Faking Logbook Entries Fact or Fiction?

[Solitude Diver]

I didn’t see Mike’s post before mine posted. I repeated some of the info, but have to agree 100%.

Story smells a little fishy (no pun intended) without reading all of the details.

 

[MikeFerrara]

I acutally have a subscription and bashing wasn't my intent at all. I realize, of course, that "Lessons for Life," are archetypes of everyday incidents. This one was particularly intriguing because it involed an elaborate ruse combined with a less than ideal instructor and technical diving. Christoper Mulrley, as Charle pointed out, is a real life example of a similar incident and perhaps was the inspiration for the article.

I don't know if Murley is really an example. I think he died of a heart attack on the surface prior to starting a dive after having made at least one successful dive down to the wreck. He wasn't feeling well, got in the water anyway and died, as I remember. I've met the instructor a few times so while the court case was going on there was lots of scuttle but floating around about it and Joe was always whining about all of it. But hey! I'll bet he got the student to pay for that expensive trip out to the Doria!

 

[Sasquatch]

Well, I will say that this diver seems determined. That must have been a lot of work and wasted time just to take a tech course. Maybe he had a terminal disease and just didn't have the time to spare.

Unfortunately it just shows another person trying to beat the system. How will he feel when he actually dives the dives he faked? Will he feel he's that much more experienced or will the dishonest dives taint his accomplishment? Also, what other shortcuts does he take in his life with this being an example of his style?

 

[DavidPT40]

I don't keep a log book, too much trouble.

 

[Doc Intrepid]

Unfortunately, a friend of mine who I took my DM course with only has 12 dives.
I tried to convince him that he needed the actual experience and it's more than just getting a stupid piece of plastic afterwards but he didn't really care.
Throughout the course however, I was surprised that he could perform the skills without any difficulty and at the same level everyone else did. The fact that he could do this took away any advice I gave him - he told me me why should he need 60 dives if he could do everything right?
His logbook wasn't elaborately faked, in fact, I'm pretty sure anyone who actually attempted to read through it would realize that it's all fake - in his "60 dives" he only has 3 buddies, one colour ink no instructor or dive operator signatures or stamps.
Is there anything I would tell this guy before something terrible happens to him?

Tell him not to accept a position as a working Divemaster for awhile.

Skills are like tools in a tool box. You select which tool you need to fit the requirements of the emergency situation.

Most people can perform skills reasonably well in a classroom environment, regardless of their experience in the water. Using the tools isn't, in itself, challenging.

Responding to emergencies underwater, however, is 98% mental. Its about your situational awareness, your alertness to the tiny stressors that are building up both in yourself and others, and your capacity to shut down panic and calmly think your way out of a potential tragedy when something occurs in spite of your best efforts. If you have one hand full of struggling diver, your light goes out, your mask is kicked off, and you're trying to bring both of you to the surface from great depth, it is the cumulative task loading that eventually can overwhelm the experience level of the responder. Here is where your friend's lack of experience will impact on his performance.

Here is where your friend with 12 dives and a DM cert may find himself unequal to the task loading. Just giving someone tools, even tools they can use in calm circumstances, doesn't make them a master mechanic when the world suddenly goes to crap. Only experience and comfort in the water allow that sort of professional response, and with only 12 dives your DM buddy is going to be short in that department for quite awhile yet.

Better he's not functioning as a working DM while he gains that experience.

Best,

Doc

 

[fairybasslet]

OK Sunshine, I think you need a dive.

"Every month"? "Every time"? You got a few superlatives going on here, referring to threads I don't recall (I remember one). Who is the "you" you're referring to, and the "some people" and the "know-it-alls"?

I re-read the first post and can't find the connection. ??

So, you taking me diving then? OK, maybe you're right. Maybe it was only one OTHER thread bashing SD's lessons for life saying it couldn't possible be true. The fact that the poster said "Has anyone ever heard of this happening in real life?" and LFL are supposed to be culled from real life, led me to believe she was questiioning the magazine's veracity. It's not the first time I've seen it done here. Probably not the last time either. It's become the cool thing to do, even on their own message board. :07:

Now you want to hear a real coincidence? I'm listening to a podcast from bottom time radio right now and they are talking about faking log books.

 

[Doc Intrepid]

I acutally have a subscription and bashing wasn't my intent at all. I realize, of course, that "Lessons for Life," are archetypes of everyday incidents. This one was particularly intriguing because it involed an elaborate ruse combined with a less than ideal instructor and technical diving. Christoper Mulrley, as Charle pointed out, is a real life example of a similar incident and perhaps was the inspiration for the article.

Hi Red,

Mike Ange writes those "lessons for life" articles. Mike's been around since Christ was a Corporal, he's well-known throughout the industry. His articles are based on actual incidents. If you contact him, he'll be able to provide citations regarding the news articles, police reports, and other public sources he used. Mike has far too much of his reputation on the line to misrepresent the facts.

Like the reality TV shows have demonstrated, real life is adequately filled with enough morons that Mike (or anyone else) has no need to fictionalize anything or use archetypes of incidents. With the number of potential Darwin Award winners available to pick from out there, I suspect its quite the opposite - Mike has more material than he knows what to do with.

And no, it isn't too much of a stretch to accept that lying is pretty common in log books. Sadly, I suspect lying is pretty common anytime people receive respect or acclaim for having done anything numerous times.

YMMV,

Doc

 

[Web Monkey]

There's only so far you can go to protect someone from their own stupidity.

If anybody wants to fake dives so they can go do something they're not qualified for, Darwin is always waiting to remove them from the gene pool.

Terry

I'm at the office this afternoon and I'm perusing my new copy of Scuba Diving magazine. In the section about all the bad things that can happen to unaware divers, "Lessons for Life," there is an article about an AOW diver who supposedly had 11 dives when he started on the Road to Deception and Despair.

He faked 89 dives in his logbook by using different colored inks as well as strategic coffee stains and spaghetti sauce dripping on pages so that he could take a technical diving course.

It just SO HAPPENED that his clueless instructor decided that since 150 feet was ok for this course, then 180 would be even better so the diver with the faked log book experiences a Deep Water Blackout and lives.

Has anyone ever heard of anything like this happening in real life?

 

[ghostdiver1957]

Logbooks - in my opinion - are worthless. They are easy to fake (write anything you want in them.) Fictional books are written this way. Only a true idiot would look at a persons logbook and take everything in it for granted... but that is just a sad commentary on how ill our society is.

Logbooks - in my opinion - are used by very few real divers. Newbies use them because they are taught to use them... and generally use them until they reach whatever level of certification they are trying to obtain. Once they obtain that level... they stop using them and just go diving... for many that is somewhere between 100 - 250 dives logged. The next most common person carrying a logbook is the faker. The person who sits at home and fills the book with all kinds of crap they've never done... then they use it to progress faster then they should be - or better yet - just to show people how awesome they are. Of course there are exceptions to this rule.. as I know a handful of guys that have been diving 15 - 20 years and they still write things down... but not in the type of logbook you get when you start diving... they're more like notebooks or three-ring binders full of cool stuff. Most don't carry them out diving... but if you stop by their house - you can get in some good reading.

But most real divers have stopped logging stuff long ago... it just takes away from the diving. The proof they were there was the photos or videos they took and they long ago stopped keeping track of depth, time, remaining PSI etc... because they know how deep they can go and for how long without any damn logbook - or even a computer or dive watch for that matter.

I have personally done more than 1200 dives... but you'll only find about 200 in my logbook. I have never once been asked by an operator to see my logbook... so why bother with it. My memories are logged in my mind... in photos and video... and I can honestly say, I have never went back and read my logbook in the last nine years...

My hope is that the fakers who end up in above their head get exactly what they deserve... what comes around goes around... might sound harsh... but that's life.

 

[Solitude Diver]

Not a lot can be done to stop it. It isn’t just log books either. Divers fake medical histories and doctor’s permission sheets as well in order to dive. Chris Murley was an example of both of these.

Although Chris Murley died at the surface (report said drowning, but was likely initiated by heart problems), he had also not informed anyone that he had diabetes, and was prone to collapses and physical problems due to his obesity. His medical problems, and lack of experience (both of which he lied) caused him to have initial problems due to health, and then he went into panic mode due to lack of experience, and could not remember to fill his bc at surface. While flailing about at surface and screaming for help, others had to inflate bc and get him to boat by which time he had already inhaled water and drowned.

The bottom line is people can and will lie to do what they want. All an instructor can do is reasonably use their judgment, and if they suspect something is wrong, refuse to take the student, or check it out further. Unfortunately many let money dissuade them from this. Mike was correct, in that Murley’s instructor had refused to certify him for tri-mix, and let him dive the Doria because he did not feel he was ready. It was only after begging and finally offering to pay for the instructors’ trip that the instructor agreed to let him use the Doria as a final check out dive. (Go figure….he wouldn’t certify Chris in warm water diving in Florida, but agreed to take him 100 miles off shore to the North, in cold water, and try it there?). His faked experience, faked medical history, and bribe to the instructor who did not think he was ready, got him killed.