Does Leisure Pro ever sell fake stuff?

[garyfotodiver]

All you need is a bunch of cash and you too can make deals with the manufacturers and distributors and buy out insolvent shops.

The funny part is that LP gets good prices because nobody else has the money to do the same thing on any kind of scale. If there were competition for the resources they're snapping up, prices would rise.

Terry

I thought I mentioned it before, but, "Money talks and nobody walks."

 

[Web Monkey]

Its not an issue of money. It is the right to sell the stuff without the advertising restrictions. Its the "franchise" that makes them unique. And the stuff CERTAINLY isn't coming from insolvent shops.

Phil Ellis

Rule #1: It's always an issue of money.
Rule #2: There are no other rules.

If you walked up to almost any manufacturer, distributor or dealer who has unwanted inventory with a sack of cash and offered to buy everything they wanted to get rid of, no warranty, no responsibilities, no restrictions, no questions asked, they would sell it to you.

With enough cash, any of the above would sell you their mother if they thought they could reasonably deny it.

You can deny all you want, but my family did this (non-SCUBA) for about 20 years. There was "the price-sheet", "the good price-sheet", "the really-good-price-sheet" and "our price", and failing dealers and distributors were always a favorite source for cheap products.

Terry

 

[deepstops]

can't believe this thread is still going on.

Agreed, this is stupid. The horse died months ago......

 

[redacted]

Rule #1: It's always an issue of money.
Rule #2: There are no other rules.

If you walked up to almost any manufacturer, distributor or dealer who has unwanted inventory with a sack of cash and offered to buy everything they wanted to get rid of, no warranty, no responsibilities, no restrictions, no questions asked, they would sell it to you.

With enough cash, any of the above would sell you their mother if they thought they could reasonably deny it.

You can deny all you want, but my family did this (non-SCUBA) for about 20 years. There was "the price-sheet", "the good price-sheet", "the really-good-price-sheet" and "our price", and failing dealers and distributors were always a favorite source for cheap products.

Terry

So you have decided to push the MYTH that it is failing distributors and dealers and there is no warrenty. Do you really believe LP is getting new goods faster than any USA dealers from going-out-of -business sales and that they are eating the losses from failed gear likie computers?

We are talking the #1 retailer of scuba gear in the world. I wonder how many brick & mortar LDSs you would have to combine to reach their sales?

 

[Web Monkey]

So you have decided to push the MYTH that it is failing distributors and dealers and there is no warrenty.

Those are your words, not mine.

There is an LP warranty, and there may or may not be a manufacturer's warranty, depending on how it was purchased and what they feel like doing with it. It's not magic, it's retail.

Warranties cost money (see: "It's all money"). Buy stuff with no warranty and it costs X. Buy stuff with a warranty and it costs X+W. It's not rocket science and is certainly nothing to get your shorts all twisted over.

Terry

 

[PhilEllis]

So you have decided to push the MYTH that it is failing distributors and dealers and there is no warrenty. Do you really believe LP is getting new goods faster than any USA dealers from going-out-of -business sales and that they are eating the losses from failed gear likie computers?

We are talking the #1 retailer of scuba gear in the world. I wonder how many brick & mortar LDSs you would have to combine to reach their sales?

It would take a little over 80 average scuba stores (if you assume that Leisure Trends data is the definitive data) if LPs sales are actually the number that is tossed around inside the industry. 80 average scuba stores.

Phil Ellis

 

[mike_s]

It would take a little over 80 average scuba stores (if you assume that Leisure Trends data is the definitive data) if LPs sales are actually the number that is tossed around inside the industry. 80 average scuba stores.

Phil Ellis

(Note: This isn't a reply directly to Phil, but to everyone else. I'm sure Phil already figured this out long ago......)


Also if you look at the Leisure Trends data on their sales, folks will see that there is no way that LP is getting ALL of this gear from dive shops going out of business. It's very clear that this involves direct shipments from the manufacturers.

Not that I'm bashing LP for that.... I'm just bashing the manufacturers because they sell it direct to LP and then tell the LDS's that "we're doing all we can to stop it".

That's kinda like pissing on my shoes and telling me it's raining outside.

 

[MMDiver]

That's kinda like pissing on my shoes and telling me it's raining outside.

closer to pissing on your shoes and saying they aren't pissing on your shoes while also having a crap in your back pocket (the one with your wallet in it)

 

[redacted]

It would take a little over 80 average scuba stores (if you assume that Leisure Trends data is the definitive data) if LPs sales are actually the number that is tossed around inside the industry. 80 average scuba stores.

Phil Ellis

Yeah. I estimated between 300 and 500 LDSs going out of business per year to keep Leisurepro in stock if that were their only source of gear. I think there supply network is large and diverse enough that the failure of any single source will have only a small impact, at most, on their overall operation.

 

[BobArnold8265]

You know this is the exact same type of argument people make about Walmart. Yes, Walmart has put some smaller stores out of business. They did it by offering the same products at lower prices (just like Leisure Pro). However there are many small stores that have thrived by offering things that Walmart can't always provide. I think a lot of the LDS have failed because they were just bad businesses to start with. I know several of my LDS's offer terrible customer service and give you an attitude that they're the only game in town. Leisure Pro may have been the final blow to these shops but the fact that others are still around tells me that LP isn't the only reason some shops have closed.

If the LDS's want to stay in business, then they need to find a niche to serve. Good customer service, competetitive pricing (not necessarily the best price but a reasonable one) and other services (repairs, maintanence, education, travel arrangements etc.) seem to be the key. You can blame LP for raising the bar on price and service but the LDS's only have themselves to blame if they can't find other ways to compete.