Buoyancy vs beach weight - HP80 Optimal?

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Thorvald Natvig

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I just finished my open water. It was a ton of fun, but I was surprised at how heavy the dive gear was when walking across all that sand on the beach. Not a problem, but I suffer from excessive curiosity, so I started pondering -- how do I optimize my on-land weight without sacrificing underwater buoyancy?

First thought was to look at tanks. Let's assume that between the tank and the weight on my belt, I need -15lbs of buoyancy to stay neutral at my safety stop, and let's assume that at the end of the safety stop, I've used 60cf of air for the dive.

We dove a LP85, which (from datasheets) when empty has +2.3 lb buoyancy. Capacity is 81.1cf, so after using 60cf, there's still 21.1cf left, which subtracts about 1.7lb. Hence, to achieve the goal of -15 lb buoyancy, I'll need 15.6 lb of lead. On land, the tank weighs 31.2 lb empty, so with the lead and 81.1 cf of air, I'm carrying 53.3 lb across the beach on my way into the water.

What would happen if I used a HP80, which (from datasheets) when empty has -1.7 lb buoyancy? After using 60cf of air, the remaining air is about 1.6 lb. Hence, to achieve the goal of -15 lb buoyancy, I'll need just 11.7 lb of lead. On the land, that tank weighs 28.3 lb, so with the lead and 80 cf of air I'm carrying just 46.4 lb across the beach.

I did the same calculation with a few other tank sizes, and HP80 wins when optimizing for "beach carry weight".

I'm new to diving. The weight didn't bother me, but the feeling that I'm missing something here is really bothering me. Are my calculations way off? Does the HP80, being shorter, cause the center of mass to be higher up your body, and that is undesirable? Are LP tanks easier to fill than HP tanks?

(I needed quite a bit more than -15lbs to stay down without holding on to the rope, but the additional weight applies the same regardless of tank.. Unless that's where I'm missing something?)
 
1) LP tanks tolerate hot fills better if you don't leave your tanks overnight at the LDS.

2) HP80s are fairly short and this means you either end up having the tank hanging low on the bc or end up head heavy if you have it higher up. hp100s are a better length for most. If you are shorter than 5'8", you may find the hp80 workable.

lp85s are good tanks, but if you aren't getting overfills, the lp72 is pretty great for dry weight vs capacity too.

of course, you could just hit the gym and keep using the lp85.
 
I just finished my open water. It was a ton of fun, but I was surprised at how heavy the dive gear was when walking across all that sand on the beach. Not a problem, but I suffer from excessive curiosity, so I started pondering -- how do I optimize my on-land weight without sacrificing underwater buoyancy?

First thought was to look at tanks. Let's assume that between the tank and the weight on my belt, I need -15lbs of buoyancy to stay neutral at my safety stop, and let's assume that at the end of the safety stop, I've used 60cf of air for the dive.

We dove a LP85, which (from datasheets) when empty has +2.3 lb buoyancy. Capacity is 81.1cf, so after using 60cf, there's still 21.1cf left, which subtracts about 1.7lb. Hence, to achieve the goal of -15 lb buoyancy, I'll need 15.6 lb of lead. On land, the tank weighs 31.2 lb empty, so with the lead and 81.1 cf of air, I'm carrying 53.3 lb across the beach on my way into the water.

What would happen if I used a HP80, which (from datasheets) when empty has -1.7 lb buoyancy? After using 60cf of air, the remaining air is about 1.6 lb. Hence, to achieve the goal of -15 lb buoyancy, I'll need just 11.7 lb of lead. On the land, that tank weighs 28.3 lb, so with the lead and 80 cf of air I'm carrying just 46.4 lb across the beach.

I did the same calculation with a few other tank sizes, and HP80 wins when optimizing for "beach carry weight".

I'm new to diving. The weight didn't bother me, but the feeling that I'm missing something here is really bothering me. Are my calculations way off? Does the HP80, being shorter, cause the center of mass to be higher up your body, and that is undesirable? Are LP tanks easier to fill than HP tanks?

(I needed quite a bit more than -15lbs to stay down without holding on to the rope, but the additional weight applies the same regardless of tank.. Unless that's where I'm missing something?)
You have the correct idea. The HP80, HP100 3442 psi tanks are the most air for the least TOTAL weight. Keep in mind that more air is worth something. The HP100's may be worth it and are not so short.
 
The HP80s are great little tanks. You are correct though in that they do put their mass higher up on your back. When I dove my neutrally buoyant fins, I always felt like my feet were going to float up above me. I didn't actually happen, but I could tell that it wasn't putting me in good trim. If I used my heavier Hollis F1 fins, it put me in great trim with the HP80s. Your thinking is spot on, but you might just have to play around with fin weighting to adjust your trim.
 
Keep in mind that HP tanks are only at their rated capacity at their rated pressure. What that means is if you don’t get your high pressure fill, your gas volume is less. So make sure you are capable of getting HP tanks to their rated fill pressure every time, otherwise you’re shorting yourself.

LP tanks are much more likely to get filled to their rated capacity.
 
Steel ends up being lighter than aluminum (for a given volume) because the steel is stronger and they can use less of it. HP obviously packs more air in a given volume, and it seems the weight doesn't increase that much to handle the extra pressure.

But consider whether or not you plan on using *only your tanks - do you plan on getting 2, or do you plan on boat diving and filling them on the boat? Then you need to consider whether the boat fills to high enough pressure, or what your trim change will be like if you switch to an AL80.

I used to think I'd get an HP80 or HP100, when I lived in CA where they fill tanks on boats. But in Hawaii, it's all AL80s. Having extra gas isn't much of a benefit since nearly everyone else is diving 80s. A steel tank would be a trim/weight benefit, but if I dive on a boat I have to use their AL80s and move things around. So if I get tanks, they'll likely be AL80s to keep my setup consistent...
 
Pros and cons both ways. Negative buoyancy is the only pro to steel tanks. They are a higher maintenance over AL. the true weight offset isn’t really that much. There are other ways to off set weight to the back rather than setting up for steel tanks. And of course hoping they get a true HP fill.
AL tanks with trim weight on the cam bands or even your BC has trim pockets.
In the end AL are the front runner.
Consider your rig/kit set up. What suit are you wearing? Too thick, real thin? That’s the biggest weight offset for a diver is their exposure suits.
Get fat stay warm and as I read earlier help offset DCS. (Gas tissue absorption ratios)
 

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