DMs working for free - can it be good for the customer?

[TMHeimer]

I would generally say that DM's would be seldem used. Is there any legal requirement stopping an advanced diver tour guiding divers at holiday destinations? [that's an actual question... i can't see that there is, as anyone but a DM or instructor wouldn't be able to accept an instabuddy or 2 when you rock up to a local dive site..]

and for courses, DM's aren't necessary but a huge help... so instead of taking 2 hours in the water it'd just take 3 or 4. you might find instructors demanding higher wages then.

at the end of the day diving is something that people are more than willing to do for free, so even if the majority of DM's unionised there'd be someone, somewhere willing to do it for free.

additionally, OP: Remuneration is one of the lowest forms of motivation for a worker.

The only thing I really disagree with is the renumeration thing. I think it ranks very high.

Re Advanced divers as tour guides....Would they get paid, be insured? If there is no pay would many do it anyway? Maybe, maybe not.

Without DMs the courses may be longer as you state, and thus the course fee higher. Higher instructor pay may well result, but then again that extra pay could go to a paid DM, and we're back where we started from.

Always someone willing to do it for free: agree completely, relating this again to the world of working musicians.

 

[FlyerQ]

I completely understand that may be the majority - but in South Florida - I think you'll find a lot of DMs gaining "experience".

Certainly was true when I lived in S. Florida in the mid-1990s. I spent several years DM'ing on weekends while working a professional job during the week. After completing AOW and Rescue I kept diving with a particular shop and they eventually asked if I'd like to DM. At that point both my skills and personality were well known to the shop.

They gave me the training at cost (DiveCon), gear at cost, and I worked a couple of dives a weekend. I think I paid my own insurance, but wouldn't matter as the cost was trivial.

I was very customer centric and really enjoying making the dives as safe and comfortable as possible. That said, I can also understand the argument for paid help. For what it's worth, this shop focused on retaining mature professionals and shunned individuals without financial stability for their unpaid positions.

 

[LakeCountyDiver]

Hey Andy

I would have to say that most if not all DM's here in FL dont earn a wage. It has a lot to do with the "Region" thing you talked about. Here you have A LOT of divers climbing up the ranks through various methods all wanting to make a career in the Dive Industry. You know the laws of supply and demand I am sure so why would any shop want to pay for a DM when the next guy is willing to do it for free or at least for free diving.

At best you can expect your dues and insurance paid with a few other perks such as free dives,air fills,and cheap gear. Maybe a chance to get TIPS every now and then but that depends on the customer not the shop/boat.

It is a sad fact but DM's don't make any money a lot of times it can even cost a little money out of pocket if you are not DM from a boat and live really close. Being a tour guide can intail travel to different sites which will cost a lot too.

Some shops charge $600 for the coarse others more. The Dues are what $140's and $300+ for insurance. That is $1000+ right there then you have to look at what being a DM is going to cost you. I am a single father so it is not likely it will work for me right now. As you have already read shops offer "FREE" DM coarse but that comes with slave labor for 9mo to 2years.

The best way to make money is to be an instructor in my opinion and having a dealers cost for gear dont hurt either. The best thing you gain from a DM coarse and work is the experience I think.

 

[jnowak100]

When I am on a dive trip, I usually tip the DM $10 to $20 a day, US or Caribbean, depends on the DM. I always tip something, depends on service, as with all people working in service business, tips are a major part of wages. Perhaps Dive Shops should make it clear that DM's paid or not appreciate gratuities as a major part of their compensation.

What do the commentators on Scuba Board usually tip the DM or boat crew?

I am completing my DM course and will then start the IDC, mostly weekends . I am no expert, having started the DM course with just 100 dives. I am going for it because I love to dive and want to encourage other people to dive. And, in the process perhaps become a better diver myself.

If you know much of life, it is clear that income and professionalism are unrelated.

 

[Diver0001]

What do the commentators on Scuba Board usually tip the DM or boat crew?

I don't have massive amounts of experience with this but I was talking about "gnomes" (because I couldn't think of a better word) in a previous post and usually my tips go to them.

The captain, the crew and the dive-crew all deserve something, in my opinion, but my heart usually goes out to the guys who work hard and are paid next to nothing for it.

Where I often go diving in Egypt the DM's are pretty much all either young Europeans who are looking for a life-style gig or rich-kids (espcially the men) from well-to-do Egyptian families who are out sewing their proverbial oats before settling down into "real life"... and while their lives are not opulant, they aren't suffering either.

The guys who do the work, however, (lugging gear/luggage/tanks, filling tanks, keeping rooms, scrubbing toilets and making sure the tourists get WHAT they want WHEN they want it) are often locals who found the job of a lifetime working for a hand-full of sand, a kick in the butt and tips.

So if I have $50 for a tip, then 15 goes to the guys who made my life easy (the "gnomes"), $15 goes to the guys behind the scenes, like the ones who made the toilets clean and showers fungus-free, $10 goes to the cook and $10 to the dive-crew. This is usually less than teh dive crew was expecting and more than all of the others were expecting.

I am completing my DM course and will then start the IDC, mostly weekends . I am no expert, having started the DM course with just 100 dives. I am going for it because I love to dive and want to encourage other people to dive. And, in the process perhaps become a better diver myself.

Good luck. Your motivations seem to be clear and I like your attitude.

If you know much of life, it is clear that income and professionalism are unrelated.

Not sure I agree with you there. I *would* agree that money is seldom the prime motivator for doing a good job, however.

Maybe this will sound like a cliche but if you can't afford a professional then you usually get what you paid for. The reason is simple. Developing professionalism takes energy.... it takes time.... and it takes commitment..... and usually you can't expect that from people who don't get compensated for putting in their time, energy or commitment. And the easiest way to compensate them is with money.

Dive professionals are a bit different because many are compensated "in natura" (free air, discounts and beer/sex/visions-of-palm-trees) and a few feel a "calling" regardless of whether or not they a paid for it, but those may be rare.

R..

 

[Diver0001]

Incidentally, regional differences make a big difference. I work in the Netherlands, and in 10-odd years of training I got a bottle wine as a gift once... oh and the muffins from a female student, that made my wife say... WHAT!?!? (she also refused to eat them... LOL)

It's just how Dutch people are wired. If I worked in Egypt I'd develop self-esteem problems if that happened. However my Dutch clients give me something that means even more to me..... compliments. I often hear how happy they were with their training and I find it extremely gratifying to see how many of my students become active divers.

One of them even eventually became my tek-instructor. How weird is that? One day you're teaching someone how to clear a mask 1/2 full of water and a few years later he's teaching you staged decompression. LOL

R..