Dema show???

[cerich]

Mike Chapman, who was President at the time, started bringing proper governance to DEMA. This included things like audits and the such. One of the issues discussed was Bob Gray was in his early sixties and there was no transition plan in place. What we discussed at the executive sessions of the BOD, was to have Bob work with us to recruit his eventual replacement. We (the BOD) felt that we needed Bob's co-operation in making this happen. It is my opinion that Bob felt insecure of his position and felt the BOD had plans to eliminate him, which was absolutely untrue.

In his paranoia he decided to launch a fall show at the Sands Convention Center. The BOD got wind of this and the Executive Committee (Betsy Royal, Tim Peloza, and Mike Chapman) met with our lawyer, Ed Towle, to discuss what to do. It was decided that Ed would be sent to have a talk with Bob and state to him (Bob) "Either explain or resign". Apparently in the discussions Ed told Bob that the BOD was ready to fire Bob, so Bob resigned along with Shirley. The BOD was now in a panic as we had no one to run the show as the whole management organization was Bob Gray, his wife Shirley, and one or two of their children running the thing out of a second home Bob owned.

I always felt Bob was not on the up and up and when I joined the BOD wanted to get rid of him. When I found out there was a long term transition in place, it was something I could accept. All that being said, I wanted to ensure that he was being treated fairly. I called the Sands facility and talked to the persons in charge and confirmed that Bob was in fact trying to set up a competing trade show.

Shortly after Bob and Shirley resigned we get served with a age discrimination lawsuit by Bob and Shirley. At this point the BOD and especially the executive committee clams up. As it goes under the rules of discovery go the less you know the better. I never did learn of all the things that were dragged out of the muck and only I heard bits and pieces, which I have no factual basis to confirm the truth, so I will not repeat them here.

This thing gets the membership riled up. John Cronin and PADI sue us. The membership (which at the time was about 55 member companies) calls an emergency meeting with the BOD to have a recall election. Things are so heated that we actually hired a person to make sure Robert's Rules of Order was enforced. The meeting was held in Long Beach and the day before the meeting there was a large earthquake and during the meeting aftershocks were being felt. It was something that will forever be burned into my memory.

We came to an agreement with PADI that stopped the lawsuit and tried with some success to explain to the membership that this was something we did not start and were victims off. The BOD obviously survived the recall and the membership quit calling for our heads. There were many who felt we over-reacted buyt I will still defend the BOD. What are you supposed to do when your employee is tring to set up a competing show? What would you do?

fire him, sue him and do so in a public fashion.

 

[USIA]

I think I've learned more about DEMA in the last 3 pages than I had learned in 18 years of working for USIA. Everything Lee is saying is why we decided to bail 4 years ago and why many others are doing the same. I hope DEMA survives, but I also hope that new leadership will emerge.

 

[cerich]

I think I've learned more about DEMA in the last 3 pages than I had learned in 18 years of working for USIA. Everything Lee is saying is why we decided to bail 4 years ago and why many others are doing the same. I hope DEMA survives, but I also hope that new leadership will emerge.

Not under the "pay to play" voting system in place. It is not possible for meaningful or influential new leadership to emerge within DEMA.(unless somebody sets up enough $25,000/25 vote member companies with centralized control that exceeds those currently at play, but then the new is no better than the old...)

Reality is DEMA as an association won't go away, the same folks that "pay to play" with enough "separate corporate brands/entities" (just search the member roles and you will see who) will prop up DEMA because they obviously see a value in the control they wield. (wouln't it be fun to see the phone records of DEMA and see who REALLY is in charge)

What can change is the REAL majority of the dive industry can see DEMA for what it truly is and start fresh. That process is well underway.

Threads like this (which actually did start as I tried to decide if I want a booth at DEMA this year, which I still haven't decided....:shocked2 and the information it makes public is crucial to industry stakeholders as they work to chart a course for the current economy and the aftermath. Make no mistake even after this economy starts to recover those dive stores and manufs that do manage to survive this face a radically different industry than exists now, not having a plan for that will do for them what this economy by itself didn't.

 

[cerich]

I can't comment on any current "kickbacks".

.

how about some not so current for historical purpose only of course???

 

[Leadking]

how about some not so current for historical purpose only of course???

There were lots of rumors, but nothing that I could document. I heard MANY stories and from reliable sources but I have nothing that I would put in writing.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Thank you for your info. As a small independent I see so many things wrong with the way things are done and don't have to be. Tobin alluded to the tacoma show. Without getting into details as a representative, not only of myself, but SEI here on SB I feel the need to make a report and request to our BOD. Not exactly sure what that will be now but suffice it to say I felt that our attendance at Scubafest in Columbus Ohio was extremely productive for us. This is a smaller, regional show that attracts DIVERS. Some manufacturers were represented there such as Dive Rite and DUI. I would have liked to have seen more of them there. Do you need your whole DEMA size booth? No. That makes the cost go down. Price for 10x10 (yeah it's small but what do you REALLY need) for commercial exhibitors was less than 300 dollars including electric. We brought our own stuff in. The Ohio Council of Skin and Scuba Divers provided volunteeers who helped if you needed it at NO CHARGE! Sure it was only a 2 day show because of the bull sperm auction in the hall on friday night otherwise it would have been a 2 1/2 with friday evening for exhibitors to meet. But point is it was a good time and the manufacturers that were there got to talk to shop owners, instructors, and the public who spends money on the gear they are selling. There were also local shops who had booths and few instructors had tables of their own. Shows like DEMA and even to some extent ones like Our World and Beneath the Sea are getting too far away from scuba divers and this hurts all of us. I'd rather hit smaller shows where divers gather and those who make and sell equipment can do business. I don;t want to look at 50 resort booths to find a BPW manufacturer. If those of you who are in the business to sell gear would take a longer look at some of the smaller venues you may find it very productive. SEI has committed already to net year at Scubafest and paid for our space. I would really like to see Tobin, Chris, Scott(Zeagle), Doug Krause, Nick Hollis, and others I've done business with or have been in contact with for various issues over the last few years there. It is held around the 3rd weekend in March( I'll post the dates later when I can get to my calendar) but please consider it. In today's economy you need the people who dive locally to get through these times. Vacation divers are one shot deals if that usually. Support your base and they'll support you.

 

[mdb]

There were lots of rumors, but nothing that I could document. I heard MANY stories and from reliable sources but I have nothing that I would put in writing.

Lee: Good to see your good honest posts. We all have seen/heard the kickback stories, the big kickback for "selling" the show, other kickbacks and high rolling expense accounts, you saw much of that yourself.

You did a great job as a board member. At least you tried.

 

[Roz]

I want to ask the view of my fellow divers and Scubaboard members. I attended the DEMA show two years ago as an exhibitor, it did "OK" for my company. I am considering attending this year at Orlando, however it seems that virtually EVERY major manuf. has withdrawn from attending. My question is simple, is DEMA relevant?

It's difficult to organise a show. I've only co-organised one international technical diving conference (EuroTek.08) and so I write from that limited experience. The most important piece of advice we were given was "get the venue right" and then it starts falling into place.

When it comes to Venues, I do know that DEMA did listen to exhibitors and attendees about Houston and realised that many people were not happy with that destination, which is why it's recently been Vegas and Orlando. Two places where you can get decent exhibition space, a range of hotel accommodation from the sublime to the gor blimey, good national and international travel logistics, sunshine (hey everyone needs some sunshine for a few days), suitable venues for entertainment/networking in the evenings, and something fun for the non divers. I've attended every show for the last ten years (bar the last Orlando Show because I broke my leg and was banned from flying), therefore I've been to New Orleans, Miami, Houston, Vegas and Orlando. So I do feel that the show has listened and is trying to do their best venue wise, because DEMA rapidly pulled out of Houston and booked Orlando instead. (Remember, it's not all that easy to get the venue that you want at the time you need it because places get booked up years in advance).

I am also aware that you cannot please all the people all of the time and DEMA was pulled in two different directions with regard to timing. For the manufacturers, January was ideal. Ok, so it would inevitably clash with Boot (The big German Dive Show), but it was fairly quiet for dive centres thus it's so much easier to take time to come to something like DEMA. It was also cheaper because January is traditionally a quieter month than October hence you can get better deals on hotels, flights etc.

Holding it at the start of the year was ideal for many people because retailers would start considering what stock to carry and what direction they want to take their business in. And the meetings and equipment they had seen at DEMA would still be v. fresh in their minds. Therefore I can understand about the diving industry being reticent in the Autumn and not wanting to write an order when you are heading for the quiet season and Christmas. It's a time to hunker down and conserve your resources to get you through the winter. For the Dive Centres, holding DEMA in the Autumn is tough because that's the time our regional waters are the warmest, diving is still going on, and getting those couple of extra weeks of revenue in is crucial. And sometimes it's clashed with Halloween and Thanksgiving which doesn't matter a jot to the Europeans and a great deal to the local population.

I honestly can't comment on whether moving DEMA to the Autumn for the Travel Sector has increased bookings and been valuable to them or not. I don't know whether they have gained, I can see for sure that the manufacturers and dive centres have lost though.

I feel that there is a necessary requirement for a decent annual international show in the States. It's reasonably easy to get to from Europe, and there is a need for a yearly gathering. Networking and social interaction is vital for good business. I am sorry that so many manufacturers have pulled from the show this year. I understand why they have done it, and that they have achieved the results they needed spending their marketing budgets in a different manner.

I have no quick answers. It's very easy to stand on the sidelines and throw rocks and criticisms. It is another thing completely to get your hands dirty and participate. I would be happy to attend a smaller, international show and see all the manufacturers there. I am not too worried about the size and swishness of their stand. (Cleverly designed Popups are an ideal solution because you don't need to worry about drayage which is a huge financial killer). I would be attending to see the manufactures product. That is what is King to me. The ability to talk to the engineers and designers because they know how the product came about and can explain it better, and you end up with a thorough understanding. It then makes it easier for you to sell it.

As for what DEMA does day to day, I cannot comment on that because I live and work in England, therefore it has no impact over here.

I realise that this is an ultra simple statement, but perhaps if we listed what DEMA (Show and Day to Day) did well, and what they could do better or what you would like them to do better would be a constructive way forward at this point.

And for the record, I intend to come to DEMA this year because I feel it is an important useful show.

 

[captainfizz]

I have been diving for forty years, and as near as I can figure have about 4000 dives. Over the years I have had booth space at DEMA, Worked for Diveshops in their booths some years, and walked through at other shows, but it just ain't what it used to be. I live in Florida, and I don't think I will even walk through this year. Carl Fismer

 

[cerich]

So i just had a email exchange between Scubaboards own NETDOC and Tom at DEMA sent to me in a strange manner.

Pete (Netdoc), i love ya like a brother but you are WRONG to not want that exchange to be public. However i know why i wasn't included in the email you sent....

So here it is.
The first letter to DEMA from Scubaboard

Hello Tom and the entire DEMA Board,

While I feel almost certain that you have seen this thread on www.ScubaBoard.com, I would still feel remiss if I did not point it out: Dema show???

Again, I would like to offer my services to help DEMA improve its presence on the Internet. To that end, let me begin by presenting a few numbers from Alexa the Web Information Company. As you may, or may not know, Alexa gives rankings to all web sites and, like golf, the lower the score, the better. While there are many debates as to which rating system is best, I am sure youÃÍl find that the end results are about the same in regards to order and magnitude! Clicking on any of the following links will give you the particulars of each site according to Alexa.

ScubaBoard : 40,827
CDNN : 84,258
ScubaDiving : 147,722
XRay-Mag : 180,969
DivePhotoGuide : 215,867
SportDiver : 464,971
DiveNewsWire : 533,117
DEMA : 1,513,573
DiveIndustry Assoc : 22,442,625

There are some remarkable facts to be gleaned from this snapshot of the most prominent scuba related media sites, and I donÃÕ mean ScubaBoard being the clear leader. Look at who is number two: the scuba equivalent of the National Enquirer. Wow! The one site whose sole mission is to spread lies about the industry ranks head and shoulders above most of the scuba related media. ThatÃÔ a big deal and itÃÔ sad. However, we have to admit that they have mastered Internet Marketing 101.

On a bright note, itÃÔ good to see DEMA start to come out of its internet-phobic hole. The Facebook presence of Å£eaDiver.com and ŵheDEMAShow are good starts and itÃÔ possible that you will attract some divers that way as well. LetÃÔ hope so. But your effectiveness there is always going to be limited and letÃÔ face it: luck has a lot to do with it! Luck rarely suffices as a business or marketing plan. You need to do more, and frankly, the industry is expecting you to do far more.

Fact: we are in a recession or possibly a full blown depression. Lots of shops, many of which are DEMA members, are going out of business or finding it hard to make ends meet. If the metro-Orlando area is any measure of this, we are in sad shape indeed. Seven shops have closed in the last three years with only one opening. While I am positive that DEMA will give us a show this year, I am truly worried about many shops not being able to make it due to finances! If a number of the manufacturers are cutting it out of their budget, I can only imagine what decisions the smaller businesses are having to make.

Fact: America, as well as the rest of the world, has turned to the internet not only for retail but for travel purchases as well. Harris polls indicate that fully %95 of all travel booked in the US comes completely or in part due to the Internet. Many of your members are wondering why you seem to be net-a-phobic as an organization. You have a web site, and in reality, it ranks about average for most websites, but you are a marketing company. You should be close to or breaking that 100,000 mark! You simply canÃÕ have much of an impact for the industry with those kind of numbers. I am not trying to be harsh here, just realistic and frank.

Fact: In DEMAÃÔ presentation at Beneath the Sea on how to weather the current economic downturn, the internet was mentioned only once! Just once! It didnÃÕ even merit a slide in your Power Point presentation. I was not present to hear it, but I found that to be almost unbelievable. This is like straining a single hair out of your soup, only to miss the entire camel swimming in it! ItÃÔ apparent to most that you see the internet as the biggest problem facing the industry today, when it is actually the best solution we have. No, itÃÔ not the only solution, but it canÃÕ do any worse than what you have tried so far. On top of that, itÃÔ far, far cheaper! You donÃÕ have to spend a lot of money to make it big on the internet. I have one of the smallest IT budgets in the industry, and look what I have done. It doesnÃÕ take millions or even hundreds of thousands of dollars to make a huge impression on the internet. However, it does require that the industry (including DEMA) devote some resources to it.

So, after all of that unsolicited analysis, let me also make a few unsolicited suggestions.

BeADiver.com needs to be marketed aggressively on the Internet! The television ad is fine, but you are missing the lionÃÔ share of exposure on the net. Google ads, Facebook, CNN.com and even ScubaBoard are far cheaper and more effective in reaching MILLIONS on the internet. You need to be targeting web sites that are in the top 50,000 of AlexaÃÔ rating system, and really targeting those in the top 500. Advertising on the Internet is CHEAP compared to advertising in print.

DEMA.org needs to be marketed in the same way and it needs a true guerilla presence on forums and other social networks across the internet. Yes, that means not only on Dive related sites like ScubaBoard, but how about on boating and fishing forums too? Go to The largest Message Boards and Forums on the web! and take a gander at whatÃÔ out there. Hire an apprentice or an intern and make it their full time job to play on social networks! The results will amaze you. BTW, ScubaBoard is ranked #568 out of all the forums. Not too shabby!

Let ScubaBoard host a private forum for DEMA on ScubaBoard. It would be a great place for you to interact with industry leaders and dive shop owners in an open environment and discuss the issues and solutions facing the Scuba Industry today and its FREE. No reason to bust the budget when I am offering you a free venue! I already have www.DEMABoard.com set to go to our Shows and Events Forum and could easily shift it to a new DEMA forum in a heartbeat. As with all of our private forums, we always include a link to your website within it. That alone should cause your Alexa ranking to jump a bit in the right direction.

Post your media announcements right on ScubaBoard as well as other media! We have a special Scuba Industry News Forum for just that! We almost always highlight significant announcements in that forum on our monthly newsletter. ItÃÔ a win/win situation and you will find other industry people like Jason Heller doing the same thing! It pays to promote these things on ScubaBoard, even though itÃÔ absolutely free!

Let ScubaBoard take an active role in educating dive shops on how to use the internet at the DEMA Show. Somehow, I get the feeling you see this as some kind of sick info-mercial, which it is not. We target larger entities like Scuba manufacturers, tourist bureaus and large resorts to sell advertising to and not the average LDS. In fact, we discourage paid-for advertising on ScubaBoard or elsewhere for these individual shops and recommend that they learn and use Guerilla (free) advertising techniques instead. This class teaches them enough about social networking on the internet, from Facebook to forums and everything in between to get started. What to say, what not to say and how to use things like your signature to your advantage are some of the many topics covered. These are the very things that stop these would be guerilla marketers from making a difference for their bottom line. I think Jason HellerÃÔ presentations on the internet are great, but they are aimed more at the web-head in terms of SEOs (Search Engine Optimizers) as well as other methods to get your site as high in Google rankings as they can get it! Heck, he has some solid figures to back his expertise up at that. But what the shops really need, is an ŪdiotÃÔ Guide to Social Media presented to them at the DEMA Show, and no one can match my numbers or expertise on that! Of course, we canÃÕ call it that and we never want to come across as being condescending. There is enough of that to go around. If you want to help them out, give them the TOOLS to succeed. Again, I would do this at no charge to DEMA.

So please, cogitate on both my analysis and recommendations to DEMA. I understand that they were not solicited, and frankly I get the idea that I am the red headed stepchild of Scuba Media. However, should you want to discuss things personally, I will be at the Long Beach Scuba Show coming up! I can always come in a day or so early if you desire, just let me know soon as I am about to make my travel plans. In lieu of that, please feel free to contact me by phone or e-mail. Hey, you can even űM me on ScubaBoard. LetÃÔ communicate and make some fun things happen! DEMA is still the ersatz leader of the Dive Industry. I donÃÕ see that changing anytime soon, and can only see you becoming stronger as you embrace the Internet rather than hide from it. I would love to help you do that.


Pete ůetDoc Murray
717 Executive Dr, Winter Park Fl, 32789