DM blew me off

[frontiernurse]

Aaack! I'm super happy to find a context appropriate to describe my first open water dive. Did the pool stuff in NoCal but had a bad feeling about the teacher leading such a big group (12 divers) into Monterey Bay. So I went to Mexico. For my first open water dive we (me, captain, divemaster, snorkler) rode ~ 4 miles in swells higher than the Panga to the Marietas. When we stopped there was a lot of swearing involving mostly the words "chingar" and "propellar." So, yeah the propellar had fallen off the boatl But the dive was ON!

We dropped to the sandy bottom, about 40 feet, me and the DM. He signalled YOU/STAY. then swam away. My first dive ever in open water, 4 miles off shore in Mexico,at the bottom of the ocean. Alone. And for some reason I LOVED it. I stayed put. A puffer fish hung with me for a bit. The the DM came back with the propellar. He again made the sign YOU/STAY and he went up and gave the propellar to the captain.

Then we had a perfectly lovely dive and made it home OK.

I bring this up because I was taught my default is to ultimately trust my own comfort/skill level. Another person in that scenario may have felt anxious but unable to ascend because there was no DM to tell him to do so. If I read the OP depths correctly, these dives were not super deep? However, drift has not been addressed. If drift was not an issue, he could have signalled to his DM he was low, going shallow, and would follow the group bubbles or get back on the bus. But of course these options would have had to have been presented to the OP.

Anyway, when I was training as a nurse I was strongly schooled to QUESTION EVERYTHING that came out of an MD's mouth (e.g. authority}. Both the MDs in training and the world famous attendings. I think the same goes for divemasters.

Love, Pain in the Ass. [PITA}

 

[racerx_]

Interesting discussion all around and a lot of good advice/perspective here.

Just a thought from the OP's perspective. The way dive training and dive planning etc is done in a lot of Asia is very different to that found in the U.S. and maybe europe in the sense that individual responsibility is not emphasized as much nor do the DM's lead the dive that way in many cases. From the way the dives are conducted it is inferred that you just follow the DM and obey them blindly. Sometimes there is no dive briefing, buddy check etc. Not saying its right but that is kinda how it is.. It's not till I got to scubaboard that I realized this isn't really the way it should be. Everyone is definitely responsible for their own diving, but when it's not taught clearly in the OW course and then not reinforced by the "pro's" that are leading your dives it's a bit of a steep learning curve sometimes as a new diver. It's taken me a while to insist on buddy protocols, specifics in the dice briefing etc since they aren't standard at a lot of places.

I think it's been made quite clear that each diver is responsible for their own plan, safety, etc. however the OP is bringing up a real life experience as a new open water diver that was unnerving to him and thats fair enough. I can appreciate that it was not an ideal situation--objectively speaking neither on the OP's part or on the DM's part. There could be many explanations for the DM's behavior but we're really just speculating here so it seems a bit more fruitful to stick to the principles that everyone can learn from and not try to imagine what might have been.

To the OP.. First ventures in to scubaboard can be sometimes painful but usually end up helpful

 

[Wingy]

Racerx youve nailed it really there is a VAST difference in the thai way of scuba business practices than what I read here. The DSD culture and hey you dont even need to swim thing is common in thailand..its a financial thing, ive often seen DMs and guides pulling DSD people who cannot swim along on a rope after theyve had a pool session with a reg in their mouth money is taken and the nonswimmers get to scuba dive...of sorts...Its rare to see a dive op in thailand turn anyone away as long as they pay.

 

[brnt999]

In the interest of full disclosure I will mention my training. Its probably not pretty but its what happened.
There was a dive shop across the street from my hotel in Thailand. Two of my brothers had recently been certified and I had thought about diving and I got up the nerve and dropped in. We agreed I'd do a Discover Dive and if I liked it I would continue on with the course--a total of 3 days. The Discover Dive went well. I't was just me and a DM, I liked the guy and trusted him and we went thru some basic skills and by my second dive with him I was pretty much on my own following him around. I felt comfortable and he said I did well. So that night I dropped back in to the dive shop, paid my money, and was handed a text book and some written exercises and told to show up at the pool the next morning. They didn't mention that I was supposed to study 5 or 6 chapter of the book and do all of the exercises--so I just glanced thru the book. I show up the next mornimg and there is 2 other people in my class but one of them is late.The other person had already done the theory--watched the videos and read the book--and didn't want to do it again so we immediately hopped in the pool and started on the pool skills. Not having read the book or watched the videos I didn't have a clue what these skills were. The instructor did the various skills once and I copied what she did. By lunch I was done the pool skills. By then the other student had shown up and she was having a lot of problems--she couldn't put her head under water with the regulator so I was sent to a room to watch the videos and complete all of the exercises for 5 or 6 chapters of the book. The dive shop the night before had forgotten to give me the chart showing nitrogen levels and wait times so I had to cram that all in at the same time. I completed the exercises, discussed the questions I got wrong with another instructor, and it was suggested I write the test while things were still fresh. So I wrote the test--got 92%--discussed the questions I got wrong--and that was it. By then it was 7 at night and I ate and went back to my hotel and went to bed. The next morning I am out on a boat to complete my final open water dives with a differant instructor. Not having read the book and having fast forwarded thru the videos the day before I didn't have a clue what the ow skills were I was going to be tested on. The instructor briefed me on the first dive, and I remember handed me a divers compass for one of the skills and I asked her how it worked. She stormed off in a huff saying I should know. Its not rocket science but all I needed was someone to spend 2 minutes explaining it to me. So I asked someone on the boat. So once again I am in the water doing the skills and the instructor basically did them first and I copied her. And that was it. Things seemed to go pretty smoothly and the instrutor was relieved she didn't have to get too stressed. The past few days I was flying by the seat of my pants and I got thru it.

So two days later I am out on a boat heading for my first dives. Was I totally self reliant and did I have a handle on everything I was supposed to know? Probably not. So whose fault is that--I did everything I was told. The DM I was buddied with told me to follow his direction--so I did. I trusted him.

 

[Doppler]

If I remember correctly the first dive was 18m and the second was 13m.

Thanks.

I was interested to see how far outside the normal parameters of an OW cert dive you were taken.

 

[vincent54]

You did well to survive. Unfortunately there is no one place to find out about what a new diver needs to know when they choose a dive operation. Apparently, from reading threads from other new divers , it is a worldwide issue. Stay in the practice mode and find your buddy that you are comfortable with and continue to dive. We have all had bad episodes, but most learn and keep going. Others will quit diving or worse. Thanks for sharing your story.

 

[supergaijin]

That sounds all too familiar unfortunately and it is exactly this type of McPADI course which creates massive problems in the diving industry- not to mention the potentially fatal consequences of shoddy, fast-track courses. You are definitely not alone in your experiences post-certification, and it says something about your character that you've continued diving, given those initial experiences. (that may be taken a number of ways of course )

If you are really interested in diving, and wish to continue, find a mentor. That mentor maybe an experienced diver or a paid instructor to bring you back to some basics with diving. As posters have mentioned above, you really get out of diving what you put in, but do some research first.

You may find a kindly individual to do it for free.
You may pay an instructor to do it for money. If you go the paid route, then it has to be clear what you're getting out of the deal ie. one on one tuition? or is it part of a 'group' course.

Most instructors and dive shops (good ones anyway) will welcome a customer who makes an inquiry towards furthering their education. But it behooves the individual to make sure that they're getting what they want... and be willing to pay for it.

Or find a kindly individual to do it for free.

Good luck

 

[Doppler]

In the interest of full disclosure I will mention my training... The DM I was buddied with told me to follow his direction--so I did. I trusted him.

As you are aware now and were probably aware at the time, you were sold a bill of goods. It sounds as though neither your training nor the attitude of the staff who were charged with delivering it, were adequate for you to feel comfortable.

The circumstances that lead to your disappointment and "anger" with the treatment you received on your first dives following "graduation" seem inline with the customer service you enjoyed during the course itself. Not a surprise but nevertheless unacceptable.

However, I am unsure why you are telling us about it. Have you filed a complaint with the certifying agency? If not, do so.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

In the interest of full disclosure I will mention my training. Its probably not pretty but its what happened.
There was a dive shop across the street from my hotel in Thailand. Two of my brothers had recently been certified and I had thought about diving and I got up the nerve and dropped in. We agreed I'd do a Discover Dive and if I liked it I would continue on with the course--a total of 3 days. The Discover Dive went well. I't was just me and a DM, I liked the guy and trusted him and we went thru some basic skills and by my second dive with him I was pretty much on my own following him around. I felt comfortable and he said I did well. So that night I dropped back in to the dive shop, paid my money, and was handed a text book and some written exercises and told to show up at the pool the next morning. They didn't mention that I was supposed to study 5 or 6 chapter of the book and do all of the exercises--so I just glanced thru the book. I show up the next mornimg and there is 2 other people in my class but one of them is late.The other person had already done the theory--watched the videos and read the book--and didn't want to do it again so we immediately hopped in the pool and started on the pool skills. Not having read the book or watched the videos I didn't have a clue what these skills were. The instructor did the various skills once and I copied what she did. By lunch I was done the pool skills. By then the other student had shown up and she was having a lot of problems--she couldn't put her head under water with the regulator so I was sent to a room to watch the videos and complete all of the exercises for 5 or 6 chapters of the book. The dive shop the night before had forgotten to give me the chart showing nitrogen levels and wait times so I had to cram that all in at the same time. I completed the exercises, discussed the questions I got wrong with another instructor, and it was suggested I write the test while things were still fresh. So I wrote the test--got 92%--discussed the questions I got wrong--and that was it. By then it was 7 at night and I ate and went back to my hotel and went to bed. The next morning I am out on a boat to complete my final open water dives with a differant instructor. Not having read the book and having fast forwarded thru the videos the day before I didn't have a clue what the ow skills were I was going to be tested on. The instructor briefed me on the first dive, and I remember handed me a divers compass for one of the skills and I asked her how it worked. She stormed off in a huff saying I should know. Its not rocket science but all I needed was someone to spend 2 minutes explaining it to me. So I asked someone on the boat. So once again I am in the water doing the skills and the instructor basically did them first and I copied her. And that was it. Things seemed to go pretty smoothly and the instrutor was relieved she didn't have to get too stressed. The past few days I was flying by the seat of my pants and I got thru it.

So two days later I am out on a boat heading for my first dives. Was I totally self reliant and did I have a handle on everything I was supposed to know? Probably not. So whose fault is that--I did everything I was told. The DM I was buddied with told me to follow his direction--so I did. I trusted him.

Jesus, what a cluster. You are indeed lucky and to be commended for continuing to dive. I would still seriously send a letter or email to the certifying agency and ask them why they allow this stuff to take place. I'd like to hear the response. In fact post their response here. If you get one. Is it any wonder that new divers don't keep diving. I don't give a rat's behind how many OW divers they have certified. Too many are like this and never dive again. So what good, other than for easy money, are all those certs? I'd be ashamed of those numbers when some of them are the result of courses like this.
Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2

 

[t4e]

That sounds all too familiar unfortunately and it is exactly this type of McPADI course which creates massive problems in the diving industry- not to mention the potentially fatal consequences of shoddy, fast-track courses

it is equally unfortunate that so many people choose to take such "shoddy, fast-track courses"