SueMermaid
Guest
Sheeyah, like I'm gonna post my BMI for you all to see. 
I'd sooner post my bra size and salary.
I'd sooner post my bra size and salary.
Body Mass Index
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large_diver
Contributor
It's a joke for certain body types
Even when I was in the best shape of my life in my early-mid 20s -- working out religiously 3+ times a week, playing very competitive basketball an additional 1-2 times per week, walking 10+ miles per week (city dweller--walking to work, grocery,etc.), my BMI would have been well outside the healthy range.....
Even when I was in the best shape of my life in my early-mid 20s -- working out religiously 3+ times a week, playing very competitive basketball an additional 1-2 times per week, walking 10+ miles per week (city dweller--walking to work, grocery,etc.), my BMI would have been well outside the healthy range.....
kelpmermaid
Contributor
I checked it out, and at 5 ft 4, according to the BMI index, I could get up to 145 before I would be considered "obese." I have little bones, and at 145, I'd be a manatee. How can it be the same for women and men?
Dr. Paul, it's true, this being middle-aged thing stinks in that regard.
Dr. Paul, it's true, this being middle-aged thing stinks in that regard.
Arnaud
Contributor
SueMermaid once bubbled...
Sheeyah, like I'm gonna post my BMI for you all to see.
I'd sooner post my bra size and salary.
And those would be?
The Iceni
Medical Moderator
Dear Readers,
We all like to be given directions to stop us from making a navigational mistake and getting lost but find our way using maps, charts, waypoints, compass, GPS and other tools and instruments.
I tend to agree with bwerb (I think!)
The Body mass Index is only a guide to obesity, it is an index finger pointing us in approximately the right direction but it is by no means accurate and must be seen for what it is, a very simply guide to obesity alone using a magical number derived from height and weight alone.
One only needs to take a close look at an individual to estimate whether they are overweight or not, the BMI simply puts a rough figure on this. However, obesity by itself is not a problem, the problem is associated pathology. As others have mentioned it takes no account of sex, fat, age, blood pressure, waist size, cardiovascular fitness, genetic factors, smoking habits, LDL cholesterol etc. etc.
Liberal applications of salt are required whenever the BMI is quoted as it is often used out of context.
It is most certainly not, and was never intended to be, an accurate guide to physical fitness. As for cardiovascular risk, a Framingham score is much more useful, looks at a large number of variables where smoking looms large.
We all like to be given directions to stop us from making a navigational mistake and getting lost but find our way using maps, charts, waypoints, compass, GPS and other tools and instruments.
I tend to agree with bwerb (I think!)
Well, not total crap.
The Body mass Index is only a guide to obesity, it is an index finger pointing us in approximately the right direction but it is by no means accurate and must be seen for what it is, a very simply guide to obesity alone using a magical number derived from height and weight alone.
One only needs to take a close look at an individual to estimate whether they are overweight or not, the BMI simply puts a rough figure on this. However, obesity by itself is not a problem, the problem is associated pathology. As others have mentioned it takes no account of sex, fat, age, blood pressure, waist size, cardiovascular fitness, genetic factors, smoking habits, LDL cholesterol etc. etc.
Liberal applications of salt are required whenever the BMI is quoted as it is often used out of context.
It is most certainly not, and was never intended to be, an accurate guide to physical fitness. As for cardiovascular risk, a Framingham score is much more useful, looks at a large number of variables where smoking looms large.
OP
pufferfish
Contributor
It always amazes me that even when one is told what BMI is not people still try and attribute things to it like physical fitness.
BMI as a tool was derived as an indirect way to measure percentage body fat. The 'gold standard' is still densitometry where one's volume is calculated in an underwater tank and this has an error of about 4%. Skin caliper measurements and BMI are indirect measurements and BMI has a good correlation with densitometry if children are excluded and those built like Michael Jordan (very athletic individuals with very low body fat). It seems
there are quite a few Joe Weider types on this board and that is great but don't get upset when your BMI is 26 as you are one of the exclusion groups. I checked Jordan's BMI by the way and it is 25.
So what is the BMI good for other than what bwerb might think? Well the CDC has produced nice little colorful maps and charts showing over time that our population in North American has gone from 15% obese (in 1980) to 31% obese (2000). In Canada and the US we now have an epidemic of obesity.
BMI Trends
Yes one can just look at a group of persons and divide the group into fat and non-fat but this would be very different if done in Africa vs North America. The BMI was derived to allow a more accurate and easy way to measure a population's percentage body fat and compare this to the risk of dieing from various diseases. Mortality was not an all or nothing phenomena so having a fat and non-fat group wouldn't work.
The message with BMI is that mortality increases with increasing BMI not only for specific diseases but for all cause mortality. Have a look at the all cause mortality jpeg below and one can see where these healthy vs. overweight. vs obese weight zones come from. Again they have nothing to do with physical fitness.
The most striking correlation from the Nurses Health Study was between the non-smoking nurses' BMI and heart disease death risk.
BMI __Relative Risk of Death from Heart Disease (in women)
<22____1
22-25__1.4
25-27__1.7
27-29__3.1
29-32__4.6
>32____5.8
The magic of BMI shows that the risk death from heart disease at a BMI over 32 is four times that of the risk with a BMI less than 25.
The above poll for all its scientific deficiencies likely does show that divers are healthier (not same as fitness) than the general population. The 2000 CDC data show 31% of Americans are obese and the poll above shows about 15% obese or what North Americans were in 1980.
The take home message is still don't smoke, exercise regularly, and keep your BMI probably below 27 and yee shall dive well into your seventies. Diving is such a great sport as it can be done safely into old age if one does keep an eye on that magical BMI.
BMI as a tool was derived as an indirect way to measure percentage body fat. The 'gold standard' is still densitometry where one's volume is calculated in an underwater tank and this has an error of about 4%. Skin caliper measurements and BMI are indirect measurements and BMI has a good correlation with densitometry if children are excluded and those built like Michael Jordan (very athletic individuals with very low body fat). It seems
there are quite a few Joe Weider types on this board and that is great but don't get upset when your BMI is 26 as you are one of the exclusion groups. I checked Jordan's BMI by the way and it is 25.
So what is the BMI good for other than what bwerb might think?
Well the CDC has produced nice little colorful maps and charts showing over time that our population in North American has gone from 15% obese (in 1980) to 31% obese (2000). In Canada and the US we now have an epidemic of obesity.BMI Trends
Yes one can just look at a group of persons and divide the group into fat and non-fat but this would be very different if done in Africa vs North America. The BMI was derived to allow a more accurate and easy way to measure a population's percentage body fat and compare this to the risk of dieing from various diseases. Mortality was not an all or nothing phenomena so having a fat and non-fat group wouldn't work.
The message with BMI is that mortality increases with increasing BMI not only for specific diseases but for all cause mortality. Have a look at the all cause mortality jpeg below and one can see where these healthy vs. overweight. vs obese weight zones come from. Again they have nothing to do with physical fitness.
The most striking correlation from the Nurses Health Study was between the non-smoking nurses' BMI and heart disease death risk.
BMI __Relative Risk of Death from Heart Disease (in women)
<22____1
22-25__1.4
25-27__1.7
27-29__3.1
29-32__4.6
>32____5.8
The magic of BMI shows that the risk death from heart disease at a BMI over 32 is four times that of the risk with a BMI less than 25.
The above poll for all its scientific deficiencies likely does show that divers are healthier (not same as fitness) than the general population. The 2000 CDC data show 31% of Americans are obese and the poll above shows about 15% obese or what North Americans were in 1980.
The take home message is still don't smoke, exercise regularly, and keep your BMI probably below 27 and yee shall dive well into your seventies. Diving is such a great sport as it can be done safely into old age if one does keep an eye on that magical BMI.
OP
pufferfish
Contributor
I don't know what happened to that attachment. I will try once again but if no go, I give up.
bwerb
Hoser/English Translator, eh
I'll concur and tone it down...I used the word "crap" for effect...I totally think we are on the same page. There is so much more involved and it is a good index to get the ball rolling.
Before I was married to my awesome wife Theresa...I dated two anorexics and had several more as friends...I couldn't believe how much of a mental illness this was and how "the almighty scale" became the determining factor in "how in-shape" I am. As I did my own research and began to really work-out hard myself, I learned that health and overall wellness is multifaceted, I get upset when I see people using one index as their total indicator.
I'm glad I could contribute something of value...thanks!
Brian
Just to keep it going,
Male
closer to 50
5'11"
185
BMI 25.5
That makes me overweight.
I lift weights three times a week and run about 14 miles a week. I had my body fat checked at a Wellness center and was 14%.
I agree that the mirror and how you feel is the best indicator.
My air consumption surprises my instructors and when I dive with my 19 year old athletic son I usually have at least 500 more PSI than him at end of dive. Do not know if this is a result of running or fitness, but would like to think so. :mean:
Male
closer to 50
5'11"
185
BMI 25.5
That makes me overweight.
I lift weights three times a week and run about 14 miles a week. I had my body fat checked at a Wellness center and was 14%.
I agree that the mirror and how you feel is the best indicator.
My air consumption surprises my instructors and when I dive with my 19 year old athletic son I usually have at least 500 more PSI than him at end of dive. Do not know if this is a result of running or fitness, but would like to think so. :mean:
yes i am stupid. my BMI is 25. I was thinking %body fat. Got a little excited. settle down there ben. Yeah I am in a mandatory master fitness trainer class, so we have been talking about all of this lately
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