Drysuits - what’s with the radical price difference?
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Tassie_Rohan
Contributor
Very little.
Watch a group of drysuit divers assemble for a dive and one thing that hits you is how remarkably similar their drysuits are, despite being from different brands: all have similar zip and pocket locations, panel shapes and seam locations and all use the same 3rd party valves (Apexs or Sitec). The only apparent difference is the branding.
Sporting manufactures need to convince customers that their relatively simple products are somehow vastly different from nearly identical products from competitors, so there's a lot of bumf on how their trilam or neoprene is somehow unique, despite coming from the same Chinese factory as the others. I doubt many people could notice the purported difference once in the water.
A review here will bring up posts on suits that started leaking faster than expected, and surprisingly these are often the more expensive suits. In some cases that's a manufacturing defect, such as poor seam sealing. Sometimes it could be just wear and tear: all drysuits become wetsuits eventually.
What is important is fit (do try to get a custom fit) and ability to add accessories such as dry glove rings, user-replaceable neck seals, offensive color choices, etc.
It would be interesting to remove the logos from a $1500 suit and a $3000 suit, and ask divers if they can tell which is more expensive, and why.
I have a $3000 suit, but my next one will be a $1500 one, as I don't see any significant difference.
Cheers,
Rohan.
Watch a group of drysuit divers assemble for a dive and one thing that hits you is how remarkably similar their drysuits are, despite being from different brands: all have similar zip and pocket locations, panel shapes and seam locations and all use the same 3rd party valves (Apexs or Sitec). The only apparent difference is the branding.
Sporting manufactures need to convince customers that their relatively simple products are somehow vastly different from nearly identical products from competitors, so there's a lot of bumf on how their trilam or neoprene is somehow unique, despite coming from the same Chinese factory as the others. I doubt many people could notice the purported difference once in the water.
A review here will bring up posts on suits that started leaking faster than expected, and surprisingly these are often the more expensive suits. In some cases that's a manufacturing defect, such as poor seam sealing. Sometimes it could be just wear and tear: all drysuits become wetsuits eventually.
What is important is fit (do try to get a custom fit) and ability to add accessories such as dry glove rings, user-replaceable neck seals, offensive color choices, etc.
It would be interesting to remove the logos from a $1500 suit and a $3000 suit, and ask divers if they can tell which is more expensive, and why.
I have a $3000 suit, but my next one will be a $1500 one, as I don't see any significant difference.
Cheers,
Rohan.
Well.. I'm not the best at math, but after a little bit it seems about $2k
.. someone had to.I paid ~ $1200 for my Seaskin 2 years ago. No issues, no signs of it having issues. Buddy paid $3400 for his Santi. No issues, no signs of it having issues. He swears he got free rock boots and a dry bag though
I will say that the quality of his suit is "better". The stitching is maybe a little more refined. I don't think it's $2200 better, but I guess time will tell. I'm dry on every dive, I can't tell who has what stitching when I'm underwater, so I'm pretty happy. It would be like comparing a sports car a regular car. They both get you there.
To expand on what I said earlier
When selecting fabrics for diving suits key considerations include puncture and abrasion resistance, how soon the material may begin weeping, drying speed, and overall weight—especially when flying. Heavier fabrics generally offer greater durability and resistance to harsh conditions but may take longer to dry and add bulk when packing. Lighter fabrics, while easier to manage during travel and quicker to dry, may compromise on durability and may not withstand rugged use over time. Finding the right balance between weight and durability is essential depending on the application and environment.
The enduro is an extremely durable and stiff suit the elite a bit less so, the emotion is much lighter and the avatar even lighter. The SF tech is pretty heavy but really durable and has some built in warmth with the neoprenee
When selecting fabrics for diving suits key considerations include puncture and abrasion resistance, how soon the material may begin weeping, drying speed, and overall weight—especially when flying. Heavier fabrics generally offer greater durability and resistance to harsh conditions but may take longer to dry and add bulk when packing. Lighter fabrics, while easier to manage during travel and quicker to dry, may compromise on durability and may not withstand rugged use over time. Finding the right balance between weight and durability is essential depending on the application and environment.
- Avatar 102 (Four-layer, 260 g/m² Oxford Nylon Membrane)
- Santi Elite (Ripstop Nylon/Butylene/Polyester, 535 g/m²)
- Santi Emotion Plus (Ripstop Nylon/Butylene/Polyester, 235 g/m² and 535 g/m²)
- Santi Enduro (Cordura/Butylene/Polyester, 620 g/m²)
- Fourth Element Argonaut
- Stealth (Nylon Trilaminate)
- Flex (Polyester Trilaminate)
- Stealth Hybrid (Nylon/Polyester Trilaminate)
- SF Tech TNT (Kevlar and Neoprene)
- Fan favorite Sealskins does not publish Fabric weight and type as far as I can tell
The enduro is an extremely durable and stiff suit the elite a bit less so, the emotion is much lighter and the avatar even lighter. The SF tech is pretty heavy but really durable and has some built in warmth with the neoprenee
Fabric. Installed boots vs neoprene socks. User-replaceable wrist and neck seals. Silicone vs latex seals. Front vs rear zipper.
lermontov
Contributor
I have 2 otter dry suits - I dive primarily in cold water - Otter are made in UK - where they also also have cold water so they have a proven track record- most of my dive buddies are constantly whining about leaks, mine only leaks when the seals get worn and I dive in harsh conditions - predominantly wreck and caves -down side the fabric is heavier which means its more durable but a pain when flying - i think the main thing is to get a fabric that will put up with the wear and tear your going to put it through
Id like a lighter suit for warm water - but im ok with a 5mm wet for that -
Id like a lighter suit for warm water - but im ok with a 5mm wet for that -
Tassie_Rohan
Contributor
Material ~$300 difference
Let's assume a drysuit requires 6m2 of fabric, and assume wholesale trilam prices of ~$50/m2 for the cheaper stuff (it's probably half that) and $100/m2 for the best.
Labor ~$300 difference
How many hours does it take to cut, sow and waterproof a suit? Let's say 20-30 man-hours? Lets add another 10 hours at $30/hour to that to ensure only the highest standards in manufacturing.
Marketing ~$1000 difference
As a highly experienced diver you demand only the best: our bespoke suits, lovingly assembled by hand by our master craftsmen in our Zhejiang sweatshop. Our suits will exceed your expectations, impress your colleagues and make you irresistible to members of the opposite sex (or same sex, if that's how you roll). We even include large patches embossed with the words 'Pro' 'Tec' and 'Plus', along with 3 letter acronyms that include at least one 'X' to impress your friends with the 'technology' of what is essentially a waterproof bag.
Cheers
Rohan
Let's assume a drysuit requires 6m2 of fabric, and assume wholesale trilam prices of ~$50/m2 for the cheaper stuff (it's probably half that) and $100/m2 for the best.
Labor ~$300 difference
How many hours does it take to cut, sow and waterproof a suit? Let's say 20-30 man-hours? Lets add another 10 hours at $30/hour to that to ensure only the highest standards in manufacturing.
Marketing ~$1000 difference
As a highly experienced diver you demand only the best: our bespoke suits, lovingly assembled by hand by our master craftsmen in our Zhejiang sweatshop. Our suits will exceed your expectations, impress your colleagues and make you irresistible to members of the opposite sex (or same sex, if that's how you roll). We even include large patches embossed with the words 'Pro' 'Tec' and 'Plus', along with 3 letter acronyms that include at least one 'X' to impress your friends with the 'technology' of what is essentially a waterproof bag.
Cheers
Rohan
Not sure what drysuits are made in China buddy.
Santi and avatar are in Poland.
4e is the UK as is sea skin and otter.
Sf tech is Switzerland
DUI is USA
Whites is Canada again.
I could keep going.
Some suits focus on putting more durable materials in high wear areas and cutting those patches for mobility. Adds a little in manufacturing costs with the extra stitching.
I've recently bought a suit (brand unimportant) which has this and the difference is remarkable from my previous very durable but stiff suit.
The new suit also has a different neck system which is much more flexible.
The result is that the suit is a more pleasant place to be, especially when being dove with some squeeze as I prefer.
I've recently bought a suit (brand unimportant) which has this and the difference is remarkable from my previous very durable but stiff suit.
The new suit also has a different neck system which is much more flexible.
The result is that the suit is a more pleasant place to be, especially when being dove with some squeeze as I prefer.
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