Diver death in Lake Minnewanka, Alberta, Canada

[Crush]

Please do not make any comments like that. Having lived there and dove there and trained there for several years, never...never have I heard, seen, or heard any whisper of practise like that. Please leave speculation out of it. If u dont have all the facts let due course prevail. All I can say is that my support and heart goes out to all involved.

You have never seen a student get in the water with 2400, or even 2000 psi in their tank?! Ever?! Wow!

 

[DaleC]

I've known more than a few divers go in with less than full tanks (myself included) so it isn't unheard of as mp states. It also doesn't have much to do with the incident either so perhaps it should be split off if people really want to debate the practice.

I echo Pfc's comments too. It seems to me that there has been a rash of divers deaths this last year or two in western canada but no reporting on them collectively. I can think of 4-5 right off the top of my head without checking which seems high for such a safe sport.

 

[icediver]

I've known more than a few divers go in with less than full tanks (myself included) so it isn't unheard of as mp states. It also doesn't have much to do with the incident either so perhaps it should be split off if people really want to debate the practice.

I echo Pfc's comments too. It seems to me that there has been a rash of divers deaths this last year or two in western canada but no reporting on them collectively. I can think of 4-5 right off the top of my head without checking which seems high for such a safe sport.

What you do is one thing. A dive Instructor allowing a student to go in the water with a partial tank is something else.

 

[PfcAJ]

Dale, its not just in Canada, its everywhere.

 

[DaleC]

What you do is one thing. A dive Instructor allowing a student to go in the water with a partial tank is something else.

Kinda depends on whatch're doing don'tya think? I'd rather have an instructor that understands actual gas volume requirements and knows how to calculate them than one that just knows full/empty. Those instructors might also be able to pass that skill on to their students instead of just saying "return to the surface with 500psi".
But anyways, probably has nothing to do with the incident at hand.

Dale, its not just in Canada, its everywhere.

I am going to try and collect some data from our region and correlate the results. Seems like something someone should do.

 

[icediver]

Kinda depends on whatch're doing don'tya think? I'd rather have an instructor that understands actual gas volume requirements and knows how to calculate them than one that just knows full/empty. Those instructors might also be able to pass that skill on to their students instead of just saying "return to the surface with 500psi".
But anyways, probably has nothing to do with the incident at hand.



Maybe we should talk about SAC rates while we are at it.

 

[Tim_Barker]

I personally have dove with less than a full tank, I was just referring to instructors and students during open water. Not saying it doesn't happen, just that I haven't seen it.

Anyway on to the important detail, has anyone heard more of the incident?

 

[Crush]

I echo Pfc's comments too. It seems to me that there has been a rash of divers deaths this last year or two in western canada but no reporting on them collectively. I can think of 4-5 right off the top of my head without checking which seems high for such a safe sport.

I agree with DaleC and PfcAJ - from my limited time on the board, here is the general order of occurrence of an accident or incident:

1. Someone posts it on SB;
2. Soon there is a link to a newspaper article which indicates that the diver was breathing oxygen and at a depth of 140 meters;
3. Someone posts which dive shop was running the dive;
4. A day later a different newspaper follows up on the report, including the diver's status (this assumed not dead at the scene);
5. Police investigate, foul play is not suspected;
6. Diving gear is sent for analysis;
7. The police, once satisfied that the diver was not strangled by his/her dive buddy, are only too happy to hand off the incident to the appropriate provincial underwater council;
8. The underwater council, while well-meaning, is understaffed, largely volunteer, and lacks any powers to place witnesses under oath, serve subpoenas, or compel testimony. A witness can lie before them with impunity and can refuse any request for information;
9. Based upon the quality information gathered in 8, above, the underwater council issues a twenty to thirty page report on the incident, over 75% of which is fore-matter and appendices which appear in every one of their reports. No one is ever found to be negligent since no one is ever stupid enough to self-incriminate before the council. The verdict is therefore always a medical condition or diving beyond one's abilities (which was hidden from the operator); and
10. Nothing ever changes.

Please note that I don't mean to state that anything must change, or that every accident is the fault of an operator. The truth is that we simply don't know because, unless the deceased diver's buddy left his monogrammed dive knife protruding from the victim's chest, all effective investigations cease once the police assume that it was not a homicide.

 

[icediver]

WoW Did you come up with that all by yourself.

Now tell us how it should be done in your expert opinion.

It looks to me that you do alot more diving with your laptop than you do in the water.

 

[Crush]

WoW Did you come up with that all by yourself.

Now tell us how it should be done in your expert opinion.

It looks to me that you do alot more diving with your laptop than you do in the water.

Yes, icediver, I did come up with that all by myself. You must have been impressed by my clarity of thought and my power summary. In a similar fashion, I was impressed by you thoughtful response, your eloquence, and your keen ability to fashion a logical, well-thought argument - you have my congratulations and respect, Sir. You are destined for greatness.

If you want a tip, point out again my limited number of dives - it clearly effects my ability to read, reflect, and summarize. If I dived more, like you, I would be able to make more informed posts on any subject... Hmm... Nope... I read your post and mine over again... I think that, in our case, the number of dives is inversely proportionate to the clarity of the post.

Better luck next time.