That takes care of sales, what about training and service?
Buying Suunto from LDS or LeisurePro and warranty info..
- Thread starter Kevin K
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adurso
Contributor
Kevin K:
I knew a guy who purchased a Cobra on-line, he had an issue and was shocked when the LDS could not help him. He tried to send it to Suunto, who in turn sent him a large estimate for repair. He had 1 dive on the computer. The on-line dealer was unable to satisfy him, the end result was he purchased a new computer.
Personally I buy most things in person from a LDS, I am lucky in that I have never found a better on-line price on any item I wanted. But it seems that everywhere else in the country things are cheaper on-line....
scubadobadoo
Contributor
dherbman:
Service...LP does my reg set for 39.99 and many other places too. Like I said, good and bad here. Time becomes an issue but the service is cheaper. Having two sets from an online dealer for the same price as one lds's set also solves this problem.
Training...Any intructors located here in the NYC area? Problem solved. Internet and study at home courses are also more popular now. I did study at home for OW, AOW, Rescue, and Nitrox. Positives and negatives here too of course.
I recently had a problem getting info on a local beach dive. My lds's didn't have much info or didn't have the time for me. SO, I got on Scuba Board and asked. Ten minutes later I had several responses and dove that beach dive twice this weekend thanks to Scuba Board. I also met some instructors their and other divers too thanks to Scuba Board. BTW, I also met a nice LDS diving their too and it is likely that I will visit them soon. SO, Scuba Board also brought this LDS business and they don't even know it yet.
Look, I don't want to see LDS's close. Please don't think I do, but a compromise will have to be met and soon. LDS's can't continue to bend over for manufacturer's rules. Guess who's getting screwed here? The LDS, and then the manufacturer blames the internet and still doesn't help the LDS when they close.
Edit: I would like to think that all that matters is good service and quality gear (if you build it they will come concept) but that doesn't appear to be the case anymore for everyone. The internet has opened up Pandora's Box and some people are happy about it, while others are not. Most are. Businesses that have survived locally becasue people had nowhere else to shop aren't happy. Even a 90 year old Grandma can get on the computer and find the cheapest price. GOOGLE IT is now an official verb. "To google it." "Googlar" in Spanish, lol. How do you think our kids will feel about this subject in 20 years having grown up on a computer? They will probably be sending their gear to China, yikes!
scubadobadoo:
My LDS is booming. They have my 2 Apeks TX50s on backorder because it seems like Apeks had a sudden spurt in popularity after Scuba Magazine's last regulator comparison. I don't think Aqualung is hurting either. They also have the best customer service of any business I've encountered. There will always be a place for service oriented businesses despite online sales.
scubadobadoo
Contributor
TheRedHead:
I am glad they are booming and I hope there always will be a place for service oriented businesses, in person AND online.
But the fact that your LDS is booming doesn't change the fact that the business model will have to change for many LDS's. You are merely supporting "A" LDS and not "THE" LDS. You have over 8000 posts here on Scuba Board. You are directly effecting that business model change with the many bits of good advice you give away for free here on the internet.
scubadobadoo:
I've also run an online business since 1997.
scubadobadoo
Contributor
You are one smart redhead, lol!TheRedHead:I've also run an online business since 1997.
That's a good, albeit confusingly worded point. There's one LDS in my area I won't even attempt to set foot in due to their reputation. On the other hand there's another I'm about to purchase some tanks from and probably some training. Of course I'll also probably buy the next reg I purchase from scubatoys... People should really try and mirror their business model, IMO.scubadobadoo:
driftin' by
Contributor
awap:
Wow, this is a hot thread! This post in response to the above from page #2 might seem out of place now.
They absolutely do deserve credit and I believe it would add validity to my story but I'd rather not make it public so that less scrupulous folks don't attempt to take advantage of their service. That main point I was trying to make is that unlike most other consumer products and what I was originally led to believe, manufacturers of diving gear are more then willing to deal with the end user and seem willing satisfy the customer at all costs. I was impressed in both cases that when I called I actually got to talk to a human, that was able to make decisions and resolve the situation in a matter a minutes instead of being passed around, put on hold and left to leave a message with no follow up as the case is with so many other companies.
driftin' by
Contributor
Catching up on this thread got me thinking and it occurred to me that there are three huge segments of consumers out there that no one has yet mentioned that will keep "THE" LDS's alive. I hope this doesn't cause too many sparks to fly...
1. For lack of a better term "Naive Newbies". I was one, wide-eyed and bushy-tailed. There's a sucker born everyday and every business counts on it. My wife and I bought in to the whole "buy from your LDS because it's life support gear were talking about" idea that got us to hand over thousands of dollars without question. Lack of knowledge leads to intimidation. Diving can intimidating in the beginning. Like the line from the movie, Tommy Boy: "You can get a good look at a t-Bone by sticking your head up a bull's ***** but wouldn't you rather take the butcher's word for it?" It's just that principle that you're relying on the experienced professional to guide you in the right direction... the same kind of trust you put into your doctor because you know very little about human physiology. Unfortunately, some of the professionals have their own agenda that comes at your expense.
2. The independently rich. In my rather short 32 years on this earth, I've had both the pleasure and regret of knowing several people like this and have seen their spending habits. They buy whatever they want, whenever they want and without regard to how many they might already have or how their actions might make those without (me) feel. Fortunate for them, they're the ones that never wonder if they're getting a good deal. They don't spend hours researching to build their confidence that they're making a good decision on a quality product that'll last them for years. They're the ones that pays sticker price for a new car with out any bartering. They're the ones that all ran our and had to be the first ones to have the new Suunto D9 when their, 1-year old, Uwatec Smartcom was still perfectly functioning. They're the ones that don't mind paying a premium to go on a dive trip sponsored by their LDS so that two DM/Leaders can go for free. They're the ones that'd rather buy a new tank instead of waiting on theirs to be hydro'd at the last minute for an upcoming trip. If these examples seem detailed and specific, it's because they actually happened and it is because of them the LDS will stay alive.
3. Those where diving is their life and they spend every dime of their disposable income on diving alone. Don't get me wrong, I love diving too and consider it to be my life but for me there are other things fighting over my wallet such as my house and furnishings, cars, other hobbies and interests, my career, my daughters college tuition and finally, I'd like to retire one day so that I can dive more often. They're the ones that drive a 1978 Ford Courier pickup are seen wearing the same hot pink Stuart Coves t-shirt 3 times a week, still lives at home, was just promoted to shift manager at McDonalds and can't decided whether to take his new Suunto D9 or Oceanic Atom computer on a 3-week jaunt to Palau. They have a tendency to be thrifty but because of their passion for the sport, they built loyal relationships with their LDS and are immune to the fact that other vendors exist and frequently benefit from freebies, hand-me-downs and unclaimed, forgotten about gear leaving more disposable income for the fun toys without regard for competitive pricing.
It is us on this board now having this discussion that most likely don't fit into one of these categories. We're passionate about the subject otherwise, the thread would fizzle. We're either the ones that love our LDS and have been treated right by them or we're the ones that have been burned, misled-led, taken advantage of or ripped off. At any rate, the LDS will survive if for nothing else other than the three groups I mentioned above and the great ones will preserver and dominate based on a foundation of honesty, loyalty and customer service.
1. For lack of a better term "Naive Newbies". I was one, wide-eyed and bushy-tailed. There's a sucker born everyday and every business counts on it. My wife and I bought in to the whole "buy from your LDS because it's life support gear were talking about" idea that got us to hand over thousands of dollars without question. Lack of knowledge leads to intimidation. Diving can intimidating in the beginning. Like the line from the movie, Tommy Boy: "You can get a good look at a t-Bone by sticking your head up a bull's ***** but wouldn't you rather take the butcher's word for it?" It's just that principle that you're relying on the experienced professional to guide you in the right direction... the same kind of trust you put into your doctor because you know very little about human physiology. Unfortunately, some of the professionals have their own agenda that comes at your expense.
2. The independently rich. In my rather short 32 years on this earth, I've had both the pleasure and regret of knowing several people like this and have seen their spending habits. They buy whatever they want, whenever they want and without regard to how many they might already have or how their actions might make those without (me) feel. Fortunate for them, they're the ones that never wonder if they're getting a good deal. They don't spend hours researching to build their confidence that they're making a good decision on a quality product that'll last them for years. They're the ones that pays sticker price for a new car with out any bartering. They're the ones that all ran our and had to be the first ones to have the new Suunto D9 when their, 1-year old, Uwatec Smartcom was still perfectly functioning. They're the ones that don't mind paying a premium to go on a dive trip sponsored by their LDS so that two DM/Leaders can go for free. They're the ones that'd rather buy a new tank instead of waiting on theirs to be hydro'd at the last minute for an upcoming trip. If these examples seem detailed and specific, it's because they actually happened and it is because of them the LDS will stay alive.
3. Those where diving is their life and they spend every dime of their disposable income on diving alone. Don't get me wrong, I love diving too and consider it to be my life but for me there are other things fighting over my wallet such as my house and furnishings, cars, other hobbies and interests, my career, my daughters college tuition and finally, I'd like to retire one day so that I can dive more often. They're the ones that drive a 1978 Ford Courier pickup are seen wearing the same hot pink Stuart Coves t-shirt 3 times a week, still lives at home, was just promoted to shift manager at McDonalds and can't decided whether to take his new Suunto D9 or Oceanic Atom computer on a 3-week jaunt to Palau. They have a tendency to be thrifty but because of their passion for the sport, they built loyal relationships with their LDS and are immune to the fact that other vendors exist and frequently benefit from freebies, hand-me-downs and unclaimed, forgotten about gear leaving more disposable income for the fun toys without regard for competitive pricing.
It is us on this board now having this discussion that most likely don't fit into one of these categories. We're passionate about the subject otherwise, the thread would fizzle. We're either the ones that love our LDS and have been treated right by them or we're the ones that have been burned, misled-led, taken advantage of or ripped off. At any rate, the LDS will survive if for nothing else other than the three groups I mentioned above and the great ones will preserver and dominate based on a foundation of honesty, loyalty and customer service.
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