's core, the most important rule is do not make the situation worse, i.e. don't make yourself now a victim due to a rescue attempt. Here, given what ravenware found, they dd the right thing IMO

 

[Dan]

I'm going to distribute weight and position my tank for best trim while diving, not for best floating on the surface... YMMV.

I don't have any problem going horizontal, vertical, or upside down underwater. My problem is to be able to float face up without finning at the surface. Fortunately, by distributing the weight & position the tank properly, the problem is solved. It is a lot easier to put myself to whichever position underwater when I'm neutrally buoyant.

 

[AdivingBel]

I don't have any problem going horizontal, vertical, or upside down underwater. My problem is to be able to float face up without finning at the surface.

Ok...if you've found the magic configuration that makes your head bob straight up or float face up while unconscious on the surface and allows for horizontal trim while diving, that's great . While I haven't tried it, my guess is it would make me substantially feet heavy or try to turtle face up. When I'm on the surface, I put a little air in my wing and lay back like I'm sitting in a lazy boy. Not particularly stressful, but probably wouldn't maintain that position if unconscious. Just saying I wouldn't compromise my facility underwater during a dive (where I'll spend most of my time and the main reason for diving) for an unlikely scenario on the surface.

 

[dmaziuk]

I don't have any problem going horizontal, vertical, or upside down underwater. My problem is to be able to float face up without finning at the surface. Fortunately, by distributing the weight & position the tank properly, the problem is solved. It is a lot easier to put myself to whichever position underwater when I'm neutrally buoyant.

I think if you're serious about it, you have to dive in a horse collar: it's the only thing that will keep you chest-up and has an air bubble at the back of your head.

I have no problem floating with my mouth above water without finning in my bp&w. Or out of it. I doubt that's going to work quite the same way if I'm unconscious, though. And of course every bcd has "this is not a life saving device" printed in large bold letters all over the fine manual.

 

[MMM]

I don't know what the rules are like in Mexico, but my reading of many DAN reports over the years leads me to believe that absent any sign of foul play in a case like this, there is often a ruling of a likely heart attack and no further investigation, meaning no autopsy.

If it can be believed - and that's a big IF - the translated media story says that an autopsy was to be conducted. Might or might not be true, might or might not be an accurate translation.

 

[Dan]

I think if you're serious about it, you have to dive in a horse collar: it's the only thing that will keep you chest-up and has an air bubble at the back of your head.

I have no problem floating with my mouth above water without finning in my bp&w. Or out of it. I doubt that's going to work quite the same way if I'm unconscious, though. And of course every bcd has "this is not a life saving device" printed in large bold letters all over the fine manual.

I'm serious. I noticed tank position & whether it is empty or full affect my position while floating on the surface. I did an experiment with empty tank (700 psig air pressure left in AL80) position on my BCD. If I strap the tank higher to where the 1st stage regulator closed to the back of my head, I'll end up facing down when I'm just bobbing on the surface without finning like an unconscious diver. If I strap the tank lower to where the 1st stage regulator about the same level as the base of my neck, I'll end up bobbing face up on the surface without finning, which is kind of nice & relaxing when you need to wait for RIB or skiff or panga to come & get you. All of these experiments were with my BCD fully inflated of course.

I think it has to do with where the center of gravity of me with my gears is. It needs to be slight below the waist towards my rear end, not higher, which can make me to be top heavy & ending up with face down when I'm unconscious.