Buying Parts From A Shop

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was Rick putting on the brakes in order to bring us all back into the REAL WORLD !

We probably have all seen signs like this in workshops:

PRICE LIST:

Hourly rate if I do the work: $35.00
Hourly rate if you watch: $70.00
Hourly rate if you watch and you "help": $140.00

Signed,

Joe Technician

Also signed,

Joewr
 
This is one of the most controversial topics in the diving industry!!

Since diving is a self regulating industry, we have been very afraid of stupid lawsuits. If Joe's Dive shop sells Dufus McFixit parts for a regulator and it fails underwater, the shop, training agency, regulator manufacturer, kid that fills the tanks and the landlord will most likely get sued.

However,(in my not so humble opinion) if selling diving parts was as commonplace as auto parts, then the liability for work done would shift to the end user. Plus, the manufacturers and dive shops could make a whole bunch more by selling parts packages and then servicing stuff after it has been tinkered with!!

It is going to take a few manufacturers and dive shops with cajones to start selling parts over the counter to get the resto of the industry started. Until then, we have to keep weaseling stuff out of the shops.

Just my $.02

Ray
 
Hey all,

Rick made an allusion to a repair process I affectionately call the "bucket method". When cars started to get computerized back in '81 we were all amazed by their diagnostic trees. Unfortunately, many of them ended with those dreaded words "replace with known good part". That is, there was no published way to test the part without mere substitution. Lincoln ACs were the worst for this, as they had several parts that were in excess of $200 to make them work. What a nightmare to the customer AND the shop trying to make a decent profit. There were many of them that I just told the customer to take it down to the dealer where a technician could take a bucket of parts and start substituting "known good parts" until it starts working again. It's almost as bad as trying to diagnose a string of Christmas lights that are wired in series!!!

As a Network consultant, I have had to rely on my hunches from time to time as well, and golly gee, I even "ate" a few parts, but generally keep them around as "known good parts" to aid in diagnosis. Sometimes the bucket method IS the most useful way to repair a complex system. Cars, computers and networks can all benefit from this modus errata.

This is generally not so with regulators. You have leaks, free flows and no flows as the three most common problems. As Joe so aptly pointed out, learning how to assess scores, pits, cracks and abrasions seems to be the most challenging part of any regulator repair. If you replace all of the O-rings, examine the hard seats, all rubber items, and then re-assemble with care, you will normally cure 99.9% of all regulator issues. Sure there is more to regulator repair, as in intermediate pressures and cracking pressures and using the appropriate lubricants in the right places and the right amounts and knowing what to clean and HOW. But these are not insurmountable, and as others have pointed out, I do not like the track record of many of the local LDS's regulator techs. Either they are not paid enough to take the time with the individual regulators, and so have to rush. OR... they just don't care, 'cause if it fails, they will still be breathing on the surface. I believe that I will take my chances with -ME-.

Five out of the six instructors I have worked with tell their students to service their stuff yearly and yet will not allow their regs out of their hands unless there is a demonstrated problem with it. Two of those love it when I help them out, because they have issues with their equipment that they don't trust the LDS with. Finding a competent reg tech that actually cares may not be impossible, but it is sure hard to do.

:tease:
 
I have to add that I do my own regulator maintenence and repair. But I do it in the local shop where I have access to all the special tools.
Special tools - there are many regs that are just not maintainable without special tools - use of regular tools will make hamburger out of 'em, and there are places where standard tools won't reach, where adjustments can't be made without the tool made just for that.
Rick
 
For you guys and gals who wish to buy or admire some of the afformentioned tools, try this site:

www.scubatools.com

One of the handiest is the Scubapro Air 2 Seat Slider: you can make one yourself for the use I put it to. That is to open the battery compartment cover of dive computers.

The instructions usually call for using a coin, but I have found that pressure usually seals the cover so well that you are more than likely to gouge the slot. The long section on the Seat Slider lets you use a vice if you are at home or a drawer if you are in a hotel room, etc. to hold the tool upright; then you can push down on the tool and the slot and firmly seat the tool in the slot, thereby avoiding gouging it out.

One more thing...on the Matrix computer, I have been told by more than one dive shop to NOT grease the o-ring. I have replaced batteries three times to date without greasing or oiling the o-ring and have had no leakage at all!

Joewr...who absolutely loves tools...the more, the merrier!
 
THAT was one great site... I have already placed an order!!! Did I ever tell you how much I love tools (I hated the cars, but I loved the tools). Now you just need to find the equivalent of a "parts" site for us, and I will hand deliver your nomination for SCUBA patron saint to the proper authorities...

:tease:
 
I'm not surpised someone eventually got round to mentioning the liability thing - scary thing that these days and it's even catching outside of the US........

If you've built up a relationship with a shop and they know you, your background and your competence then maybe I can see them selling bits and allowing you to use their tools but would you expect a LDS to sell them to someone that walks in off the street without some sort of credentials? I think the motor industry is probably a bad example to follow as it has been around much longer.....

It would be nice if you could take a course that allows you to service your own stuff - I would probably take it but whether I would then actually do the servicing I'm not sure. Certainly my Equipment Specialist course was a real eye opener. It was taken by an very experiened technician and as a result I would not want to dabble with my regs without some sort of training - my choice. Several people in my club that I know do try and service their own regs and then on holiday someone else normally has to fix them for them to stop them free flowing.....

Incidentally the guy that swapped my reg and did not seat the diaphram properly is a friend so I did not have to pay for it but he was qualified - I guess he gets his pay from the fact I still use the dive shop that he works in when I am in the UK.

Jonathan
 
Joewr,
What a great web site. I'm a tool freak also. Thanks for the post. Many of the guys make valid points, both pro and con on this issue. After having to return "just serviced" regs a couple of times, I decided that I'm just as competent as the guys at the shop. It's my life on the line and I trust me more than I trust anyone else. If I screw a part up I have enough integrity to admit I did it and not expect the people I bought it from to pay for my mistake. Like the NetDoc, I do it because I want to, not because it's just another task to perform before quitting time.:tree:Bob.
 
Excellent site, Joe.
If you'll look at the special tools for servicing US Divers regs you'll see what I mean by not being able to do the work with any standard tools.
Rick
 
I probably do not have to say this, but be sure to order their catalog. It has 35 pages of toys that you can drool over! I love this catalog.

I "play" with my scuba gear and make some things for my own use. I have been very tempted to do my own maintainance on life support gear, but then I would have less time to make toys for the grandchildren...

At any rate, be sure to order the catalog...I would have told you guys about it sooner, but I did not know you were all tool nuts.


I will keep my eyes open for a spare parts site...but do not hold your breaths...you all know the rule: keep breathing.

Joewr...wait till I show them my old car stuff...
 

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