Diver Death in Cayman

[pilot fish]

I give up.

Sorry. I'm not being argumentative, honestly, I'm just reminding you of what OP said, what was PADI recommendations and how the fatality could have been avoided, had a minimal amount of care be taken. DIVE Op and DM are first in a chain of mistakes.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Again the minimal amount of care exercised should have been done first in Colorado by the instructor there who DID NOT DO HIS/HER JOB in preparing the deceased for checkout dives! They did not instill a sense of personal responsibility, convey the reasons for depth limit recommendations, and most of all the good sense to say "Hell No" to this kind of dive profile! And finally the responsibility of the diver to make sure they got the training required to dive safely. This was clearly not done or they would not have been there in the first place.

 

[CDNScubaMoose]

Giving the DM/DG a 100% of the blame might not be accurate, at this point. First we have to find out if the Dive Op told the DG/DM that he was a new diver and be mindful of him. If he was told that by the Dive Op then he is 99% to blame. If he was NOT told that by dive op then dive op is 99% to blame. Keep in mind that Op says in this thread that DM/DG was told that deceased was a BRAND NEW DIVER by deceased himself, girlfriend and OP. Also, keep in mind that Op stated in this thread that the autopsy showed deceased was otherwise healthy, no heart or drugs etc. Draw your own conclusion, riger.

Pilot Fish, you have offered some excellent insight to this thread and for that I thank you but I disagree with your suggestion that 99% of the blame should be shouldered EITHER by the DM (sorry - I don't buy the DG argument) OR
the dive operator. As others have suggested the diver in question had the right to decline to do this dive, assuming his original instructor had taught him that (personally I think it is common sense that you have the right to say no to any activity but common sense isn't always so common) and he had retained (and understood the reasoning behind that information) that information. So my question to you, since you seem to be in contact with people that are closer to this incident - did he know he had some personal responsibility, or did he assume that the DM would look after him no matter what? If the latter then I agree with JimLap that the trail of guilt has to lead back to his original instructor.

 

[cerich]

Again the minimal amount of care exercised should have been done first in Colorado by the instructor there who DID NOT DO HIS/HER JOB in preparing the deceased for checkout dives! They did not instill a sense of personal responsibility, convey the reasons for depth limit recommendations, and most of all the good sense to say "Hell No" to this kind of dive profile! And finally the responsibility of the diver to make sure they got the training required to dive safely. This was clearly not done or they would not have been there in the first place.

here's the rub with your comments above Jim, another INSTRUCTOR that signed the diver off felt that the indstructor back in CO did a good enough job...

There seems like a lot of bad judgement calls were made all around here.

 

[cerich]

For the sake of argument, let's blame the DM 100% for the wrongful death of the deceased, it still does not explain the details of what went wrong, equipment failure, narcotic effect, disorientation, etc... and that is the point I am trying to make. Without any additional blame being handed out, what were the physical reasons for this tragedy occurring?

Regards
Richard

No, lets not blame hime 100%, it isn't his blame to that degree. HOWEVER he was the last PROFESSIONAL contact with the deceased. He was in the position to do something so the outcome was different.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

And that should really scare the crap out of anyone!

here's the rub with your comments above Jim, another INSTRUCTOR that signed the diver off felt that the indstructor back in CO did a good enough job...

There seems like a lot of bad judgement calls were made all around here.

 

[Thalassamania]

We're coming full circle:

• Does the facility bear some responsibility? Clearly yes.
• Does the DM bear some responsibility? Clearly yes.
• Does the new diver bear some responsibility? Clearly yes.
• Does the Colorado Instructor bear some responsibility? Clearly yes.
• Does the local Instructor bear some responsibility? Clearly yes.

The real question is how to partition it.[/quote]

 

[Web Monkey]

Thread moved to Basic SCUBA as per the Chairman of the Board.

 

[Thalassamania]

You are correct about the two critical items:

1. if any one of the parties had done their job fully, then the accident probably doesn't happen.
2. no matter where the blame can be partitioned, that 100% of the cost of the accident falls on the victim.

The only way to have divers fulfill their part is for them to understand #2.

The only way to have everyone else fulfill their part is, unfortunately, to sue the bastards.

 

[Web Monkey]

Pilot Fish, you have offered some excellent insight to this thread and for that I thank you but I disagree with your suggestion that 99% of the blame should be shouldered EITHER by the DM (sorry - I don't buy the DG argument) OR
the dive operator.

It's not really that the DM has 100% of the blame, it's just that it's not possible to hand out 233% of the blame since the decisions were all in series.

The original instructor should have made a point about personal safety and responsibility (and maybe he did). Nobody knows. It's possible that this would have given the deceased the insight necessary to refuse the dive. However given the historically poor judgement of new-anything (divers, drivers, skiers, whatever), it's unlikely that this would have been enough.

However both the dive op and the DM had an absolutely certain, 100% effective method of keeping the new diver within his limits (both PADI and actual experiential limits), and that would be to have both dives over a hard bottom within his range.

If either one had done their job, the deceased wouldn't be deceased.

Terry