Do you ever dive WITHOUT a flag?

[spectrum]

We dive without flags all the time, because most local boaters don't have a clue what the flag is, and the flag seems to actually attract boats and jet skis. But we always carry surface markers, like a safety sausage that we can send up on a line from a spool as we ascend, or inflate on the surface to be seen.

Same here...

On ocean divers lobster traps and their buoy lines are almost always encountered and pulling a surface flag would be a menace. Fortunately flying a flag is not required here in Maine. When in doubt at the ocean or elsewhere I shoot my DSMB before surfacing.

On a recent pond dive where I did fly one due to boat traffic 2 different boaters expressed their amazement to learn that it was a diver moving that flag around! In this case the pond association prefers to see a flag so we keep them happy. If I do surface I do so right at the flag. I don't count on a safe radius.

Pete

 

[Scott M]

Someone said in an earlier post that they listen for boats before surfacing, please keep in mind not all boats are power boats. A sail boat makes very little noise in the water and can clear a path quite deep. We have a ton of boats on the lake this year and a ton of sail boats. We need to be extra careful lately. Even if they don't know what a dive flag is very few people are out to intentional hit something in the water so a flag is better than nothing.

Regards

 

[ohmdiver]

Ok, I guess we DON'T need a flag when we dive........ interesting

Think again Oh Upstate NY Brethern, it is a law that divers are required to have a flag, and not only are boater required to stay at least 100' away, but the diver must stay within a 100' of the flag. Varify with the authorities, I could be wrong.

I bet the fine in NY is much more expensive than most places. The fine maybe $80, but don't forget NY and the court fees. Additionally it sounds like you were diving in the St. Lawrence, for what it is worth, surfacing in the channel will result in a HEFTY fine, and the possible confication of your gear and boat. Ofcourse this could depend on which side of the boarder you surface.

My thought would be at a minimum a flag flying from your boat as you were diving.

We seldom dive without a flag, at least if something should happen we have done everything possible to protect ourselves. Thus making it easier for the lawyers.

 

[MauiScubaSteve]

Hawaii law mandates a surface float flag for all diving, including freediving. If you are diving from a boat the boat must have a flag, and that flag covers the requirement. The wording is "...divers must ascend within 100' of the flag, except in emergency." Boating reg's say boats must stay 100' away from flags, except to approach the area to snorkel, dive or freedive at slow to no-wake speed.

With scooter or cavern diving, tie the flag at point of entry and return to point of entry is OK, and surfacing due being lost, dead battery or low on air would constitute an emergency.

DSMB is your friend!

Saying all that, I do plenty dives with neither, but I'm pretty darn sure I will return and no enforcement officers are around

 

[FireDiver443]

If I'm doing a shore dive here in NY, I carry a flag. If I'm diving from the boat (say, Lake Ontario), we have one flying and usually tie a reel off to the anchor line, especially on days with chocolate milk viz. On drift dives, the boat has a flag visible and someone's carrying a reel attached to a float ball. I never leave home without my SMB & reel and deploy it often as a drill, whether there's boat traffic around or not. I highly recommend every diver carry one... taller than a safety sausage and often easier to see.

As some previous posters noted, however, in my experience there are lots of boaters/jet skiers that don't know what the flag means and will ride right on in and ask what's going on and if we need something (Why yes...yes we do. We need you to KEEP BACK 100FT!!! please.).

Not sure about everyone elses experience, but I hear far more anecdotes about divers ticketed for no flags than watercraft operators ticketed for disregarding them.

 

[JRScuba]

Florida it is a law to have a dive flag when you are in the water.

You should have a SMB attached to a finger spool that has 100' of line. This is in case you separate from the diver with the flag.

When diving from a boat, it has to have a dive flag above the boat.

The dive flag in water is for wave runner to ride circles around it or boats to head straight at them..

Yes, Florida has dive flag laws for divers. The boat owners and wave runners do not
have a clue what they are for.

 

[Gen732]

Let google be your friend......

Dive Flag Law

I would verify local laws, but this makes for a decent starting point.

"For Divers in Washington

Washington Dive Flags
Rules for WA divers and boaters

Washington specifies the use of the alpha dive flag.

According to Adventures in Boating, Washington, The Legal Requirements of Boating:

Persons scuba diving, skin diving and snorkeling from a vessel must display an 'Alfa' flag to mark their diving area. Between sunset and sunrise, the flag should be lighted.

Divers should stay within 200 feet of the dive flag.

From WAC 296-37-535 Predive procedures for commercial diving operations:

When diving from surfaces other than vessels in areas capable of supporting marine traffic, a rigid replica of the international code flag "A" at least one meter in height shall be displayed at the dive location in a manner which allows all-round visibility, and shall be illuminated during night diving operations. "

Now how many of us are probably in violation of this one??? I for one know that I am. Most boaters don't know what a "Diver down" flag means when they see it, however, since everyone on the water (at least here in the US) falls under the Coast Guard Rules of the Road, then they should know what an Alpha flag means. I know from being in the Navy and being the one responsible for knowing Rules of the Road and training sailors on them, that most of my guys couldn't tell you what a diver down flag meant before I got certified, but everyone of them could tell you what an Alpha flag meant. Now everyone of them knows the diver down flag. Even diving this last weekend, the people on the dock were asking me, fully dressed and ready to get into the water, what the flag on the float that I had just put into the water meant. I politely informed them that it was to mark the area and to let nearby boaters know that there were divers in the water. Many were surprised to know that I was required to have the flag out.

Back to the original question. I dive with a diver down flag on a float every time I dive, with the exception of the Underwater Park across the sound from me. Only reason I don't take mine there is it is a designated Underwater Park, is marked with a diver down flag on a buoy on the far center of the park, and no boats/watercraft are allowed into that area.

 

[White Knight]

In California using a flag isn’t mandatory—thank God—so I usually don’t use one. I display a diver down flag in my boat while I am diving, but never during a shore dive. Although, if I was diving a high traffic area, I might reconsider that decision. Like some of the posts so far seem to allude to, I have found that many boaters do not know what a diver down flag--much less an alpha flag--is, and I have actually seen it make situations worse as boaters came in closer to check it out. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.....choose your poison.

 

[Nemrod]

I don't see how you can use a flag if you are in kelp, a cave, swim throughs in a reef. I further see no need for a flag if you are in a body of water which does not have powered craft or watercraft. Other than as a bouy to mark your dead body, should you drown, for recovery, what purpose does the flag provide in a lake or quarry where there is no boat traffic? The whole point of the flag is to hopefully prevent being run over by a boat, in practical tems, nobody pays any atention to the flag, it is more problem often with than without.

N

 

[White Knight]

Also, unless you are diving in a high traffic area (a place I would try to avoid) you can hear a boat engine heading your way from a mile away. So unless I am completely out of air, I can usually get out of harms’ way during my accent. But again, if your particular state has a law stating you must use one---then I hope it doesn't have kelp!