DIR- Generic Diver attitude! Be careful, experienced divers...

[boulderjohn]

PADI teaches you that mask on forehead is a sign of panic. Other agencies teach you to not panic.

Let's please put that to rest.

PADI teaches that equipment rejection is one sign of panic. That can especially include the regulator and the mask. A panicked diver may shove the mask off of the face, but in that case, the diver will also display other signs of panic. You are supposed to look at the entire situation to conclude that a diver is in panic. A diver casually climbing the boat ladder with the mask on the forehead is not in panic, and PADI does not say such a diver should be considered to be in a panic.

Unfortunately, some people do teach that, but that is the individual repeating something he or she heard somewhere else along the line. PADI as an agency does not teach that. IMO, it all stems from the unfortunate wording on the old final exam, in which mask on the forehead was the correct choice for signs of panic on a multiple choice question. Instructors preparing students for that exam probably stressed that in their final reviews.

 

[tarponchik]

Let's please put that to rest.

PADI teaches that equipment rejection is one sign of panic. That can especially include the regulator and the mask. A panicked diver may shove the mask off of the face, but in that case, the diver will also display other signs of panic. You are supposed to look at the entire situation to conclude that a diver is in panic. A diver casually climbing the boat ladder with the mask on the forehead is not in panic, and PADI does not say such a diver should be considered to be in a panic.

Unfortunately, some people do teach that, but that is the individual repeating something he or she heard somewhere else along the line. PADI as an agency does not teach that. IMO, it all stems from the unfortunate wording on the old final exam, in which mask on the forehead was the correct choice for signs of panic on a multiple choice question. Instructors preparing students for that exam probably stressed that in their final reviews.

A mask on forehead underwater is likely to be a sign of panic...

 

[boulderjohn]

A mask on forehead underwater is likely to be a sign of panic...

...and it will also be accompanied by other signs.

 

[Dapper Dan]

PADI teaches you that mask on forehead is a sign of panic. Other agencies teach you to not panic.

Yeah I can see that. Diver is in a panic. He stops and says, "Hold up. Let me stop and put my mask on my forehead so the others will know I'm in a panic". LOL

I encountered a smarty-pants instructor who saw me at the dive shop one time with my mask on my forehead after getting off the boat because my hands were full of dive gear, who tapped me on the shoulder and asked me if I was in distress.... I was sort of confused at first because I had forgotten I had the thing up there. It took about 5 seconds for me to get his sarcasm. His excuse was the dive instructors think you're in distress when you have your mask on your forehead.

My reply was, "What bothers me more than a guy with a mask on his forehead is a supposedly trained SCUBA professional who can't tell the difference between a guy in panic and a guy with a mask on his forehead."

Now I can agree with the lost mask excuse. I've had masks washed off my forehead in the waves. I Found one; didn't find the other. The way I feel about that is, when the SCUBA instructor starts buying me my gear, then he can dictate how I wear it. Until then it's my mask, my money, and as "W" said when he chose to keep Donald Rumsfeld and the Generals didn't like it, "I'm the decider".

 

[Dapper Dan]

A mask on forehead underwater is likely to be a sign of panic...

Not in itself.

It's like "reasonable suspicion". Mask on forehead in itself alone isn't a definitive sign on panic. The determination should be based on a reasonable common-sense decision.

It's like when I was a cop. There's a guy walking down the sidewalk at 2am. There's no reasonable suspicion to stop and question him. Walking down the sidewalk at 2am might be odd, but it doesn't mean there's anything wrong going on. But if he's a guy walking down the sidewalk at 2am, the liquor store was robbed 10 minutes ago, and he's wearing a blue shirt like the robber, then there's reasonable suspicion to do a Terry stop and question him.
Generally you want to avoid making a decision based on just one qualifier from a set of many.

The only time I rescued a diver that I didn't actually reasonably suspect was in distress was a diver that had surfaced about 400 feet from the boat. I couldn't see him well enough to make a reasonable determination if he was surface swimming or "splashing around in a panic". His motions looked odd, so I erred on caution and cut anchor and went to get him. Turns out somehow he was trying to load his speargun, it had slipped off his hip or something, and the butt slammed into his knee. He was in pain so he surfaced and he only had one leg to swim with. I killed the engine and threw the line out for him to grab as we coasted past him. First thing he said was, "Damn man, I'm so glad you came to get me."

 

[BoltSnap]

had slipped off his hip or something, and the butt slammed into his knee.

Good thing it slammed into his knee not his nuts. He would have been in a much worse shape if it did. He was very lucky.

 

[chiayx]

i dont mind even if its a mile long, as long as it not dragging at the bottom, tossing up broken corals or sediments... but sometimes i dont like to go sandy bottom with new divers.. they really do kickup a lot of sendiments..

one time, taking macro on nudibranch.. adjusting composition.. took a shot, damn not good enough.. breathe in a little bit harder.. body moves up slightly.. PERFECT... about to take a shot, BAMMM sendiments come between the nudi and my camera...

 

[boulderjohn]

Yeah I can see that. Diver is in a panic. He stops and says, "Hold up. Let me stop and put my mask on my forehead so the others will know I'm in a panic". LOL

Let's be clear on the difference between a sign and a signal.

A sign is something that people will observe to lead them to a conclusion. The person being observed is not intentionally trying to communicate what is being observed. A bright red face on a hot day is a sign of heat stroke.

A signal is a conscious attempt by someone to communicate a message. A diver's waggling hand motion is a signal that he or she is having some kind of a problem.

 

[Dapper Dan]

Let's be clear on the difference between a sign and a signal.

A sign is something that people will observe to lead them to a conclusion. The person being observed is not intentionally trying to communicate what is being observed. A bright red face on a hot day is a sign of heat stroke.

A signal is a conscious attempt by someone to communicate a message. A divers waggling hand motion is a signal that he or she is having some kind of a problem.

That makes sense. Thanks.

 

[Zach The Diver]

Hi,

I just wanted to post about an incident that I witnessed and it turned ugly quite quickly.

I consider myself an experienced diver, certified full cave TDI, GUE tech, and have been diving for 20 years with thousands of dives on hand. That said, I was on a "mixed" boat with technical and recreational divers and one of the obviously new divers criticized a long hose setup saying "this is not PADI standard". That's it, that's all what he said. Instead of the experienced diver taking a minute to explain what it is, he told the new diver "you don't teach me what is standard you PADI fart". Of course, the new diver didn't take it a well, and an ugly quarrel ensued. Because the boat was full of advanced divers, it felt like a pack of wolves were encircling the guy. I found myself intervening on the side of the new diver and asking people to calm down and remember that they were all once new divers and he may even be better than them when they first started.

Of course, the new diver never showed up for more dives.

No matter how experienced you are, be humble, explain, and don't add to the reputation of divers being an arrogant community. You would only put off people from joining the community, and the industry will suffer.

Cheers

PADI? Standard? Never thought I’d see those words together in the same sentence.