Do you have to defend your sidemount setup?

[charlier]

All of my diving is in SE Asia, mostly in current-rich Indonesia. With a moderate swell, the boat is moves up and down about 1 meter and a diver has one free hand. It appeared to me that the divers needed much assistance to get their gear unclipped, remove fins, and more importantly, handing off the two tanks to the dive deck. The deck is high off the sea surface and with only a meter swell, it difficult to board the ladder and carry tanks.

We have had a staff/crew member go into the water helping unclipped gear and another staff assist on the deck moving cylinders. In this scenario, the sea conditions are not calm. A 1+m swell accompanied my moderate currents. With such conditions, most back mount divers will walk up the ladder kitted up.

Good point about side mount training vs setup. I stand corrected if I conflated training with set-up.

 

[DevonDiver]

All of my diving is in SE Asia, mostly in current-rich Indonesia. With a moderate swell, the boat is moves up and down about 1 meter and a diver has one free hand. It appeared to me that the divers needed much assistance to get their gear unclipped, remove fins, and more importantly, handing off the two tanks to the dive deck. The deck is high off the sea surface and with only a meter swell, it difficult to board the ladder and carry tanks.

Not really any different than if you had technical or CCR divers aboard. You'd expect them to have their kit in order, and not expect assistance, other than handing up the tanks they've removed before climbing the ladder.

In exceptional circumstances, you'd also expect them to climb that ladder fully kitted. If they couldn't, it points to insufficient fitness and/or a bad ladder design.

Picture above: At the end of safety/deco stop - slowly ascending to the surface from 3m. Eyes on the boat ladder. Cylinders immediately ready to hand off to boat crew.

That's a standard drill on my sidemount courses. I also teach de-kitting on the surface (of course) and how to use temporary chokers to exit with cylinders en-situ. Drills are repeated until the student shows no stress or fumble in doing them.

 

[charlier]

Andy - the divers on our boats are mostly recreational divers. On occasional, we have experienced CCR or technical divers. So my comments are directed at recreational OC scuba public, not technical divers. Perhaps it is a lack of training, inexperience, or simple task loading with sidemount and backmount divers. It's sad, but I rarely guide divers with a high level of trim or buoyancy skills.

 

[DevonDiver]

Andy - the divers on our boats are mostly recreational divers. On occasional, we have experienced CCR or technical divers. So my comments are directed at recreational OC scuba public, not technical divers. Perhaps it is a lack of training, inexperience, or simple task loading with sidemount and backmount divers. It's sad, but I rarely guide divers with a high level of trim or buoyancy skills.

True.... but cylinder remove/replace on the surface, along with varied entries and exit techniques, ARE performance standards to be 'mastered'...even on the basic PADI Sidemount Diver course. If divers aren't exhibiting competence in those basic sidemount skills, they've been under-trained for qualification. In other words.... ripped off by their instructor.

Task loading with equipment is a result of insufficient equipment familiarity. A diver who is overly task loaded by their kit is not ready for qualification. They do not meet any definition of 'mastery' as defined by agency standards.

On my courses, I also insist that students retain situational awareness when conducting all skills. That includes surface skills like donning/doffing sidemount kit. So basically, they need to do it whilst keeping their eyes on their team/buddy and the boat. It' all about raising equipment familiarity so that other critical fundamentals aren't compromised. It takes in-water time and repetition.

I also add cylinder remove-replace exercises in mid-water. That also boosts kit familiarity. Again, situational awareness and buoyancy/trim is not permitted to degrade. Students need gloves.... or their fingers can bleed from the bolt-snaps.

And... I apply those standards for sidemount students at any exiting qualification level, even open water. What's most satisfying is that they can.... and do reach the standards I set.

I had a student a few years ago that was very prone to stress when donning/doffing cylinders and hoses at the surface. It took him 5 days to complete the course to the correct standards. Ten 60-90 minute dives, rather than the four dictated by minimum standards. I just don't see many sidemount instructors apply that sort of diligence and 'ethics over profit' for their students.

What can I say? Second-rate sidemount instructors produce incompetent sidemount divers. That leads to misconceptions about the 'drawbacks' of sidemount set-up....

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Climbing a ladder with sidemount tanks just isn't that hard ... particularly not with those oversize beer cans they call scuba tanks in the tropics. With sidemount I typically release the bungees, take off my fins, and climb. No assistance needed. It's actually easier than with backmount since your tanks are aligned with your body, reducing the need to bend at the waist to support the weight of the tanks with your back to keep from getting pulled backward. If conditions are rough, this is way preferable to unclipping and handing up tanks, which is going to increase the risk of getting bashed into the ladder while you're in the water.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[BeijaFlor]

May I suggest that climbing out with sidemount tanks might also depend on the length and stability of the ladder?

I just got back from some diving in Negril, Jamaica ... diving from a glass-bottom boat with the worst excuse for a swim ladder I've seen; it was tied down below the bulwarks, it went maybe two steps below the waterline, I had to fold myself like a pretzel to get my foot on the first step, and there was nothing to grab onto to help yourself up. You can bet I handed up my camera and my tanks before trying to board; so did the dive guide, who is rail-thin and wiry.

On the other hand, the boat for Amoray Lodge in Key Largo has solid, stable ladders that reach down several steps below the water, and I had no trouble at all boarding with all of my tanks and gear in place.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

May I suggest that climbing out with sidemount tanks might also depend on the length and stability of the ladder?

I just got back from some diving in Negril, Jamaica ... diving from a glass-bottom boat with the worst excuse for a swim ladder I've seen; it was tied down below the bulwarks, it went maybe two steps below the waterline, I had to fold myself like a pretzel to get my foot on the first step, and there was nothing to grab onto to help yourself up. You can bet I handed up my camera and my tanks before trying to board; so did the dive guide, who is rail-thin and wiry.

On the other hand, the boat for Amoray Lodge in Key Largo has solid, stable ladders that reach down several steps below the water, and I had no trouble at all boarding with all of my tanks and gear in place.

Yes, but I thought we were talking about a liveaboard. In the Red Sea I have to climb back aboard a RIB with a ladder similar to what you're describing. In that case, taking off the tanks is pretty much required.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)