Epic Lemon shark dive today on Emerald Charters +

[John from the burg]

Illegal feeding thought to be among reasons for Egypt's shark attack - Telegraph

http://www.google.com/hostednews/af...ocId=CNG.14a4e293d01a51c1733429bdd67c8378.cf1

Hardly conclusive but its something, I could show you pages and pages of info saying that the east coast of FL has more shark attacks than any other place in the world... Again, not conclusive, but totality of circumstance rings in my head, most shark dives + most people in the water = the most shark attacks. Cant blame it on dirty water or mistaken identity either, these are purposeful nips in the closest major metro to the "action".

The difference between spearos and shark dives is that a spearo will do everything in his power to get that fish on the boat. The guys that shoot off bulls are top tier divers who don't let fish go, they team dive with backup and rarely lose anything, especially not on purpose. When the bull circles around to get his cobia from us he doesn't get the fish, he gets a poke in the head from a big ass stick. The lesson that shark learned today was that a spearo doesn't mean free meal, it means a solid poke in the head. Hows that for conditioning? Will the highly evolved predator remember that poke? I think he will, I think the next diver he runs into will get a few extra feet of buffer.

 

[HalcyonDaze]

Illegal feeding thought to be among reasons for Egypt's shark attack - Telegraph

AFP: Egypt shark attack blamed on illegal feeding

Hardly conclusive but its something, I could show you pages and pages of info saying that the east coast of FL has more shark attacks than any other place in the world... Again, not conclusive, but totality of circumstance rings in my head, most shark dives + most people in the water = the most shark attacks. Cant blame it on dirty water or mistaken identity either, these are purposeful nips in the closest major metro to the "action".

The difference between spearos and shark dives is that a spearo will do everything in his power to get that fish on the boat. The guys that shoot off bulls are top tier divers who don't let fish go, they team dive with backup and rarely lose anything, especially not on purpose. When the bull circles around to get his cobia from us he doesn't get the fish, he gets a poke in the head from a big ass stick. The lesson that shark learned today was that a spearo doesn't mean free meal, it means a solid poke in the head. Hows that for conditioning? Will the highly evolved predator remember that poke? I think he will, I think the next diver he runs into will get a few extra feet of buffer.

Florida gets the most shark attacks because we get lots of people in the water plus large numbers of sharks chasing prey inshore. The bulk of the "attacks" aren't from bulls, lemons, duskies and the like - they're from little guys like blacktips and spinners nipping surfers in turbid water on the foot or hand while chasing baitfish. One guy baiting sharks 3+ miles off Jupiter has jack-all do do with shark attacks in this state - the "hot spot" by far is Volusia County, which is about a good 200 miles north of Jupiter.

FLMNH Ichthyology Department: Map of Florida's Confirmed Unprovoked Shark Attacks

FLMNH Ichthyology Department: Shark Species Involved In Unprovoked Attacks In Florida Waters

FLMNH Ichthyology Department: Florida Unprovoked Shark Attack Victim Activity

FLMNH Ichthyology Department: Florida Annual Tourist/Resident Population vs Shark Attacks

FLMNH Ichthyology Department: Statistics of Shark Attacks on Divers

As for the articles on the Egypt attacks ... well, let's just say first my B.S. alarm lit off; that tends to happen when most of the sources are tourism officials in a third-world country with a political system resembling Lord Havelock Vetinari's "One Man, One Vote" principle ("He's the man, and he has the vote"). Anyone remember the mayor from Jaws? Second, if there was a link between the feeding (which could have been something heftier than tourist-boat chumming, as noted in the article) and the attacks it probably had more to do with the presence of blood and bait in the water than the shark seeing a human without such stimulus and associating it with a snack. If you're swimming in baited waters your chances of getting nailed go up, as a certain knucklehead "researcher" so astutely demonstrated on-camera about a decade ago while feeding bull sharks in waist-deep water like they were barnyard chickens.

 

[John from the burg]

There's more than one guy doing this, and they are doing it around popular dive sites. We can argue morality and legality for days but the fact is this practice has killed before and will again. I just hope it's someone directly involved and not some kid out shooting lionfish for dinner.

 

[HalcyonDaze]

There's more than one guy doing this, and they are doing it around popular dive sites. We can argue morality and legality for days but the fact is this practice has killed before and will again. I just hope it's someone directly involved and not some kid out shooting lionfish for dinner.

I'm not arguing morality and legality - I'm arguing the statistics of shark attacks on divers in Florida waters and the observations of myself and others in the Jupiter/West Palm area. There's not enough evidence to suggest that the actions of Randy any other recreational charter operations in the area are changing the behavior of the sharks towards divers in general. If they were, I wouldn't need to go out on the Emerald ​to see a dozen or more sharks all at once. Now, is it possible that someone directly involved in a feeding dive might get bitten? Certainly. That's a risk the operator and the divers on the boat have to consider, same as they would have to consider the risks of diving in 130 feet of water in a 4-knot current.

 

[Doubler]

My understanding of the Egypt thing was a ship transporting sheep had a very large die off of sheep and dumped them over the side off the resorts. OWT's came into feed on dead sheep and when the sheep were gone went into shore and continued feeding on tourists. Probably 100% true.
Some body is bound to get killed doing these kinds of dives, just like the guy on Shearwater. Accidents do happen espicially when the outside of the envelope is pushed. Unfortunately what usually happens is the sharks suffer.

 

[John from the burg]

I'm not arguing morality and legality - I'm arguing the statistics of shark attacks on divers in Florida waters and the observations of myself and others in the Jupiter/West Palm area. There's not enough evidence to suggest that the actions of Randy any other recreational charter operations in the area are changing the behavior of the sharks towards divers in general. If they were, I wouldn't need to go out on the Emerald ​to see a dozen or more sharks all at once. Now, is it possible that someone directly involved in a feeding dive might get bitten? Certainly. That's a risk the operator and the divers on the boat have to consider, same as they would have to consider the risks of diving in 130 feet of water in a 4-knot current.

We put ourselves in danger every time we leave the house, difference here is these guys are putting other people in danger and not just the people at the dive but every spearo in the water within 5 miles. I'm allowed to put myself at risk, your not allowed to put me at risk.

Suggesting these fish don't change behavior when fed by humans is, with all due respect, stupid. Dogs, cats, squirrels, rats, birds, monkeys, deer, dolphins, bears, gators, lizards and literally every single animal when given free meals by humans becomes acclimated to it. They change their behavior to include this new easy source of food because they have to, they are wired that way from birth.

There is plenty of evidence to suggest interaction between wild animals and humans end up with the animal dead. You may not care about the bears or gators or birds but if you care about the sharks you will stop hand feeding them from spearguns.

 

[HalcyonDaze]

We put ourselves in danger every time we leave the house, difference here is these guys are putting other people in danger and not just the people at the dive but every spearo in the water within 5 miles. I'm allowed to put myself at risk, your not allowed to put me at risk.

Suggesting these fish don't change behavior when fed by humans is, with all due respect, stupid. Dogs, cats, squirrels, rats, birds, monkeys, deer, dolphins, bears, gators, lizards and literally every single animal when given free meals by humans becomes acclimated to it. They change their behavior to include this new easy source of food because they have to, they are wired that way from birth.

There is plenty of evidence to suggest interaction between wild animals and humans end up with the animal dead. You may not care about the bears or gators or birds but if you care about the sharks you will stop hand feeding them from spearguns.

Suggesting that this situation is automatically equivalent to feeding the animals listed is a bit too simple an analogy for my liking. For one, unlike the terrestrial animals (or dolphins, which are typically fed by recreational boaters), our time in the sharks' domain is brief and sporadic. They are not in our backyards seeing people every day. You have to consider how frequent the interactions are, how large an area the sharks cover in their regular movements, how much food is involved, how "easy" the feeding opportunity is, and other factors. If the sharks come to expect this as part of their normal routine and change their normal behavior, we likely have a problem. If they're just being opportunistic when an operator conducts a feed - i.e. it happens infrequently enough or the amount of food provided is not enough to make them change their habits - I don't see a big issue.

Rather than debate this issue on philosophical terms, perhaps we should ask the folks who dive the West Palm/Jupiter area regularly whether they're seeing a change in shark behavior? Spearos getting harassed more frequently, other dive operators reporting sharks stalking them while collecting lionfish or carrying no food whatsoever, or seeing more aggressive behavior in the videos posted by Emerald divers? You're giving me a hypothesis; let's see if it's supported. Right now I know of two studies done in the Bahamas using tracking gear, one on the tigers at Tiger Beach and one on Caribbean reef sharks, that have not shown any difference in movements between sharks that are fed and ones that are not fed.

 

[John from the burg]

our time in the sharks' domain is brief and sporadic

Maybe you would be right if there was only one boat doing this but it more than one guy does this stuff, plus the Bahamian charters and there is enough of it going on to cause alarm. The fact these sharks cover large distances is in fact part of the problem, they have no idea where that state line is and don't change behavior.

If the sharks come to expect this as part of their normal routine and change their normal behavior, we likely have a problem.

On my side of the state this stuff doesn't go on but what does happen is more and more sharks stay when it gets cold. Guess where they stay? They don't leave the huge artificial reef sites because food is so easy, they will literally chew the ajs off your leader all damn day with no problems. Natural ledge with just as many fish but way less pressure and we wont see one all winter, artificial in the winter and they come darting in at the sound of a speargun alone, no matter if you hit the fish or not. They learned that people mean easy food and they stayed, they changed what they did because we introduced a alternative food source.

Rather than debate this issue on philosophical terms, perhaps we should ask the folks who dive the West Palm/Jupiter area regularly whether they're seeing a change in shark behavior?

See, this is where you lost me, and it may just be the circles we travel but i have heard hundreds of stories about the increase in shark aggression. 30 seconds on spearboard searching and you can have a list of stories by guys who see more sharks than you can possibly imagine. Ive had months of diving (8 dives a week) that had sharks on every single drop without failure, if anyone is in a place to comment on sharks and there aggressive nature toward divers its a spearo.

Here is a thread discussing this exact subject and i would bet that the average spearo has quadruple the shark experience of the average bubble blower.

Shark Problems? - Spearboard.com - The World's Largest Spearfishing Diving Boating Social Media Forum

This is an actual video of a shark given more than enough discouragement but refusing to back down. He had been fed so many times he ignored a hard thump from a flat tipped spear and came back for more.

Persistent Shark - YouTube

Commercial spear fishermen see more sharks in their "natural environment" than anyone, they pretty much unanimously agree that hand feeding sharks is a bad idea. Something to consider.