Doubles VS HP 130

[TSandM]

I know quite a few people who dive 130s instead of doubles. A 130 with 32% in it can get you just about all the diving you could ever want to do without doing staged decompression -- and in fact, you need to be careful, because if your gas consumption is low enough, you can get into deco pretty easily with one!

If your dives are long, but not terribly deep, it's kind of an ideal tank. The buoyancy characteristics of a Worthington 130 are about the same as an HP 100; they're just a little beastly on land, being over 40 lbs.

But for very deep diving, you have the consideration of redundancy as well as gas supply, and at that point, doubles look like a better bet. And for me, by the time I put my single tank weight belt on with a 130, I'm just about up to the weight of a set of double 72s.

 

[James R]

I have dove faber and worthington LP108s in both single and doubles configuration and the Faber's would constantly go tail light at the end of every dive. When your doing a committed decompression stop the last thing you want to be doing is fighting with your ring because you had a huge swing in you weight profile. In order to keep from being tail light you would have to start very tail heavey which is just plain stupid. The Worthington's will stay near level through out the dive even with an ending pressure in the sub 500 PSI range.


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Tom,

I am not saying I don't believe you have a tail light issue with the Faber lp108 when they get low. I just wonder how or why you do and I do not.

How tall are you and how much weight do you need on your belt to dive with a single 108? doubles? I am 6' tall. Diving wet in up to a 5mm + hooded vest with AL plate, I wouldn't need any weight for any of these faber tanks as singles: lp85, lp108, hp100, & hp133. With a drysuit, I use 6lbs & my SS plate. Doubled, I wouldn't use any weight wet or dry for them.

Looking at the specs the weight swing isn't that different in the two LP108s. It's around 8lbs for both tanks from full to empty. The big difference is where they end up with the Faber being basically 3lb positive empty, so a bit less at 500, but not hugely so.
Faber 108: -5.02 to 2.98
Worthy 108: -10.7 to -2.6


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Back on topic...
Doubles are much safer than a single tank, assuming you are trained in their use and are competent with them.

It's ridiculous to assume "everyone eventually goes tech," as the opposite is true. Very few certified divers have technical diving certification if you look at it as a percentage.

 

[Peter_C]

I have two HP130's with H valves and a set of double HP100's. They both work well, and there are times I prefer singles over doubles. Why have one type of tank, when you can have both sets? The nice things is I can switch between singles or doubles without any regulator reconfiguring, and without owning two sets of regs. All my steel tanks are Worthington's and I am happy with them. (My partner has 4 PST HP80's too.)

 

[eelnoraa]

I prefer single tank setup over double. Less mass, less drag, a lot more mobile, it is just a lot easier to handle above and underwater. But I also prefer one long dive than two short dives. So it really depends on what kind of rec profile you are looking to dive how much gas you need. If I go on to a boat, I will take singles. But if I am looking to do 40ft average depth 2 hour dives, then I will take a set of double

 

[Scared Silly]

I have dove faber and worthington LP108s in both single and doubles configuration and the Faber's would constantly go tail light at the end of every dive.

Sounds like you need to adjust the bands on the cylinders.


For the OP - you might look at putting together a set of LP72s. I find them to be a nice rig for OW and give plenty of gas.

 

[Instructor_Tom]

Tom,

I am not saying I don't believe you have a tail light issue with the Faber lp108 when they get low. I just wonder how or why you do and I do not.

How tall are you and how much weight do you need on your belt to dive with a single 108? doubles? I am 6' tall. Diving wet in up to a 5mm + hooded vest with AL plate, I wouldn't need any weight for any of these faber tanks as singles: lp85, lp108, hp100, & hp133. With a drysuit, I use 6lbs & my SS plate. Doubled, I wouldn't use any weight wet or dry for them.

Looking at the specs the weight swing isn't that different in the two LP108s. It's around 8lbs for both tanks from full to empty. The big difference is where they end up with the Faber being basically 3lb positive empty, so a bit less at 500, but not hugely so.
Faber 108: -5.02 to 2.98
Worthy 108: -10.7 to -2.6


--

Back on topic...
Doubles are much safer than a single tank, assuming you are trained in their use and are competent with them.

It's ridiculous to assume "everyone eventually goes tech," as the opposite is true. Very few certified divers have technical diving certification if you look at it as a percentage.

James;

I could go into a long drawn out discussion on pivot points, tank composition, and dive configuration, but i wont. I was stating my Opinion and the knowledge i have acquired during my diving.

I don't have a dog in this fight i just know want i like to dive.


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[victorzamora]

Diving wet in up to a 5mm + hooded vest with AL plate, I wouldn't need any weight for any of these faber tanks as singles: lp85, lp108, hp100, & hp133.

Faber 108: -5.02 to 2.98

You have much more experience with these tanks than I do (I think I picked one up once) and more experience with doubles than I do (I've lugged them around a few times) as I've never dove either. However, in SM, Faber tanks get VERY tail-light nearing empty. The LP85s go tail-up as bad as alu tanks below about 1200psi. From the specs, it seems like the Faber 108 would as well. From a physical perspective, there's no way it wouldn't. Also, you're saying that with 5mm suit and hooded vest and an AL plate you're 3lbs negative without a tank? You must be diving a LOT of heavy things to get there. I'm not commenting on their quality as far as doubles is concerned, but as SM tanks I'd look elsewhere. As far as double 108s, that sounds like a back-ache to me. I know a lot of people that dive, and love, double Faber LP85s. Double AL80s is also a good option. They're not much more expensive than an HP130, they have tons of gas, and worst case you can break them up and make deco/stage bottles or shallow/rec singles out of them. AL80s are so versatile it's hard to go wrong.

As for 2 little vs 1 big: I prefer two tanks if I'm going to "deeper" depths. If I'm breaking 80ft, I prefer two tanks. I'll go to 100ft on a single tank, but only if conditions are fantastic and my buddy is good (normally my wife, and she normally needs reminding to be extra vigilant on those "dumb" dives). Redundancy is something I'd sacrifice a little bit of comfort for. You're right, on most dives there's no need for redundancy.....but I'd rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it.

 

[Doppler]

Guys: I was looking to get into diving doubles to increase bottom time within recreational depths of 130 and above. Then I saw this monster tank HP 130. Its a beast of a tank but for someone looking to increase bottom time at recreational depth do you think doubles are necessary or should an HP 130 do the trick? I am not a gas hog, but sometimes, in some dives I do need more bottom time / gas than what an HP 100 gives. Part of me is saying buy an HP 130 and save the wings and dual tank set up. Another part of me says, sooner or later every recreational diver will get into tech and then the 130 may not see as much use.

Id love to hear from folks who go doubles instead of gigantic single tanks or vice versa. Thanks for your help.

Cheers -

CS

You really, really need to sit down with a decent instructor or an experienced mentor to discuss these options.

Personally, I would steer you towards getting a second tank to match what you already have... then either SM or BM

 

[Linedog]

What Lynn (TSandM) says is spot on. I dive a XS130, my last dive was 80 minutes, max depth was 95 feet, avg depth was 54 feet. I still ended with 1100 psi, no deco but a nice long dive with a friend.

 

[James R]

You have much more experience with these tanks than I do (I think I picked one up once) and more experience with doubles than I do (I've lugged them around a few times) as I've never dove either. However, in SM, Faber tanks get VERY tail-light nearing empty. The LP85s go tail-up as bad as alu tanks below about 1200psi. From the specs, it seems like the Faber 108 would as well. From a physical perspective, there's no way it wouldn't. Also, you're saying that with 5mm suit and hooded vest and an AL plate you're 3lbs negative without a tank? You must be diving a LOT of heavy things to get there.

You're right! I re-checked my notes for diving LP85s, and I had forgotten that I used to put a 3lb tail weight on the bottom bolt when they were doubled and 4lbs on a belt when using them in sidemount, my mistake on that. It's been a year since I dove them in doubles or sidemount! As singles I can dive them with AL plate, 5mm suit & hooded vest with no additional weights, but I sink like a rock (ie no weight needed to dive AL80 with a 3mm suit in salt water). Also, my 5mm suit has over 500 dives on it (yes It is sacked and needs to be replaced) so it's compressed about as much as it can be I think. It may be more like a 3.5 or 4mm at this point.

So yeah, I should have checked my notes before posting yesterday. My mistake. Sorry about that.