elmer fudd
Contributor
I'd take the class first, if for no other reason than that it would give me a much better idea of what gear I want to spend my money on later. Buying gear without experience usually means you end up buying it twice.
doubles
- Thread starter rsldonk
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kanonfodr
Contributor
Well this may get me chastised but it won't kill you to jump into doubles on some shallow shore dives without training, but the key is having your basics (trim, bouyancy, propulsion) figured out in single tank first. Knowing the valve drill is definitely good from a safety perspective, but not necessary on a shallow shore dive (on my first dives I could have literally walked along the bottom to the surface, or even better tried to isolate the failure and then make a return to shore).
Having said that, getting into doubles is not something to take lightly. Despite being in Hawaii, this place is no technical diving mecca so I was pretty much on my own. I lucked into finding a set of HP100s that were ready to go, so I jumped on them. That's about it. It just so happened that those tanks work for me (quite well), but I would definitely try many sets before you purchase if possible.
Later on I managed to take Fundies in doubles/drysuit (no easy task as I was fairly new to both) and managed a Recreational Pass, but it was a lot of work on my part. You've got to want it, and go into the class with a totally open mind to get the full benefit of it.
I would tell you to be cautious and try to find several different sets of doubles to try out before you spring for them, so you get the best set of doubles for you that you possibly can. If you dive them, keep it shallow and (preferably) have a buddy who is trained in doubles go with you, possibly teach you the valve drill, and take lots of pictures/video.
Peace,
Greg
Having said that, getting into doubles is not something to take lightly. Despite being in Hawaii, this place is no technical diving mecca so I was pretty much on my own. I lucked into finding a set of HP100s that were ready to go, so I jumped on them. That's about it. It just so happened that those tanks work for me (quite well), but I would definitely try many sets before you purchase if possible.
Later on I managed to take Fundies in doubles/drysuit (no easy task as I was fairly new to both) and managed a Recreational Pass, but it was a lot of work on my part. You've got to want it, and go into the class with a totally open mind to get the full benefit of it.
I would tell you to be cautious and try to find several different sets of doubles to try out before you spring for them, so you get the best set of doubles for you that you possibly can. If you dive them, keep it shallow and (preferably) have a buddy who is trained in doubles go with you, possibly teach you the valve drill, and take lots of pictures/video.
Peace,
Greg
If you are going with steel doubles, they are going to be heavy on your back. Its fun at the beginning, then the novelty wears off. I originally dove with 120's (steel) and it was great with all the air and bottom time I could get. Then is was a real pain to move them around, load them in the truck, etc. My real job during the day is being a personal and sports trainer and one day, I move my doubles around and tweeked my back because I picked them up the wrong way. But I can squat 500lbs. LOL. Go figure.
Then I switched to double 85lps (steel), that was a little lighter. But I really got tired of the whole thing. When you have to VIP them, its a pain because they have to take the manifold off, etc. Unless you really have a huge need for air, I would go with single 120's or 130's HP Steel. Its less to deal with and you don't have to get all sorts of other gear to set up the doubles. I just recently sold both sets of doubles, my 94lb dual bladder lift wing, etc. I was so happy to unload it to the next guy. Simpler is better. You will see this down the road. Most people who dive doubles don't really need them. Its just to show that "they are diving with doubles" so everybody else can see it....
Work on your bouyancy, trim and air consumption will improve and you will be surprised how long your bottom time will be. :
mikerault
Contributor
I dive double 80 cf aluminums and love it. Just be sure you are flexible enough to reach the valves in case of failures and know which tank isolates what. As to more gas loss, BS, never had an issue with that in over 100 dives using doubles. I sure like the bottom times though! A single 80 doesn't cut it on anything other than shallow dives.
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Hmmm ... based on this, here's my advice ...
Google "Fitness for Divers" by Cameron Martz. Purchase the book ... you can actually order an online download version and have it in a few minutes.
In particular, look up and follow the stretching exercises for reaching your valves. But there's a great deal of excellent information in that book for the diver who is looking to go tech and needs to get in better shape.
More than anything else you can do, putting your body in reasonable condition will help you as a tech diver. That kind of diving puts stresses on you that recreational diving doesn't ... and although you don't need to be an athlete, a reasonable level of fitness will make everything you have to learn much easier ...
... Bob (Grateful Diver)
My point was merely that should the poster continue dowm this path, it's my opinion that he/she will outgrow 95's... which yes, certainly are steel. Just my opinion. And Lynne, I agree, 95's, even 85's (which I still regularly dive) are enough for many of the more "typical" (for lack of a beter term) dives.
I guess I worded my first response poorly. Sorry.
I totally agree with Rainer's take on this. I dive both single tanks and doubles, and I like diving my doubles a lot . . . in the water. On land and ladders and charter boat benches, not so much.
I've done two three-day liveaboard trips in Southern California, and although many of our group brought and dove their doubles, I was very glad I did not bring mine. A single 130 was more gas than I could use for any dive we did (sometimes I got two full dives out of one, maintaining rock bottom reserves!) and was a lot easier to manage getting into and out of and up the ladder.
I do think that, when you get to where you are planning technical classes (if you get there), getting into the gear well ahead of time is worth a lot, especially if you have trained folks to help mentor you. And doubles are funny animals . . . not all tanks suit all people. Even the same SIZE tanks from different manufacturers can dive very differently. If you are in the wrong tanks, you will be very uncomfortable, so it really pays to borrow and dive various sets until you find what fits you like a glove. I started with LP72s, because they were small and I don't use much gas, but I can't trim them out. (Bob Sherwood, the king of gear tweaking, admitted they just don't work for me.) When I first dove my LP85s, I felt like I had come home. But I borrowed LP85s from a friend in Monterey, and they dove entirely differently and weren't very comfortable at all. So do your homework before you spend a lot of money on something, and eventually find out it just doesn't work.
And do Fundies first.
I totally agree with Rainer's take on this. I dive both single tanks and doubles, and I like diving my doubles a lot . . . in the water. On land and ladders and charter boat benches, not so much.
I've done two three-day liveaboard trips in Southern California, and although many of our group brought and dove their doubles, I was very glad I did not bring mine. A single 130 was more gas than I could use for any dive we did (sometimes I got two full dives out of one, maintaining rock bottom reserves!) and was a lot easier to manage getting into and out of and up the ladder.
I do think that, when you get to where you are planning technical classes (if you get there), getting into the gear well ahead of time is worth a lot, especially if you have trained folks to help mentor you. And doubles are funny animals . . . not all tanks suit all people. Even the same SIZE tanks from different manufacturers can dive very differently. If you are in the wrong tanks, you will be very uncomfortable, so it really pays to borrow and dive various sets until you find what fits you like a glove. I started with LP72s, because they were small and I don't use much gas, but I can't trim them out. (Bob Sherwood, the king of gear tweaking, admitted they just don't work for me.) When I first dove my LP85s, I felt like I had come home. But I borrowed LP85s from a friend in Monterey, and they dove entirely differently and weren't very comfortable at all. So do your homework before you spend a lot of money on something, and eventually find out it just doesn't work.
And do Fundies first.
Basically a lot of divers go to doubles because they think its the next step or it "seperates the men from the boys". I learned the hard way. Its a bunch of bs. I started really techinical and now I am trying to simplify things. Less to deal with. Try diving with 120 steel doubles and getting on a crappy ladder on a NJ wreck dive. That's always fun or lugging the doubles down to the boat at the marina. I hated loading the doubles in my truck and making sure you put yourself into a squat position to pick them up from the floor. I am glad I unloaded them to the next guy who is going to learn. LOL. When will rebreathers become less expensive? LOL...That's the way to go...
I looked for that book, but it appears to be out of print and the author's own website isn't functional. You can't order the pdf online at the moment, and couldn't when I tried a few months ago. The link is Better fitness means better diving.. If it can be bought somewhere else I'd like to know...
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