diving non-certified

[dbg40]

My first dive was at age 12, in about 8' of water after being given about 15 min. worth of instruction from a non certified diver of many years. I never looked back, and had in the area of 700-800 dives in before I was unable to get a tank pressed without a "C" card, thats the only reason I became certified. Many of the divers I went with were never certified, and were some of the most experienced and trusted partners I have ever been out with. I wonder how those of us that learned this way survived?

 

[ranger]

Give your friend a Discover Scuba course for Christmas...cost $75. Take him diving and kill him and it will cost you for the rest of your life.

 

[MoonWrasse]

My first dive was at age 12, in about 8' of water after being given about 15 min. worth of instruction from a non certified diver of many years. I never looked back, and had in the area of 700-800 dives in before I was unable to get a tank pressed without a "C" card, thats the only reason I became certified. Many of the divers I went with were never certified, and were some of the most experienced and trusted partners I have ever been out with. I wonder how those of us that learned this way survived?

I was watching Jacques Cousteau's TV program the other day. At the end of that segment they were showing sponge divers, and how by the age of 40 all become crippled.

Yes, there is a point to learning all that stuff taught in Scuba classes.

 

[pjomm]

My first dive was at age 12, in about 8' of water after being given about 15 min. worth of instruction from a non certified diver of many years. I never looked back, and had in the area of 700-800 dives in before I was unable to get a tank pressed without a "C" card, thats the only reason I became certified. Many of the divers I went with were never certified, and were some of the most experienced and trusted partners I have ever been out with. I wonder how those of us that learned this way survived?

DBG,

I guess I have a few concerns about your post... I do believe it is possible that some certified and even not certified could teach a dive buddy given enough experience, reading etc. I guess the question that pops into mind is - why?

Dive instruction has changed and has become more accessible from days gone by. The drop in cost makes it much more affordable. Why not have a professional train the person? I wouldn't go to a surgeon who learned from books, videos and friends and was good at operating and had no license. Why would I try a self professed dive instructor who wasn't certified? If I suffered injury at least with a certified instructor I know they have liability insurance and that certian minimum criteria were met before they could make this claim.

You received 15 minutes of dive instruction prior to your first dive...I am happy that you survived this long and you eventually became certified. Do you think that after 15 minutes you were capable of dealing with difficulties or problems? I have had students that take longer to clear their mask. I would hardly hold this example up as ideal, wise or prudent.

As for legailty in some places you are required to be certified. In the province of Quebec they require that you have provinicial certification to dive. Your current "c-card" would not allow you to dive there. If you fail to have the required certification and are caught you have committed the equivalent of a misdemeanor. From a legal perspective what a great foundation for a law suit.

All the best,

Paul

 

[jaycanwk]

My first 2 dives were non certified. My friend who is a very experienced scuba diver but not a scuba instructor, though he is a swimming instructor, took me out. At that time, I was an experienced swimmer and Lifeguard, so I was comfortable in the water. We went over a few basics in his backyard pool including a few safety drills, then out to the lake at his cottage. We didn't go deeper than 40' on both dives and they went fine. I later went on and got certified and have been addicted ever since.

Was this a nutty thing to have done on either of our parts?? Maybe. Was it risky?? Yes. Very much so. Would I recomend this senerio?? No. But it is not as black and white as what most people on this board would suggest, and I bet it happens more often then we would admit.

JASON ~~~

 

[H2Andy]

Was this a nutty thing to have done on either of our parts?? Maybe. Was it risky?? Yes. Very much so. Would I recomend this senerio?? No. But it is not as black and white as what most people on this board would suggest, and I bet it happens more often then we would admit.

well... i agree... 99% of the time it will probably be fine, and if there is a problem,
it would probably be taken care of so long as it's a shallow dive in a safe location.

but what *if*? what if this dive is that 1% that goes wrong? the consequences
could be catastrophic.

really, the thing to do is to get certified and learn how to use life-support equipment
in an alien environment with someone who really knows what he/she is doing.

 

[dbg40]

Im not talking about a 15 minute surgeon opening up my body to try and fix somthing that may be killing me, im not talking about a 15 minute pilot taking off in an aircraft to fly me to an almost certain death, im not talking about hurdling down the street in an automobile driven by a 15 minute driver. And I wasn't tought scuba by somone who ran mass scuba classes illegally. I think were taking things out of perspective just a little. On my first dive I could have suffered no more injury than if I had been swiming, and if disaster had reared its ugly head I could almost have stood up to save myself from certain doom. God did not one day create the scuba instructor, they came from a background of combined accumulative knowledge. I have seen surgeons that I would'nt let near me. I have seen the aftermath of poor judgement in some pilots. And I have been witness to drivers that make me stay in the house untill they have safely passed by! I take no issue with instruction being given in a very controlled setting by somone with training in that field. While I do not know SteveC's intent with a shallow lake dive, I would imagine it was to be the same as I had years ago, in a fiew feet of water. I will admit to the possibility of being a LITTLE to the left on this, Its just that I dont subscribe to the fits of hysteria I see in the diving industry as of late. (Possibly lawsuit driven) And I don't think that there was criminal intent on SteveCs mind when he thought of doing this. Some of the finest teachers I have had in my lifetime had the knowledge of experience, somthing I hold in high regard.
And I dont think that he had intentions of completing a full scuba course for his friend. Only my thoughts... But then I grew up in a world diferent from the one of today.

 

[JMcD]

Im not talking about a 15 minute surgeon opening up my body...

While I do not know SteveC's intent with a shallow lake dive, I would imagine it was to be the same as I had years ago, in a fiew feet of water. I will admit to the possibility of being a LITTLE to the left on this, Its just that I dont subscribe to the fits of hysteria I see in the diving industry as of late. (Possibly lawsuit driven) And I don't think that there was criminal intent on SteveCs mind when he thought of doing this. ...

And I dont think that he had intentions of completing a full scuba course for his friend. Only my thoughts... But then I grew up in a world diferent from the one of today.

dbg40,
You articulate your thoughts well and I think the point you are making has some value in a broad sense, but in this particular case, I see no reason for SteveC to follow-through on his idea when there are numerous options that will give his friend an experience safely and let SteveC know that he presented himself as a responsible diver who understands that there are risks to diving even in 4 feet of water.

But in that broad sense, I agree with you that society does have a tendancy to make some things look like dramatic violations of common sense when in fact they may not be quite that dramatic. I actually rode a bike as a kid without a helmet! I used a skateboard on the Street and not in a park, and didn't dream of knee/wrist/ankle/ pads. Having said that, I know that today there are alternatives to what I did that are more safe than I experienced and I would want for my kids and for those I know to benefit from what I know today.

While there are always examples of risky activity that went fine with no injury/issue/ etc. That doesn't mean that the risky activity wasn't risky, just that the risk didn't materialize. It may be that SteveC may be able to take his friend out and have nothing happen - It may be (and likely is the case) that this does happen very often, but given that SteveC asked an Opinion on it, I have to say that there are better ways for his friend to get the experience.

just my 2 cents

 

[The Chairman]

It is ScubaBoard policy that NO ONE should be encouraged to dive without proper instruction from a certified Scuba instructor. As a Message Board we are committed to Dive Safety and feel that both OW and Cave diving are not environments suitable for learning by experimentation. Enough divers have given their lives for our sport and we don't need any more to die needlessly.
NetDoc

 

[del_mo]

You should know that shallow water can be more dangerous than deeper water in regards o an embolism.

Would you explain this? Are you referring to a shallow dive or ascending from a deeper depth?