confused about advanced open water (PADI)
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I never took AOW and have done over 600 dives now- never been told I couldn't go on a dive without it and have dived in moderately challenging conditions with no problems I couldn't handle. I used the money I saved to buy gear and get some more dives in. There is no substitute for experience. I have had my gear fail twice- both not because of anything I did wrong- just the old Murphy Law kicking in. If taking more courses will prepare you then go for it- if not - put the money towards more diving with a divemaster. Many boats give you the option of diving in their group and they will also point out a lot of cool stuff you might miss.
gbray
Contributor
I took my AOW thru SSI. I took it so I would not be denied the deeper dives when I went to the ocean. My wife is OW and on our first boat dive in Mexico the DM took us to 100 ft. The class was totally unnecessary to be allowed to do the dives but there was some useful info such as gas planning, gear selection etc for the deep dives.The class will definately NOT make anybody an advanced diver. As has been said a thousand times, the usefullness of it all depends on the instructor.
Michael Kazma:
First, he was specifically asking about PADI, not about IANTD.
Second, I never said AOW doesn't certify one to dive deeper than 60 ft, I said it doesn't qualify one to dive deeper than 60 ft.
I like to think my advanced class qualifies a diver to dive deeper than 60 ft too, but you can't get my advanced certification with one dive to 61 ft either.
You get certified as Advanced Open Water, but not as a Specialty Diver in any of the modules you do in the AOW. Each AOW module is the first dive of the full specialty course, so it's something of a "try it out to see if you like it" sort of experience before you invest the resources (time and money) into the full specialty courses.
The AOW certification trains you to do dives deeper than the 18 meter/60 foot training limit of the OW cert, to a maximum depth of 30 meters/100 feet. The Deep Diver Specialty trains you to dive to 40 meters/130 feet.
This has only happened to me in the Keys. Doesn't seem to matter most places. Like many divers who do more than occasional vacation dives, many of the adventure dives are things, I have already done. So I have not pursued it until recently.
We are planning to get the cert this summer. I am hoping to make it a meaningful experience. The plan is for my son and myself to do the navigation and peak performance buoyancy at our local quarry then instead of completing it there we will finish up on a wreck diving trip with our local dive shop to North Carolina. The wreck, deep and boat dives will at least be in more challenging conditions. We have many boat dives, and a fair number of deep dives, but they were your typical warm water destintion dives. Hopefully this will make the training more valuable than just getting the piece of paper.
DevonDiver
N/A
Let's be clear on the wording, used by PADI concerning depth limits for OW and AOW.
18m/60ft is the recommended limit for newly certified Open Water Divers.
30m/100ft is the recommended general limit.
40m/130ft is the absolute maximum limit for recreational divers who have the experience and training required.
Notice how the first 2 limits are recommended. The 3rd limit is more than a recommendation - it is a stated maximum.
Obviously, any particular dive operation is within its rights to place their own limits on customers. They will do this for reasons of safety. In setting these limits, they will quite often use the divers certification level as a guide. If a dive operation sets a limit, then it is mandatory for that operation.
Likewise, a dive operation is also within its rights to offer to take you to any depth of dive. Just because they offer this doesn't mean that you have to accept. It is the individual divers responsibility to set their own personal limits, and to plan their dives accordingly. Just because a dive operation says you can do a dive to XYZ depth, doesn't mean that you should. When it comes to the Scuba Industry, competitive business pressures can quickly lead to dive operations exceeding safe diving practices... their 'get out of jail card' is that it will always remain the diver themselves that is responsible for following those limits.
As an aside: many insurance companies will link the validity of their coverage to the principle that the diver concerned follows Safe Diving Practices. Those safe diving practices include "diving within the limits of your training and experience". Thus, exceeding recommended limits appropriate to your experience and training may be deemed imprudent...and thus your insurance could be invalidated in the event of an accident.
Note that those safe diving principles state "experience and training", not experience or training. It isn't a case of the minimum requirement... you should have both training and experience to conduct dives. However, the 60ft-100ft distinction is very grey, as the specific wording for the 60ft recommendation is aimed at newly qualified OW divers. At no point does PADI state that you have to have completed the AOW course to dive below 18m/60ft.
For reference: here's the info given to students on the PADI OW course:
18m/60ft is the recommended limit for newly certified Open Water Divers.
30m/100ft is the recommended general limit.
40m/130ft is the absolute maximum limit for recreational divers who have the experience and training required.
Notice how the first 2 limits are recommended. The 3rd limit is more than a recommendation - it is a stated maximum.
Obviously, any particular dive operation is within its rights to place their own limits on customers. They will do this for reasons of safety. In setting these limits, they will quite often use the divers certification level as a guide. If a dive operation sets a limit, then it is mandatory for that operation.
Likewise, a dive operation is also within its rights to offer to take you to any depth of dive. Just because they offer this doesn't mean that you have to accept. It is the individual divers responsibility to set their own personal limits, and to plan their dives accordingly. Just because a dive operation says you can do a dive to XYZ depth, doesn't mean that you should. When it comes to the Scuba Industry, competitive business pressures can quickly lead to dive operations exceeding safe diving practices... their 'get out of jail card' is that it will always remain the diver themselves that is responsible for following those limits.
As an aside: many insurance companies will link the validity of their coverage to the principle that the diver concerned follows Safe Diving Practices. Those safe diving practices include "diving within the limits of your training and experience". Thus, exceeding recommended limits appropriate to your experience and training may be deemed imprudent...and thus your insurance could be invalidated in the event of an accident.
Note that those safe diving principles state "experience and training", not experience or training. It isn't a case of the minimum requirement... you should have both training and experience to conduct dives. However, the 60ft-100ft distinction is very grey, as the specific wording for the 60ft recommendation is aimed at newly qualified OW divers. At no point does PADI state that you have to have completed the AOW course to dive below 18m/60ft.
For reference: here's the info given to students on the PADI OW course:
Mike
Contributor
In my opinion rescue diver is the most valuable certification a non-technical diver will ever get.
AOW is a pre-requisite for rescue diver for Padi. Over time you can gain all the AOW dive experiences without taking the course, but if you want rescue diver certification, you'll have to do the AOW course no matter how many dives you have done.
AOW is a pre-requisite for rescue diver for Padi. Over time you can gain all the AOW dive experiences without taking the course, but if you want rescue diver certification, you'll have to do the AOW course no matter how many dives you have done.
PADI AOW is also 5 dives with an instructor guide beyond what you did in OW. There is alot of benefit to a diver to have that kind of experience seeing some of the other things available in diving and having original lessons confirmed.
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