Disadvantages of DIR ?

[Rubis]

the name alone is disturbing, implying that we are doing it wrong.

It's like Dive Rite ... same same ... It is just a name ...

 

[underwater daphne]

yeah, i guess.

 

[novadiver]

The proper term is Horse Holing

noun: Horse Holl (hôrs hol)
1-A dead horse that has been beat down a rat hole.

verb: Horse Holed, Horse Holing
1-Beating a dead horse into an existing rat hole.
2-Creating a rat hole to beat a dead horse into.
3-The bloody mess of a dead horse which was beaten into a rat hole.

At this piont , I'm sure you all will agree, that if PETA finds out what we did to this horse we're all in big trouble.Now lets go dive, and if we come back alive ,we can call it DIR.

 

[headhunter]

yeah i guess. i'm still not to fond after what i read. the name alone is disturbing, implying that we are doing it wrong.

[Someone from the DIR camp please correct me if I get the origin of the name wrong. For the record, I am not yet DIR and don't want to misrepresent DIR or GUE.]

The name was given to them in a magazine article talking about the success of a project called the Woodville Karst Plain Project (WKPP) where the "founders" of DIR and GUE were the leaders of this world record setting group of divers. The name was used by the public for their system of diving in this harsh environment as a result of this article. This happened long before the actual organization ever came into being.

As some one else just pointed out there is a gear manufacturer named Dive-Rite, but you don't hear anyone complaining that this implies that every other manufacturer's equipment is considered "Dive-Wrong".

My feeling is that if the DIR system looked exactly like the other systems that were already out there, no one would ever have had a problem with the name.

I'll use the analogy of Olympians training for competition to make another point. These are a group of athletes that have the desire to train to a higher level than your average athlete or weekend jogger. No one has a problem with it when they say that in order to "achieve certain results" you have to "do things a certain way". It's just common sense that you have to do something more or different to quallify for Olympic competition.

As a result you probably don't see an Olympic athlete spending a lot of time with the average guy trying to loose some of the extra weight he has gained. He will more than likely spend more time with like-minded individuals who are more perfomance oriented. It's just a matter of compatability.

Olympians may tell you that for optimal results you should do things in certain ways, but they probably don't really care if you as an individual are willing to go to those lengths. If you're happy continuing to do what you've always done and getting the same results that you've always gotten, then I'm sure they are happy to let you do that. Just in case you are interested, they might let you know what they've learned through a lot of hard work on their part. If you're not interested, no big deal.

Likewise, proponents and practitioners of DIR (at least the ones that I have met personally), are OK with however you want to dive. They may choose to dive with like-minded individuals, just as the Olympic athlete may choose to train with someone that would be a better fit with their methods.

One thing you should try to understand is that the origins of DIR come from putting together a system to keep extreme underwater explorers alive in a very harsh environment. These are people who dive to a depth of over 300 feet while at the same time penetrating a cave system to a distance of over 18,000 feet. If you want to live while doing something like that, you'd better have a very well thought out system to do it with. I would also venture to guess that the procedures on a dive like that would be very strict and standardized.

These same explorers are of the opinion that these safety measures could be used in any recreational environment. The desire to teach this information to others probably stems from a desire to increase the level of safety for your average diver.

Daphne, for you to come into the middle of a flame war and make a determination about an entire sytem based on a lot of skewed information makes it seem like you're a little "quick to judge". I think you'd be "throwing the baby out with the bathwater."

I believe that one of the reasons that this DIR forum is supposed to be a "no trolling zone" is so that people like yourself, who have apparantly not been exposed to the DIR philosophy before, can more easily determine what the system is really about. This thread makes it very difficult to separate fact from fiction. Unfortunately for you, this thread is now the only thing you have to base your opinions on. So, I think that to render an opinion without knowing the facts would be doing yourself a dis-service. I'm not saying that you should "be" DIR, but that you should "understand" what it is to be DIR before you pass judgement on a whole segment of the dive population. Otherwise, you in essense would be doing the very thing you accuse them of.

I hope this makes sense. As I mentioned before, I am not a DIR diver. Everything that I have written is merely my opinion and if I've written anything that misrepresents the facts, I hope that it is corrected by a DIR diver who knows what the correct information is.

Christian

 

[MSilvia]

the name alone is disturbing, implying that we are doing it wrong.

Maybe if you took it in context, it wouldn't be so disturbing. The "It" in DIR doesn't necessarily mean the kind of diving you do. If you were to attempt the kinds of diving that advanced DIR divers do without the sort of protocols DIR divers use to do them safely, you might very well never come back. In that sense, they Do It Right.

If you're only doing reef dives in 60 feet of seawater, it doesn't matter nearly as much, and there's nothing wrong with thoughtful and skilled application of standard recreational practices in that situation. Unless of course you plan to progress into that kind of diving and are reinforcing what will later become bad habits.

That said, a lot of recreational divers could easily and unfortunately be described as doing it wrong, and that has nothing to do with DIR.

 

[jbd]

[Someone from the DIR camp please correct me if I get the origin of the name wrong. For the record, I am not yet DIR and don't want to misrepresent DIR or GUE.]

The name was given to them in a magazine article talking about the success of a project called the Woodville Karst Plain Project (WKPP) where the "founders" of DIR and GUE were the leaders of this world record setting group of divers. The name was used by the public for their system of diving in this harsh environment as a result of this article. This happened long before the actual organization ever came into being.
Christian

From what I can recall, the "Doing It Right" label came from some comments made by GI3 to Florida state officials when setting up the WKPP to explore that cave system. In essence GI3 told them that they would do it right i.e they would plan the dives thoroughly, they would train themselves thoroughly and they would do whatever they could do to reduce the overall risks involved to the lowest possible level. The state officials accepted this and GI3 et al set out to do what they said they would do. The safety record of the WKPP is outstanding as a result of this effort.

The above comments are based on my recollection of an article I read about 10 years ago about DIR and GI3. If any of it is incorrect please accept my apologies and make any corrections.

For those who feel that DIR is rigid, please examine the kinds of dives that were and are done by the divers on the WKPP and you may then understand their perspective on team diving and standardization of technique, gas mixes and equipment.

 

[rjchandler]

I think "doing it right"" or some variant appeared in NAUI course materials in the 1980's as a slogan to encourage divers to follow safe diving practices. Ialso think it first appeared on the internet as a slogan ie --all you other divers shouldfollow these standard practices we cave divers are using then you will be "doing it right". About this time Halcon appeared to supply gear to divers who wanted to "do it right". GUE came along later.

 

[Mandy3206]

The only problem with DIR is the arrogance that some of their advocates radiate, of course not every DIR diver is like this but just a few mange to repell the majority of people interested in it.

I myself I'm very interested in DIR gear and methods, but refuse to make it a Straight Jacket, so I guess that I couldn't be DIR even if I wanted.

Just chill out and expose your philosophy in a more inviting way and don't try to shove it down everyones throat.

Just drop the chip on the shoulder and care to teach us the mere mortals the way you think diving should be done, we don't know everything, but neither do you, lets share knowledge and let everyone decide what's best for each.

I personally can and will benefeit from many of DIR methods and will use them for sure.

 

[The Fresh Prince]

The only problem with DIR is the arrogance that some of their advocates radiate, of course not every DIR diver is like this but just a few mange to repell the majority of people interested in it.

I myself I'm very interested in DIR gear and methods, but refuse to make it a Straight Jacket, so I guess that I couldn't be DIR even if I wanted.

Just chill out and expose your philosophy in a more inviting way and don't try to shove it down everyones throat.

Just drop the chip on the shoulder and care to teach us the mere mortals the way you think diving should be done, we don't know everything, but neither do you, lets share knowledge and let everyone decide what's best for each.

I personally can and will benefeit from many of DIR methods and will use them for sure.

and how many DIR divers do you know and dive with? or is this all your impression from the negative posts from non DIR divers?

 

[kidspot]

Headhunter - I like your description above - It's the impression I've been left with after following the DIR forum intently for the past several months as well. I fail to see the arrogant attitude that some have found, (except from a few that seem to rail against DIR methodology) rather I have been blessed by a gracious group of divers eager to share with a complete novice what they have discovered through their years of combined experience, and often putting up with my very naive inquiries. I do not know that I will ever be a "DIR" diver, just as I will probably never be an olympic athlete, but it does give me patterns to strive after, and examples to learn from. In reality I get the impression from many of those who have been so patient with me that they do not see themselves as having "achieved" DIR status, but rather they continually grow toward it as their goal - perhaps that is what truly makes them DIR - not arrival, but growth towards a common ideal of being the safest most effective dive teams they can be.

Tim

P.S. Has anyone else noticed that DIR protocols seem to change occassionaly . . . Even the system itself accepts the idea of growth from experience, making it a continually growing and changing set of ideals based upon what has been learned and observed.