Dema show???

[Walter]

Cerich, no hijack, but the math was coming out with some really odd numbers. Figured I'd get clarification, thanks.

Pete, you answered the question (sorta) then brought up PADI standards. Which have absolutely nothing to do with anything under discussion. Cerich then explained that widget meant 2 - 3 and 1 - 2, (which would be 3 - 5) not 2/3 and 1/2 (which is 1 1/6). We should both drop it now.

 

[cerich]

Cerich, no hijack, but the math was coming out with some really odd numbers. Figured I'd get clarification, thanks.

Pete, you answered the question (sorta) then brought up PADI standards. Which have absolutely nothing to do with anything under discussion. Cerich then explained that widget meant 2 - 3 and 1 - 2, (which would be 3 - 5) not 2/3 and 1/2 (which is 1 1/6). We should both drop it now.

well it would be 1-2 days of open to the public, which could fall on days 3-5 of the proposed revised show.... This is getting silly.

 

[The Chairman]

Now did you seriously not get that or were you trying a hijack?

To me it was incredibly CLEAR what widget was talking about as it is to most anyone without an agenda. This might be a clear parallel to what DEMA is being accused of doing: Purposely avoiding the topic by being pedantic or simply playing stupid. Too often, pulling such a stunt does not resolve a thing and only makes people question your motives. Crying wolf when they answer your question only adds insult to the injury.

 

[chayes]

Sure people are paid to do the work. But a quick look at the website lets you know there are only 8 people working there. A few years back there were 14, and there was no where near the marketing effort for the industry being made back then...see the Be A Diver campaign for more.

I disagree with you about non-profit being "just a tax designation." The trade-off for receiving non-profit status is the legal obligation to put funds back into the industry in which the non-profit functions. The IRS does scrutinize that...and you can bet the members do too. As to the "considerable revenue," let's do a little computation shall we? Let's call it 1,500 exhibit spaces sold at DEMA Show...the cost of a booth is about $1,800 (which, by the way is below average for the convention industry). That adds up to $2.7 million per year. They have member dues revenues, but I'd bet those were 10% or less of their total revenue - 10% is pretty average for associations. Compare that to a diving manufacturer that generates between $25 and $50 million per year in revenue in the US alone - go look at a Johnson Outdoors Annual Report and see Scubapro's...they do closer to $90 million worldwide each year. Hardly seems fair to blame the ills of the industry on such a small entity as DEMA, does it? And you ask what they do with the money? Look at the DEMA home page, and scan down to the links to the Be A Diver program. I haven't seen any marketing program better in any recreational industry, and I am pretty well versed in those types of marketing efforts. Take a look at the "Promotion Guide." That lists all the goodies available to DEMA members. And the marketing plan is more extensive than anything I ever saw from any of the training agencies - or from past DEMA staff, for that matter.
Look I am the last one to say that DEMA is perfect. I just think the industry has a totally wrong impression of what DEMA does. I also think many are unfair to DEMA, just because they don't happen to agree with the direction they take on some issues. The next time you are able to resolve a problem between a manufacturer, a training agency, some big magazine, a retailer and a dive destination, and everyone is happy, you just let the world know, ok?

 

[chayes]

No, not missing a thing, and I KNOW that suggestion has been expressed to DEMA staff.

There are two issues - the manufacturers don't want the consumers there because it is a waste of their time...consumers coming to a manufacturer's booth want "deals" and the manufacturers don't want to sell direct to consumers, in part because of the tax issues involved, but also because they want to support the retailers. The other problem that has always surrounded any consumer dive show is that the local retailers don't want their customers snagging a deal on the show floor and having that cut into their own sales because direct sales took place on the show floor. In a city like Orlando, with many Florida and east coast retailers coming, there could be a real problem with getting retail members of the Association to allow it. Some of that could be fixed if the consumer day was separate from the rest of the trade days, or if no sales were allowed on the show floor. Of course the travel exhibitors and the training organizations, and some manufacturers that don't support the retail base (like DUI who sells around the retailer directly to the consumer) wouldn't like that. Frankly, in my opinion, DUI couldn't get their way and have consumers come into the show, and that's why they left...but that's only my logical mind assuming that, and I don't have any real evidence...my bad??

 

[chayes]

Speaking of DEMA and PADI, PADI is germane to any conversation of DEMA...

Last year there were term limits on Directors, then it came up for vote to eliminate term limits. PADI is a MULTI member of DEMA, with various corporate memberships, enough to swing any vote it wants (with DEMA the more you pay the more votes are allocated to you). Strangely enough term limits were retracted and Al Hornsby from PADI runs again for the board, AL is elected with the PADI votes should remain so until PADI decides not to keep him there any longer.
I would LOVE to know why controlling DEMA is so important. I have been told that last year there were DEMA board members that were greatly alarmed by what transpired.

I have also been told that this year the DEMA sow "bumped" a MAJOR brand from their selected spot on the floor in favour of PADI who had less points under the floor plan selection system. If true that sure gives one pause. The best part is now it doesn't matter, that major pulled the plug after.

Term limits...so, rather than allow members to decide for themselves when someone should be voted on (or off) you'd rather have DEMA dictate it?? For all the bashing that DEMA gets, do you really want the Association deciding when someone can and cannot run for the Board? By the way, that member vote for changing the bylaws was put up on their website, and it passed by 25 votes...if some of the lazy and complaining members had gotten off their butts and voted, it never would have happened. I guess maybe you're right...the members are not capable of making the effort to decide for themselves.

 

[chayes]

Speaking of DEMA and PADI, PADI is germane to any conversation of DEMA...

Last year there were term limits on Directors, then it came up for vote to eliminate term limits. PADI is a MULTI member of DEMA, with various corporate memberships, enough to swing any vote it wants (with DEMA the more you pay the more votes are allocated to you). Strangely enough term limits were retracted and Al Hornsby from PADI runs again for the board, AL is elected with the PADI votes should remain so until PADI decides not to keep him there any longer.
I would LOVE to know why controlling DEMA is so important. I have been told that last year there were DEMA board members that were greatly alarmed by what transpired.

I have also been told that this year the DEMA sow "bumped" a MAJOR brand from their selected spot on the floor in favour of PADI who had less points under the floor plan selection system. If true that sure gives one pause. The best part is now it doesn't matter, that major pulled the plug after.

Bumped a major manufacturer?? Well, I think if you look on demashow.com you'll see a floorplan. PADI is one of the largest exhibitors on the floor. They have been at every DEMA show, so with a couple of exceptions, there are few other exhibitors with more seniority points. Who would they bump, if they are, more or less, first in line?? Makes no sense.

 

[chayes]

Well you really cant blame alot of the folks who have elected to not show this year, DEMA has consistently ignored the needs and desires of the very folks who make up their membership. Now with the economy the way it is, whether its good/bad in any individuals perspective, the expense of showing at the show doesnt seem to fit the return on investment of showing this year in Orlando for the non-showing folks. The very refusal of allowing NetDoc the opportunity to help without charging him shows they aren't real interested in helping the general membership, rather a select few who they gear the organization around. I suspect you will see this non-showing list to continue to grow and for the non-showing folks to come to grasps that its DEMA that needs the members, not the members who need DEMA and continue on the non show lists for years to come.

We will probably attend at least a day since its close to us. With any luck at all maybe one of our customers who DEMA will sell a pass to will split it with us, wink wink.

Schott

BS! DEMA is there to promote diving and they are charged with raising money to put back into the industry. How do they do that? Well, they created a heck of a promotional program called Be A Diver (BeADiver.com) and they provided expensive professional materials for members to use, including a national television commercial campaign and a print ad campaign. And where do they get the money to do that kinda stuff? They run a trade show where exhibitors can sell directly to pre-qualified retail and travel buyers. To run a trade show they provide a good venue to allow companies to promote themselves, and they take the risk of renting a convention center and contracting with hotels to provide the venue to do that. That stuff doesn't come cheap, and DEMA has to charge to make the money they need to put back into the industry. If DEMA DID give it away, it would be unfair to the members of the association. Look, DEMA is not perfect, and they have made a lot of mistakes in the past. I just think for the last few years they have been doing exactly what needs to be done for the industry.

 

[chayes]

I want to ask the view of my fellow divers and Scubaboard members. I attended the DEMA show two years ago as an exhibitor, it did "OK" for my company. I am considering attending this year at Orlando, however it seems that virtually EVERY major manuf. has withdrawn from attending.

My question is simple, Is DEMA relevant?

Please be open and honest.

Best,

Chris

Its a good idea to be there. And yeah, DEMA is relevant for certain. No one else is even attempting the kind of sophisticated marketing campaign for the industry that DEMA is doing. Go look at their Be A Diver campaign (go on dema.org and scroll down the home page to the links).

 

[chayes]

I've heard that Orlando is one of the most expensive places to do a convention... for exhibitors...

I think the draw of Orlando has to do with Disney and the other theme parks for any convention attendee (and their family).

Orlando is a great place to do the show - easy access to the Caribbean and its a great place to bring the family for when the show is over. There's more divers over here on the right coast. And these days, with all the crap going on in the economy, most people are spending time with their family...I for one am glad it's in a family-friendly place.