Choice, Challenges and Egos.

[junior diver]

It's a shame that by the time you finish entry level training that you don't realize that ...yes!...there is such a thing as great skill in diving.

sorry don't really understand this, please explain,

 

[rmediver2002]

sorry don't really understand this, please explain,

But I think Mike might be talking about the example a good and talented instructor set for the students...

 

[zboss]

In some way, my point here is the Zen and the Art of scuba diving. I see diving as an all encompassing sport involving many angles and variables…the more the edge, the more unpredictable the nature of things.

A true Zen Master would say that the truth of the scuba is in the eye of the beholder. In other words - to some people card collecting and trophy hunting are what they enjoy about the sport. For some it's Spear Fishing...

American Society (and to a great extent the rest of the world also) uses paper degrees, certification, tests, as a partial measure of ones accomplishments ("I went to HAAARVARD" carries a lot more weight for many people and companies than "I went to PENN STATE!" [ok - I did])

To your point, however, I would buddy with the guy who has 5 years of actual scuba experience and graduated from Penn State rather than someone with no experience that graduated from Harvard.

That's just the nature of our society in general. IMHO

 

[MikeFerrara]

But I think Mike might be talking about the example a good and talented instructor set for the students...

That's certainly part of it. An instructors diving should seem pretty amazing to a new diver although I realize that's not always the case.

On of the things that I do in the classroom during an OW class is show some video of a resort group of divers and some video of some realy of really great divers so students know what can be done with a little practice.

When I can arrange it I also like to use video in class.

 

[rmediver2002]

That's certainly part of it. An instructors diving should seem pretty amazing to a new diver although I realize that's not always the case.

On of the things that I do in the classroom during an OW class is show some video of a resort group of divers and some video of some realy of really great divers so students know what can be done with a little practice.

When I can arrange it I also like to use video in class.

I like the idea of taping the students as well, but that is a great visual aid for class!

 

[oceancrest67]

Thank you for your return reply.

You make some good points and I do agree with what you say in terms of everyone doing their own thing in their own time and space...including me. It is hard to relate an opinion or an idea in a typed format. Like I said at the end of my original posting, it was just my opinion.

The reason why I care about how other divers are and what they do...well, I see diving and getting certified as becoming so much of a commonality (it is great in one way but sad in another way)...as you say in your driver's license example (good drivers vs. bad drivers)...same thing in diving...we agree that people are jumping through the certification hoops far too easily without fine tuning their skills along the way. I have nothing against how many cards a diver has or what kind of budget a diver operates off of...but, what does surprise me is a diver with lots of cards, and lots of expensive equipment...and ends up being a complete wreck underwater. I have seen it first hand...some 'tech' diver on an NC wreck dive with her tank all loose and flopping around on her safety stop.

Yes, you are correct in pointing out that I also have an ego and a confidence in my diving experiences...and yes, you are correct that my vision and opinion is no better than anybody else's opinion...we all have them. Like I said, my initiating the thread was my opinion to spur on commentary and ideas.

Thank you again.

Hi Oceancrest,

I guess I don't understand a few things about your post. Why do you care what folks motivation for diving is? Some people enjoy the continuation of certs and use that as a way to mark what they've learned, some folks get into diving and keep building their skills extending into technical realms, some folks just like to see the pretty fishes once every three years, as long as they're diving within their training and experience.....why does it matter.....it seems like you know your reasons for diving, why do they have to be everyone else's reasons as well or they're wrong?

IMO, your post just sits in judgment of everyone not like you. What qualifies you to just look at someone and decide they shouldn't be diving? How can you tell by looking at someone whether they've had a physical lately? Heck, how do you even tell how fit someone is by looking at them (you can be unfit and thin, or fit and heavier)?

I don't think that living in several places around the world qualifies you for anything but living in several places around the world. It's great that you have multiple hobbies and enjoy them....it seems you do all of them for similar reasons....great for you.

Yes, there are issues in the dive community with training, and how the system is organized. It is sometimes frighteningly easy to get a C-card with not near enough competency displayed (sometimes by both the instructor and the student). To some extent that's the nature of the beast when you train a large population of people in a skill (have you seen some folks drive lately? Ever wondered who gave them their license?). That doesn't mean that folks can't work to make it better.

What does your post add to the process of making it better or educating anyone about a part of the problem? Or was it a place to just display your ego?

Just my .02

Peace,
Cathie

 

[The Kraken]

"...any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in Mankind; And therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; It tolls for thee."

John Donne

 

[Mako Mark]

my point here is the Zen and the Art of scuba diving.

What is the sound of one fin swimming???

Personally I hate to see this because people are often willing to pay for a worthless AOW just to get the card (site access).

Oh Mike, dont get started, you know as well as anyone that the AOW course is not designed to make "Expert Divers" it is just to introduce a diver to 5 different types of diving, that they could continue to specialise in if they feel so inclined.


I think that everyone needs to realise that gone are the days of diving being an exclusive, mysterious sport that exudes youth and sexy macho charisma.

The camera toting, hawaiian shirt wearing, bus tour taking TOURIST diver has arrived.

And there are NO remote locations left in the world???
Yeah, I think Francis Drake said the same thing.....

 

[oceancrest67]

A couple others pointed out the theme along with my initial thread...do we live in a drive through society of instant gratification...where we see the mass consumer 'mentality' creep into the diving community...the cattle boat crowd of reef trashers? How long will the Galapagos hold out from the throng of tourists/divers?

What saddens me...(and, I know I am going to be accused of being arrogant)...what saddens me is the very carelessness and neglectful habits in some people/in some divers (someone pointed out drivers and getting licensed as an example...the everyman commonality on the road...'get out of my way'...road rage).

I am a romantic hoping that certifications and training bring the best out in divers...pointing them in the serious direction of good skill development and having a conscientious eye on the underwater world around them.

Just another one of my opinions.

 

[MikeFerrara]

What is the sound of one fin swimming???



Oh Mike, dont get started, you know as well as anyone that the AOW course is not designed to make "Expert Divers" it is just to introduce a diver to 5 different types of diving, that they could continue to specialise in if they feel so inclined.
.....

Got it Mark. I read the book.

I think you missed my point though. I was replying to some one who said they don't expect to learn anything in the AOW class but it was worth doing because the card provides increased access to sites.

Do you like the idea of an instructor who doesn't teach anything because the students don't expect anything other than the card?