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Dive Tigger
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Thank you so much, MtnPlayVA. I have forwarded this link to some people I know in the dive industry. Information like this is SO important!
Dive accidents - why so little information afterwards?
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themagni
Contributor
Another factor is that if somebody does live through it they might be too embarrased to tell you exactly what happened.
lamont
Contributor
Keep in mind that there's nobody (at least in the US) who is responsible for publishing the cause of death to the diving community. The cops and the ME are going to investigate, primarily in case anything criminal happened, anything negligent happened, and to provide information to the family. And that is basically all they're answerable to -- the legal system and the family. The dive community has precisely zero representation in the process. The media finds out some details, but like someone posted they're in the business of entertainment and once it ceases to become entertaining anymore they stop doing the hard work to find out what happened.
The last accident that I was involved in, we did manage to piece together what happened -- but that was because the cop whose case it was took an interest (possibly due to the age of the victim, and because the officer was also a diver) and he swung by to talk with us multiple times in the parking lot and shared information and we managed to all come away basically on the same page about what happened during the accident. We then posted the information in public, which was useful in suppressing some of the misinformation that was already spreading. But if you didn't have an interested officer, and have the three of us who were involved, but detached enough to be observers, then there's no reason for anyone else to post any kind of investigation to "the community".
There's really not much of a CSI team assigned to these kinds of cases. Most of the time when its straightforwards drowning or barotrauma, the ME most likely does their job and reports the clinical cause of death, and then as long as there's no negligence or criminal suspicion, the legal investigation is going to be very minimal. Without a lawsuit or criminal suspicion, absolutely nobody involved has the job of finding out what happened in the accident.
The last accident that I was involved in, we did manage to piece together what happened -- but that was because the cop whose case it was took an interest (possibly due to the age of the victim, and because the officer was also a diver) and he swung by to talk with us multiple times in the parking lot and shared information and we managed to all come away basically on the same page about what happened during the accident. We then posted the information in public, which was useful in suppressing some of the misinformation that was already spreading. But if you didn't have an interested officer, and have the three of us who were involved, but detached enough to be observers, then there's no reason for anyone else to post any kind of investigation to "the community".
There's really not much of a CSI team assigned to these kinds of cases. Most of the time when its straightforwards drowning or barotrauma, the ME most likely does their job and reports the clinical cause of death, and then as long as there's no negligence or criminal suspicion, the legal investigation is going to be very minimal. Without a lawsuit or criminal suspicion, absolutely nobody involved has the job of finding out what happened in the accident.
JG109
Contributor
I agree with previous posters:
1) Liability- lawsuits
2) Respect for the family
Plus a couple other points
3) The Press is notorious for both mis-reporting the facts (does "oxygen tank" sound familiar in a non-tech diver accident) as well as doing a hatchet job on the dive operator, even when cause of death appears to be medical-heart attack etc and not suspicious.
4) Time- except for very large Police Depts, the press officer is usually churning out press releases along with his full time case load. Combine a non-suspicious death with a medical examiner's report that can take 2-3 months to get to the police and the non-suspicious case is closed without any further press.
1) Liability- lawsuits
2) Respect for the family
Plus a couple other points
3) The Press is notorious for both mis-reporting the facts (does "oxygen tank" sound familiar in a non-tech diver accident) as well as doing a hatchet job on the dive operator, even when cause of death appears to be medical-heart attack etc and not suspicious.
4) Time- except for very large Police Depts, the press officer is usually churning out press releases along with his full time case load. Combine a non-suspicious death with a medical examiner's report that can take 2-3 months to get to the police and the non-suspicious case is closed without any further press.
The DAN reports are fairly detailed. The first link is from an older abstract but summarizes the data well. The second two are the 2006 and 2005 fatality reports, respectively.
[abstract] TEN YEARS OF DIVING FATALITY EPIDEMIOLOGY: THE DIVERS ALERT NETWORK DATABASE, 1989-1998.
Report on Decompression Illness, Diving Fatalities, and Project Dive Exploration. (2006)
Report on Decompression Illness, Diving Fatalities, and Project Dive Exploration. (2005)
[abstract] TEN YEARS OF DIVING FATALITY EPIDEMIOLOGY: THE DIVERS ALERT NETWORK DATABASE, 1989-1998.
Report on Decompression Illness, Diving Fatalities, and Project Dive Exploration. (2006)
Report on Decompression Illness, Diving Fatalities, and Project Dive Exploration. (2005)
Hatul
Contributor
More likely to say trying to save a buddy may kill you.
ScubaDad1968
Registered
While I am always learning and wanting to be a safe diver, I looked into dive accident statistics from PADI to see if there are things I could learn from those who have gone before me.
Unless I was reading this wrong, I was surprised to find that of all of the scuba related deaths in the past 10 years;
60% were health related. As they were divers who were significantly overweight or in some cases had heart issues that were not treated or unknown.
Also
I found it interesting that nearly half of scuba diver deaths involved divers with less than 30 dives logged.
These stats tell me that the two most important things I could do to be safe would be to be healthy, in shape and practice-practice-practice. Gaining experience which keeps you relaxed, anxiety free and sharp thinking is paramount.
---------- Post added November 27th, 2012 at 06:57 PM ----------
Let me correct my last post. I believe the stats were from DAN not PADI.
Unless I was reading this wrong, I was surprised to find that of all of the scuba related deaths in the past 10 years;
60% were health related. As they were divers who were significantly overweight or in some cases had heart issues that were not treated or unknown.
Also
I found it interesting that nearly half of scuba diver deaths involved divers with less than 30 dives logged.
These stats tell me that the two most important things I could do to be safe would be to be healthy, in shape and practice-practice-practice. Gaining experience which keeps you relaxed, anxiety free and sharp thinking is paramount.
---------- Post added November 27th, 2012 at 06:57 PM ----------
Let me correct my last post. I believe the stats were from DAN not PADI.
Ashleyallen0524
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Maybe they gather more information and evidence. And as much as possible they keep them confidential to the public. Maybe when everything is clear and solved, they will announce them to the public.
Could it be that most people still judge a dive pro / dive operation by the accidents / incidents they have rather then go:
"I think I'll go with those who have some accidents as this demonstrates they should know better now since they've got the experience?"
Last year a dive pro got drifted with 5 students/divers for some 24 hours. I told him that he has experience money can't buy since he now knows the currents in that area that much better. He firmly believes he should not teach anymore.
Some 4 years back there was an accident involving a night diver ascending (uncontrolled?) into a moving prop. Word on the internet in local scuba forums by midnight local time (some 3 to 4 hours after the incident) was that the diver had lost an arm, the head and had gashes all over the body. Reality out at sea was there were deep gashes on the forehead and on the lower arms. Makes one wonder about sharing incidents?
"I think I'll go with those who have some accidents as this demonstrates they should know better now since they've got the experience?"
Last year a dive pro got drifted with 5 students/divers for some 24 hours. I told him that he has experience money can't buy since he now knows the currents in that area that much better. He firmly believes he should not teach anymore.
Some 4 years back there was an accident involving a night diver ascending (uncontrolled?) into a moving prop. Word on the internet in local scuba forums by midnight local time (some 3 to 4 hours after the incident) was that the diver had lost an arm, the head and had gashes all over the body. Reality out at sea was there were deep gashes on the forehead and on the lower arms. Makes one wonder about sharing incidents?
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