Ethics in Spearfishing

[Wayward Son]

I hunt both ways, but in this area it's mostly on scuba. I look at it this way:

If you don't want to hunt on scuba, then don't. I will likewise make the choices that best suit my needs & the conditions at hand.

What I don't need & really won't put up with is your attitude towards me, if you choose to cop one. You hunt to suit you. I'll hunt to suit me. If you don't like the way I hunt, great. Don't hunt with me.

There is something fundamentally flawed with human nature. Far too many people just can't be content with their own choices, they have to try to force them on others, whether the others want them or not.

 

[magicwanz]

Hunting doesn't have to do with whether you can do it holding your breath. I know, I've hunted. Plenty.

Really??? You have hunted "plenty"???

I guess our definition of "plenty" is much different.

According to one of your previous posts, you have NEVER hunted "fish that actually swim around".

Hunting fish that actually swim around (sometimes quickly) could be much harder to manage, but seeing as I haven't tried, I don't have anything useful to add.

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/dir/202350-dir-spearfishing.html

I think it is pretty clear at this juncture that you will not have anything useful to add.
Thanks for your posts in the Underwater Hunting forum.

 

[sermar]

I had spearfish in Italy (freediving) for many years and I have considered more as a passion than a sport.
Personally, I don’t find outrageous if anybody defined spearfishing as sport; what difference does it makes? Nothing!

In regards “ethics”, I don’t find anything wrong if the “kill” is for food (even giving to a friend or for selling), unless we are taking of idiots than shoot to anything that moves just for fun.

I have tried few times to spearfish with scuba and I don’t find it easy. The fish can hear you miles away, therefore I cannot see as an advantage.
Freediving of with scuba spearfishing requires skills and ability

Spear hunting for competition? Let’s face it, I don’t know any fisherman no matter if under or above the water that doesn’t brag for the own preys; a trophy to put above the fireplace or a framed picture in the office wall! And it is always few pounds bigger than it was and it always a show at anytime somebody say “fish”!
What is difference if a bunch of guys that decide to fish all in the same day? I never done any fishing competition (I am not that good) and for what I know the fish caught never go wasted.

A spearfisherman does way less “damage” that any other fishing activities. Spearfisherman choose the prey without involving any other organism.
This is not the same than other fishing practices that drags the bottom of the ocean killing anything to keep 40% and throwing the rest away.
If we are talking here about ethics for the “environment”, we should talk about other things.

I live in Ontario and spearfishing is illegal in any kind and forms. I grew up in Italy and spearfishing with scuba is illegal.
Why? I really don’t know. I am trying to stay with the law!

Sergio

 

[Wayward Son]

Laws are often passed for the simple reason that someone in the right position wants them, with no other rational reasoning behind them. When it comes to game laws it's not unusual at all for it to be a reflection of what someone with money wants. Nothing about the actual management of the resource, sustained use impact, anything that makes logical sense. Just someone who thinks there way is the best way & is in a position to make it happen.

 

[perdidochas]

just a really bad personal thing with me I guess... just could not help making the remark. I guess regulations make things ethical don't they? (sorry, couldn't help making that remark either)

In some places, such as the Florida Panhandle, the only fishable water is in the 80 ft depth range. The water around here doesn't have great visibility. Spearing while free diving only is impractical, and hence, spearing on scuba, IMHO, is ok. On the other hand, in the Florida Keys, where spearing can be done at much shallower depths, IMHO, spearing on scuba isn't ok.

 

[perdidochas]

Oh, and to those that think spearfishing (or hunting in general) is a sport, you're sick in the head. Sports require two sides both willing to engage. Shooting fish doesn't qualify. And I don't have anything against spearing for the sake of eating. But if you're getting off on the kill as opposed to the meal, seek help.

Part of human nature is predatory. If we didn't enjoy the hunt and the kill, we never would have survived. Watch any mammalian predator. They truly enjoy the hunt and kill (as they should). There is nothing wrong with enjoying the kill.

 

[Zieg]

I really don't care if people consider spearfishing a sport or not. To me that is just a game of semantics. But a thought hit me when I read your post Pat. You say you do not believe that spearfishing is a "sport" because hunting is not competitive. But alot of sports are competitions between the skills of competitors. Example, Shooting sports; rifle, pistol, skeet, and so on. They are not "shoot outs at the OK corral", but one person, comparing his skill against another. Isn't that what happens in a spearfishing tournament? Pat, don't you like "competiting" in spearfishing tournaments?

 

[Wayward Son]

I do on occasion take part in spearfishing tournaments. Speaking only for myself, I do not expect to be competitive in them. For me, it's an excuse to get together with a bunch of people, go diving with friends & have a great time. Other people, other reasons & I'm perfectly OK with that.

 

[Louis Rossignol]

I have been quiet on this way too long, but now that the recretional fishermen are fighting amongst themselves on whose ethical and whose not, I will come out of the closet.

Also, make no mistake about it, this is why I got removed from the Recreational Red Snapper Ad Hoc Committee. You guys have opened up the doors for the enviros. So you don't have me to help out in the fight for our fishing rights anymore, I hope some of you with all the "holyer than thou" opinions can do a better job or at least do something other than bitch.

I am a competition diver. I always shoot the largest fish in each category. In doing so, I have more than enough to eat with my incidental bycatch.

For instance, I'm faced with a 30lb. grouper, that will easily get bumped off the competition board or a 50lb. black drum which will hold on the competition board for all year, but it sucks to eat. The drum gets it.

I routinely let fish go that are great eating only to shoot undesirables because they are better for competition.

Now how about your morals. Focus all your effort on say, grouper. Won't they take a harder hit than if you expand your horizons to all fish, spread the categories is what I say.

Oh and since we all know what fish has stirred nation wide controversy, what do you think that fish, that is just about inedible, EATS? He eats Porgies.

HE EATS THE SAME THING AS YOUR PRECIOUS EDIBLES, etc. Grouper, Snapper, Amberjacks and Cobia which also eat porgies.

So in all essence that undesireable is in direct competition with the same fish that the NMFS is regulating so hard because they declair it overfished and the same fish many of you love to eat.

Witout spreading the categories, one day the oceans will be filled with only undesireables.

I'm sure you all know better than me, I've watched the Gulf's changes over the last 27 years, so I have very little experience, but some of the fish that people are pointing their fingers at me about I'm am seeing in record numbers.

And for those that don't think spearfishing is a sport, try shooting something bigger than a goldfish. We shoot large fish under dangerous oil platforms with plenty of current over a bottomless Gulf. We shoot the fish then hold onto a rope that is wrapped around our hand and fight the fish in this envoronment. There are plenty of times when the fish wins. I nearly lost my life during last years Hell Divers Rodeo. Would I shoot that 200lb. Warsaw grouper at 235fsw again? YES! That's the sport.


BTW, I also shoot deer, I only target the big ones with big antlers, it's called trophy hunting. That is what I do. If you don't like it KMA!!!

 

[Chad Carney]

I'm sure you all know better than me.

And for those that don't think spearfishing is a sport, try shooting something bigger than a goldfish. We shoot large fish under dangerous oil platforms with plenty of current over a bottomless Gulf. We shoot the fish then hold onto a rope that is wrapped around our hand and fight the fish in this envoronment. There are plenty of times when the fish wins. I nearly lost my life during last years Hell Divers Rodeo. Would I shoot that 200lb. Warsaw grouper at 235fsw again? YES! That's the sport.
That is what I do. If you don't like it KMA!!!

Well said Louie!

On another matter... do you have an opinion on the red snapper issue in the SBO this year?

There's some differring opinions being stated over on the other SB, and so far nothing from any rig divers. I'm wondering if it will take a toll on the participation from rig country?

Chad