Carrying a Pony....

[Diver Dennis]

I think there are two sets there, one is a vintage double hose set up, you can see the first stage attached to the front.

 

[divemaster_jim]

I think there are two sets there, one is a vintage double hose set up, you can see the first stage attached to the front.

Your right I saw it wrong, I've removed my statement.

 

[Diver Dennis]

No worries. I saw the same thing as you when I first looked.

 

[divemaster_jim]

No worries. I saw the same thing as you when I first looked.

I think I'm spending too much time here,
Now back to your regularly scheduled program. LOL

 

[wreckvalle]

Check out
http://www.aquaexplorers.com/pony_bracket.htm
This is a pony bracket I designed years back. It allows for quick and eay mounting and is rock solid.

 

[Nemrod]

Since there seems to be some confusion concerning the picture of the Double 50s. That is a Sherwood semi isolating modular manifold. These are no longer available except by trade or ebay or whatever---I have two of them. The cool thing about them is that you can flip the forward facing RH post to the LH side and then it will face back--this allows the reverse mounting of a low profile first stage such as those on the Voit MR12 or even the ScubaPro Mark V type with the turrent. Why you ask, because my primary is the unbeatable Phoenix Royal Aqua Master and if I installed the single hose first stage on the RH post and forward it would then interfere with the double hose cans and RH hose. It is semi isolaing because you can isolate regulators but you cannot isolate tanks like a modern full isolating manifold.

Sorry for the confusion--and--remember--this is not a cave rig or deep tech rig or set up to explore the Andria Doria, it is a solo rig that allows a high level of redundancy sufficient for my purposes or for buddy diving with a complete second regulator for the octapus.

If that makes sense good, if not, oh well, MERRY CHRISTMAS anyways--lol--lol---lol---lol--lol. Oh, and now returning to the OPs original intent.

N

 

[tonka97]

Check out
http://www.aquaexplorers.com/pony_bracket.htm
This is a pony bracket I designed years back. It allows for quick and easy mounting and is rock solid.

Great bracket; recommended!

Thanks for the SCUBA gear contribution.

 

[GeorgeC]

I would recommend slinging on the front, rigged like a stage bottle. My opinion is that this should be treated as a competely independent gas source with the 2nd stage 'stowed'. You should keep the standard 1st + (2) 2nd's on your main tank and keep you standard gas plan. The pony, IMHO, is 'your' personal reserve that your buddy is supposed to be reserving for you.

When you do you gas plan, rockbottom's etc, ignore the pony and treat it as if it didn't exist. This makes it truly your gas. It also simplifies gas emergencies underwater. If you go OOA or LOA, for whatever reason, you have either your buddy or your pony. If you buddy goes OOA or LOA, he has the 'reserve' in your backgas. You would still have your reserve if it was needed.

I agree with everything above but I would loose one of the 2nd stages on the primary because 3 regs are a bit much. If you primary 2nd stage goes bad simply switch to the pony, abort the dive do your safety stop, surface and fix the problem.

That is to say you don't agree with cavediver.

Ok let me clarify. Use “except” instead of “but” above.
I agree with:
Completely independent gas source
Keep your standard gas plan
Pony is personal reserve that is not factored into the gas plan.

My only difference (for those splitting hairs) I would not use 3 regulators.

 

[in_cavediver]

Ok let me clarify. Use “except” instead of “but” above.
I agree with:
Completely independent gas source
Keep your standard gas plan
Pony is personal reserve that is not factored into the gas plan.

My only difference (for those splitting hairs) I would not use 3 regulators.

This one detail though is significant. I advocate the (3) 2nds, with (1) stowed on the pony stage style to completely isolate the pony from the main gas supply and emergency procedures. Using the octo as the pony 2nd incorporates the pony into you gas plan as this is now your buddy's reserve to end the dive. Not a good idea is its a 6cft or 13cft pony. On a 40cf bottle, its not a major issue.

The way to look at is this, with one 1st and 2nd on each bottle, you have one access means for one diver on each bottle. Sometimes its better (especially with smaller pony tanks) to keep the backgas accessible by two divers at the same time.

 

[Nemrod]

I began slinging my pony when it became diffucult to reach it back mounted. I do not agree about not including the pony in the "gas plan." That is why it is being carried, it represents your emergency backup and if buddy diving it also likely represents his as well. Pony bottles are mostly used with singles and that is what I am talking about. The typical single tank is 70 to 85 cf. A 20 cf pony represents 20% of that volume and a 30 represents 30% of that volume. How much "gas" do you think is going to be left in an aluminum 80 after a 90 foot dive (30 minutes at 90 feet is no deco per Navy Tables). Well, for me, quite a bit, more than enough for a generous safety stop but not enough for a buddy. I am going to probably leave bottom at 1200 psi, surface at 300 psi. That is not enough for a buddy and the donor diver. Now let's look at this, 1,000 psi on an aluminum 80 represents 26 cf. The numbers indicate that a 19/20 cf (that is approximately what I am off bottom with to begin with assuming a normal and no failure dive) bottle should get a buddy out of trouble or yourself and that a 30 cf bottle would be plenty. Within no deco limits down to 100 feet the 19 cf bottle should be plenty to return a buddy to the surface or yourself. From 130 feet the 30 will do nicely. Now, ok, double failure, your buddy has a system failure and goes to your pony. You also have a failure--oops--the pony does not have an octapus so now the two of you buddy breath from the pony, on a 30 cf bottle from 90ish feet the 15 cf each will get you to the surface but not much more. A 40 would do it cleanly. So there are the things that go into selecting the size pony for your single tank dive. yeah, if your on doubles then you don't generally need the pony. That is why I have my Double 50s set up with dual regulators. I dive the Double 50s as if they were a SINGLE 80 cf tank. That leaves 20 cf over for emergency--exactly the same as an 80 cf single with a 20 cf pony. Doubles are great but you cannot rent doubles at vacation resorts, they are rarely available even in Florida or California for rent, you can carry travel bands and build them up or set then up as doubled singles but then you realize of course that your single BC is not going to work for that so you have to carry two sets of gear for diving singles and doubles---that is a lot of carry on.

There was a thread a few weeks ago about having an octapus on your primary rig and a pony and it was pretty much 50/50, some do not have a octapus if they dive a pony, some do because they don't want to have to set up the regulator different for every dive(it occurs to me that not everybody has about 20 different dive sets--lol). For me, if I am on a single 80 cf tank and I carry the pony then it will not have an octapus and the octapus is the pony regulator. This represents a much higher level of redundancy than a single 80 with a single first stage and two seconds. The pony obviously provides an independent air source with a complete regulator of it's own. With the pony side slung it is quickly available, a 40 inch hose gives the pony second stage plenty of room to manuver. It is important to remember that a conventional octapus is for air sharing only, it is not true redundancy. Carrying an octapus is not a bad thing with a pony, just probably not needed but I don't see a problem with it and in fact do so from time to time--but consider the typical isolation manifold doubles. Typical doubles have two independent regulators, neither would typically have an octapus second stage so you have two complete regulators. Well, that is exactly what you have with a single and a pony, two complete regulators so why carry an octapus any more so than with doubles? I don't really recall ever seeing doubles with twin regulators and an octapus on either or both but --well--once I did, he also had two computers and three consoles and I sort of lost count and this was in Alexander Springs which is at most 30 feet deep. I was on a single 72 and Pico Mistral, I wanted to talk to him but he got in after me and got out before me--go figure.

Merry Christmas.
N