How about a picture of you in your bcd?
It might be easier to see the problem areas.
It might be easier to see the problem areas.
BP/W harness & weights configuration question.
- Thread starter Tina5269
- Start date
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gopbroek
Contributor
If the harness is digging in it is probably to tight. Was looking for a video and couldn't locate it but basically the vertical shoulder straps should be loose enough to allow you to place both fists sideways (about 5") on each breastbone about level with your armpit.
Random thoughts, mostly to do with checking fitment.
Fundamentally, keep in mind that BP/W stability comes mainly from a nice snug waist belt, so the shoulder straps can be looser or slightly off the shoulder routing down the side which might help alleviate pressure in the armpit area while still being secure. You should be able slide the strap off your shoulders.
The crotch strap is often set too short, pulling the plate down. It should be set to prevent the rig from riding up at the surface.
Have you done a plate position check? You should just be able to touch the top of the plate reaching behind you, so that can change the position of the straps. There are also different sized plates available that can alter the strap geometry and make things more comfortable.
Fitment will take some tweaking at first to get right, and perhaps the rig may seem less comfortable out of the water, but be great in the water.
Use an STA weight and cylinder trim weights to help move weights off the belt for trim, comfort, and to minimize the amount ditchable for safety. You only need a small amount to make yourself positively buoyant, say 5 lbs in each of 2 pockets,
There are many alternative harnesses out there so you can certainly try them out relatively inexpensively once you exhaust the options available to you on your current setup. Good luck!
Fundamentally, keep in mind that BP/W stability comes mainly from a nice snug waist belt, so the shoulder straps can be looser or slightly off the shoulder routing down the side which might help alleviate pressure in the armpit area while still being secure. You should be able slide the strap off your shoulders.
The crotch strap is often set too short, pulling the plate down. It should be set to prevent the rig from riding up at the surface.
Have you done a plate position check? You should just be able to touch the top of the plate reaching behind you, so that can change the position of the straps. There are also different sized plates available that can alter the strap geometry and make things more comfortable.
Fitment will take some tweaking at first to get right, and perhaps the rig may seem less comfortable out of the water, but be great in the water.
Use an STA weight and cylinder trim weights to help move weights off the belt for trim, comfort, and to minimize the amount ditchable for safety. You only need a small amount to make yourself positively buoyant, say 5 lbs in each of 2 pockets,
There are many alternative harnesses out there so you can certainly try them out relatively inexpensively once you exhaust the options available to you on your current setup. Good luck!
PfcAJ
Contributor
You'd get better advice not in the hogarthian forum as the modifications youre describing are certainly not hogarthian.
If you don't want to route the hose around the back of your neck, then swap it out for a 40" and run it under your arm. You will still want the swivel, but you can ditch the clip.
I would stick with just one trim pocket per side on your waist belt. A 5 pound weight in each side for when you need 10 total. If you need more, put a weight on your camband. You can also thread two of the pockets onto a camband if you want or need to use all four.
For the harness, a chest strap is unnecessary. Get rid of whatever you have and use a single length of webbing for the arms and waist, plus a crotch strap . You want the harness to be loose on the sides of your chest. You snug it up with the waist belt and crotch strap.
Here's a video of scubaboard member @jagfish fitting a standard harness to a female diver.
You probably have enough hardware on your current setup that you'll just need to buy webbing.Or you can pick up an entire harness package for $35 from More Options! & Now Black Hardware! Hogarthian Harness (Dir) for Backplates . Both my son and I use this package, I have the nitrox green webbing and he chose the blue
. Actually, I recommend calling Piranha when you are ready to order webbing or trim pockets or anything else. You'll probably talk to Randy and he'll give you great advice.
I would stick with just one trim pocket per side on your waist belt. A 5 pound weight in each side for when you need 10 total. If you need more, put a weight on your camband. You can also thread two of the pockets onto a camband if you want or need to use all four.
For the harness, a chest strap is unnecessary. Get rid of whatever you have and use a single length of webbing for the arms and waist, plus a crotch strap . You want the harness to be loose on the sides of your chest. You snug it up with the waist belt and crotch strap.
Here's a video of scubaboard member @jagfish fitting a standard harness to a female diver.
You probably have enough hardware on your current setup that you'll just need to buy webbing.Or you can pick up an entire harness package for $35 from More Options! & Now Black Hardware! Hogarthian Harness (Dir) for Backplates . Both my son and I use this package, I have the nitrox green webbing and he chose the blue
. Actually, I recommend calling Piranha when you are ready to order webbing or trim pockets or anything else. You'll probably talk to Randy and he'll give you great advice.
OP
Tina5269
Registered
Thank you everyone!
The main reason why I was thinking to NOT get the Zena is money. I thought I could get a workaround this way. The zena has all or none weight dumping. I thought if I put most of my weight in pouches or something I could take out a little but not all, so I wouldn't go up like a cork. Perhaps I am overthinking it since I am so new.
I also like the idea of my BPW being pretty much modular. It's a pain in the ass to adjust if I go from diving warm water with a skinsuit to wearing a wetsuit. I like the shape of the oxycheck so I will look into that. That with the ziptouch may just do the trick for now.
As for the hose, after talking to someone at my LDS I think I will shorten it from 7 to 5. I feel safer with the longer length like this so 5 should be OK.
THANK YOU very much for your advice, everyone!
The main reason why I was thinking to NOT get the Zena is money. I thought I could get a workaround this way. The zena has all or none weight dumping. I thought if I put most of my weight in pouches or something I could take out a little but not all, so I wouldn't go up like a cork. Perhaps I am overthinking it since I am so new.
I also like the idea of my BPW being pretty much modular. It's a pain in the ass to adjust if I go from diving warm water with a skinsuit to wearing a wetsuit. I like the shape of the oxycheck so I will look into that. That with the ziptouch may just do the trick for now.
As for the hose, after talking to someone at my LDS I think I will shorten it from 7 to 5. I feel safer with the longer length like this so 5 should be OK.
THANK YOU very much for your advice, everyone!
A 5' should work if you are running it down to your belt and then back up. It will probably be more comfortable with a swivel at the second stage end.
I have a pair of shears in a sheath on the right side of my waist band. It makes a handy place to loop the hose. This is my son's setup, you can see the shears on the waist. There's a trim weight pouch just behind it which you can't see. He's using a conventional reg setup because he just took his JOW class and they preferred this setup.
I have a pair of shears in a sheath on the right side of my waist band. It makes a handy place to loop the hose. This is my son's setup, you can see the shears on the waist. There's a trim weight pouch just behind it which you can't see. He's using a conventional reg setup because he just took his JOW class and they preferred this setup.
Ayisha
Contributor
Regarding the harness digging into the armpit area, it sounds like the D-rings are right near the armpit and the shoulder straps are too tight.
I am also well endowed and had that as well initially. I loosened the shoulder straps and raised the D-rings slightly higher, and that solved the problem. Very comfy after that.
I haven't tried the UTD system, so I'm not sure how their harness compares to mine, which is the H webbing on the Halcyon Eclipse. Halcyon webbing is a medium stiffness, which some people prefer over their original stiffer or softer webbing.
The trick to keeping a long hose tucked in without a can light or hose retainer is, while looking to your left, not only tuck the hose under the waist belt, but pull it all the way back behind your right hip.
If you just tuck it in tight, the reg will pull on your jaw and the hose will just pull out as soon as you turn your head to the left u/w. You have to leave enough hose to turn your head without the hose pulling out, hence looking to the left while tucking it.
Some braided hoses are floatier than others and certainly floatier than conventional rubber, so not sure if you're using a braided hose. I use a braided hose and find it fine if you get the loop right behind your neck. If it has become untucked from your waist belt, one of the first signs is that the braided hose lifts slightly.
Hope those help!
I won't speak to the tightness issue as I'm a male and have no boobs.
For long hose if I'm not using my can light I put on a set of shears and tuck into them.
Weights for ditchable I use a harness in my case DUI Connor weight and trim.
For long hose if I'm not using my can light I put on a set of shears and tuck into them.
Weights for ditchable I use a harness in my case DUI Connor weight and trim.
Ayisha
Contributor
The beauty of a bp/w is that once you have the harness set comfortably for your thickest exposure protection, you don't need to adjust it.
You set it to fit with your thickest wetsuit (or drysuit), and it's fine diving with a skin or even just a swimsuit.
A BP&W relies on a snug crotch strap to hold your rig in place, not the shoulder straps. So while you're diving, even if your harness were loose, your arms in front of you in the delta position keep your straps on. You don't need the straps loose either.
Try fitting the harness with your thickest suit, and it should be pretty comfy with even just a swimsuit and should stay in place with a snug crotch strap.
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