Carrying Three Regulators

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One other thing I can think of is that if you use up the pony on the first dive of a day (for whatever reason) and want to continue diving you would have to remove the second stage from the pony reg and put it on your first stage for your backgas reg. Otherwise you would then be diving with only one second stage on the next dive.

I could see that being an annoying task. Not really a big problem, just a nuisance.
 
I'm not sure what the big deal is about 3 versus 2 regulators. I carry 2(primary & Alternate ) when I'm diving above 60 feet. I carry a third on my pony bottle when diving deeper than 60'. This way I don't have to alter my Primary setup and I can just clip off my pony bottle. Now, I don't cave dive, do very limited wreck penetrations,ie any hole I go into has to have a clear exit on the other side. My pony regulator has the hose bungied to the tank and the mouthpiece is in a bright yellow ball holder. If someone comes up who needs air, I will give them my primary while I go on my integrated alternate (Zeagle Octo-Z). I'm of the school that my pony(19cf or 30cf) is primarily for me. If they come and grab the pony reg then fine, I'll turn the pony on, and get them breathing, then sort things out. Either way dive is over and the only place we're going is up or straight back to the ascent line if nearby. Idon't think having the third regulator is a problem in an integrated unit as you haven't added any hoses. All three secondaries are different models and there is no danger of my confusing the three.
 
i dnt disagree its nit hard to do, but not needed, and you and i have more experience, then most. for someone starting out why increase the confusion.

as for about checking the pony, you can put a button gauge on to see if its full or not, other wise you dont need to check pressure its for emergnecy use only.
 
Heck, you can dive with just one 2nd stage if your would like (and no one is in a position to stop you). So carrying 2, 3, or more is up to you - what ever your dive plan is.

I only carry a pony on select dives; deeper solo dives and buddy dives where we plan to push our back gas a bit. So I don't see a situation for me where I would elect to forgo and alternate on my back gas when I carried a pony. Even on solo dives with a pony, the alternate on the back gas is useful for dealing with equipment problems and for inflating my DSMB.
 
Your rig should never be more complicated than it needs to be. If it is it is a safety hazard.

If you are using a pony as an alternate air source it needs to carry enough gas to get you back to the surface from any point in your dive, therefore you do not need a back-up regulator on your primary. Simplicity dictates that you have only one second stage on each tank.

I often see divers rigged with multiple second stages because they do not remove the octos from their regulators when they use ponies. I have also seen many of these divers suffer "incidents" because they either started their dives on the wrong regulator or switched to the wrong regulator underwater or both. Unfordunately, this seems to be a common occurance.
 
Your rig should never be more complicated than it needs to be. If it is it is a safety hazard.

If you are using a pony as an alternate air source it needs to carry enough gas to get you back to the surface from any point in your dive, therefore you do not need a back-up regulator on your primary. Simplicity dictates that you have only one second stage on each tank.

I often see divers rigged with multiple second stages because they do not remove the octos from their regulators when they use ponies. I have also seen many of these divers suffer "incidents" because they either started their dives on the wrong regulator or switched to the wrong regulator underwater or both. Unfordunately, this seems to be a common occurance.

agreed
 
Your rig should never be more complicated than it needs to be. If it is it is a safety hazard.

If you are using a pony as an alternate air source it needs to carry enough gas to get you back to the surface from any point in your dive, therefore you do not need a back-up regulator on your primary. Simplicity dictates that you have only one second stage on each tank.

You should have enough minimum gas overall to get both you & your buddy to the surface. Unless you're diving solo it's not just about you. Having three second stages, two on your backgas and one on your pony, isn't the least bit complicated if everything's routed properly.

I often see divers rigged with multiple second stages because they do not remove the octos from their regulators when they use ponies. I have also seen many of these divers suffer "incidents" because they either started their dives on the wrong regulator or switched to the wrong regulator underwater or both. Unfordunately, this seems to be a common occurance.

I would love it if you explained these "incidents", I would assume the problem is that they switch to a pony reg when the valve isn't opened on the tank. With a slung tank this isn't a problem at all as it takes only seconds to turn the tank on; it's a serious issue if they can't reach the tank valve. It's easy to avoid this problem, about as easy as avoiding tripping while stepping onto a curb.

You can dive with only one second stage on each tank if you want, but arguing that leaving the octo on the main tank is a safety hazard is just absurd. With smartly routed hoses having the third second stage gives you more options in an air-sharing situation.
 
Thanks for the feedback. I am currently using a 19cu pony. It is not sling mounted its hard mounted next to my main tank using a seperate strap that makes it easy to swap to another tank. It has its own spg and it is always on when I dive.

I have heard several comments about mounting the bottle so its inverted and you can reach the valve to turn it on? Why would you dive with the bottle off? Its my AAS, if I need it I don't want to have to turn it on first? Does that fact that its hard mounted with its own spg change anyone mind about whether the additional second stage on my first tank is needed?
 
Thanks for the feedback. I am currently using a 19cu pony. It is not sling mounted its hard mounted next to my main tank using a seperate strap that makes it easy to swap to another tank. It has its own spg and it is always on when I dive.

I have heard several comments about mounting the bottle so its inverted and you can reach the valve to turn it on? Why would you dive with the bottle off? Its my AAS, if I need it I don't want to have to turn it on first? Does that fact that its hard mounted with its own spg change anyone mind about whether the additional second stage on my first tank is needed?

It all depends on how you wish to handle having your buddy share air off your system. If you want your buddy to go on the pony, then there's no need for the octo on your main tank. If you want your buddy to breathe off your backgas then leaving the octo gives you the option of either staying on the main tank or switching to your pony, whichever you desire.

You need to determine how you want to handle this situation.

Since your tank is hard mounted, and not inverted to make access to the valve easier, then you need to route your second stages in a smart, clean fashion so that you don't confuse your regs in any way. This is easy to do, but extremely important.
 
You should have enough minimum gas overall to get both you & your buddy to the surface. Unless you're diving solo it's not just about you. Having three second stages, two on your backgas and one on your pony, isn't the least bit complicated if everything's routed properly.

Every additional piece of equipment that you hang on yourself complicates your rig. Any piece of equipment that is not needed is no more than a liability. There is no foreseable situation in which you would need to be breathing off of both second stage regulators from the same first stage if you are carrying a pony.

I would love it if you explained these "incidents", I would assume the problem is that they switch to a pony reg when the valve isn't opened on the tank. With a slung tank this isn't a problem at all as it takes only seconds to turn the tank on; it's a serious issue if they can't reach the tank valve. It's easy to avoid this problem, about as easy as avoiding tripping while stepping onto a curb.

You may think that you can rationally think through a set of options and pick the best action in an emergency but in a real situation that rarely happens. It is very important to simplify and limit the number of choices one has to optimize the probability that the correct one is chosen in a stressful situation.

I will relate a couple of incidents I was present for. I was not underwater with these divers but I debriefed them after the fact.

In one instance a diver was getting ready to make a 130 foot dive. He had a 95CF main tank and a 30CF pony mounted to the side of his main tank. He had a regulator with two second stages and a gauge console on each tank. I suggested to him that he might want to remove the extra second stages and the console on the pony before going in. He declined, saying that he knew where everything was and had a system to determine which regulator was which. He was a very experienced diver, with a couple of hundred dives in his log.

He jumped into the water and was back up five minutes later. When we pieced the story together this is what we determined had happened:

He went in the water breathing off of his pony bottle, thinking it was his primary. He ran out of gas shortly after reaching the bottom and switched to his pony bottle regulator. Of course, he had already depleted his pony bottle so when he tried to take a breath he got nothing. Now he was on the verge of panic. He grabbbed the regulator from his buddy's mouth. His buddy, an excellent diver, easily dealt with the problem and switched to his own back-up. The two divers then took a couple of minutes to calm down and then made an air-sharing ascent. Back on the boat, we took the valve off of the pony bottle and puured about a litre of water out of it.

Another time I witnessed a diver go on a 130 foot dive with a similar set-up except that he had only one second stage on his pony. This time the diver went into the water breathing off of the proper regulator but got into trouble when he had an equipment problem on the bottom. He developed a free-flow with his primary regulator. He breathed it down a bit and then switched to what he thought was his pony. Of course, he made the wrong choice and put his octo in his mouth by mistake. He was already stressed out and when, just a few seconds later, he ran out of gas he panicked. He attempted to get air from his buddy but the exchange went bad because of his agitated state. His buddy was unable to control the situation and the diver ended up making a rapid ascent. He was not injured but could very well have been.

Those are just two examples. I have seen others.

You can dive with only one second stage on each tank if you want, but arguing that leaving the octo on the main tank is a safety hazard is just absurd. With smartly routed hoses having the third second stage gives you more options in an air-sharing situation.

With only exception (a knife or cutting tool) I have never witnessed an accident or near accident caused by a diver not having enough gear. I have seen many caused by divers haivg too much gear or inappropriate gear.
 
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