Cert. cards can't be revoked for cause?

[nolatom]

This is what I've heard, anyway.

Good for life means just that? What if you conclusively proved to any reasonable observer that you're just flat-out incompentent, or venal and dangerous, as a diver?

I was thinking of Gabe Watson's Rescue card here. Why should he still hold one?

Does a card/qual system have true credibilty if, once issued, it can never be taken away? (though I think instructor quals are subject to suspension, yes? but not for plain ole divers?)


Don't get me wrong, I'm not advocating more regulation, but if the system of private certification is to be respected against possible government regulation of diving, doesn't it need to have at least *some* teeth?

 

[James R]

A c-card means the diver met, in the opinion of the instructor, the minimum standards for the course. It doesn't really have any credibility past that, in my opinion anyway.

 

[boulderjohn]

How would that work? Who would police it? How would it be determined that the diver is incompetent? If a diver has not been in the water for 20 years, would someone knock on the door and demand to watch a dive to determine competence?

Instructor certifications can be revoked, and we just had such a case discussed on ScubaBoard, but that usually happens after an investigation spurred by a serious accident or particularly egregious incident reported to the agency.

 

[TSandM]

At least one agency can revoke cards, although I don't know if it has ever actually been done.

 

[soltari675]

The problem is legality. This issue was talked about in the Dive Training magazine this month. Unlike a drivers license which is government issued/regulated, the diver certification card is something community acknowledged. There are no government agencies or police to monitor and/or regulate dive certifications. You can legally go diving without any certification, it's just really foolish and likely to get you killed. So our community rallies around what we feel are a good set of rules to go by and are universally accepted.

All a certification means is that on a particular day, a diver showed they had the skills and competency needed to scuba dive safely. It does not mean that the diver has kept up those skills since. Like others have said, nobody is going to go around and demand to see you dive or else they revoke your card. To battle this, some dive ops will ask that you do a check out dive before getting on the boat, so that they can assess your skill and which sites to go to/avoid. There is no legal way really to revoke a certification card since you paid for it and it is not a regulated sport. We'd like to keep it that way btw

There are some cases where a card can be revoked, but they are rare. For example, if a person who is unqualified to teach a certain class certifies someone, that certification can be revoked. Or say I teach someone a class and an instructor signs off on the certification, it can be revoked. It's pretty rare.

Hope this helps. Read this month's Dive Training magazine, in the letters section. It's explained more in depth there.

 

[OldNSalty]

And what would be the result of someone having a card revoked? Say you revoke my rescue card-so what? Would I say "I can' help you stressed diver. I have been uncertified." Most of my dives are from the beach, most shops fill my tanks without asking for a card. If you took all my cards it might be a rare problem but it would not stop me from diving. I look at it as a degree-they don't get revoked. Maybe you majored in finance 20 years ago and got out to work in something totally unrelated. The university does not show up and ask for their wall art back.

 

[Rhone Man]

PADI makes, what, $20 a shot issuing the cards?

Until someone starts paying them $20 a time to revoke them, I am betting it will never happen.

 

[drrich2]

Don't get me wrong, I'm not advocating more regulation...

Yes, actually, you are.

Our current state of affairs is part of the price we pay to avoid a more 'nanny state' situation. Many of us want less nanny state, not more.

Richard.

 

[ubp_sanity]

PADI makes, what, $20 a shot issuing the cards?

Until someone starts paying them $20 a time to revoke them, I am betting it will never happen.

Don't give them ideas!!! If anyone comes around to collect mine, I'm coming straight to you first..

 

[GrumpyOldGuy]

Cert cards are not a government issues license. They are privately issues by a variety of sources. Diving in the US is generally not restricted

Their purpose is to provide a reasonable legal defense for a dive op / fill station that you are qualified to get air / dive in case you hurt yourself and want to sue.