DeepSeaExplorer
Contributor
62%? That's an unusual gas mix. Is that a typo?
If not, please give some detail on the rational for gas selection.
If not, please give some detail on the rational for gas selection.
Bent this weekend
- Thread starter jtivat
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I know you had some conservatism in your profiles so this is more along the lines of "as long as we´re having the conversation" but...
Anytime I do a sequence of deeper dives, I up the conservatism a bit. Even if there is a nights rest between dives. Whenever I do a sequence of dives I also tend to use 2 decogasses whenever possible even if the profile doesen´t really "require" it (I understand that logistics get in the way of this sometimes)...
You just never know what is conservative for YOU but if the gaitor really was the cause of your DCI, then I think you were cutting it too close...sad thing is, we only know that we´re close to the "limit" when we start feeling it...
Glad to hear you´re ok...
Anytime I do a sequence of deeper dives, I up the conservatism a bit. Even if there is a nights rest between dives. Whenever I do a sequence of dives I also tend to use 2 decogasses whenever possible even if the profile doesen´t really "require" it (I understand that logistics get in the way of this sometimes)...
You just never know what is conservative for YOU but if the gaitor really was the cause of your DCI, then I think you were cutting it too close...sad thing is, we only know that we´re close to the "limit" when we start feeling it...
Glad to hear you´re ok...
OP
I will try and answer all the questions.
dumpsterDiver
First no when on the boat I was not sure of anything and only breathing O2 to be safe.
Second yes my Trimix instructor was big on movement and stretching during Deco so I do take extra care to do so.
RonFrank
True and both my Doctor and DAN said while they would suspect that the Gator was the cause they could not be sure. But I would say the pain started directly below the ligature mark and I would think that is a big coincidence but you never know.
PerroneFord
My instructors have for whatever reason not been fans of O2. My Trimix instructor has been diving over 37 years with many thousands of Deco dives and the highest % I have seen him use is 70%. Also the chamber Doc really could not say O2 is better or safer. But with that said I will be using O2 on all deeper dives from now on, it cant hurt plus I can add conservatism and not stay in the water longer than I would have to with just one gas.
Also to be totally honest I did not following everything my instructor recommended to us. When doing any deep cold Trimix dives he suggested planning the dive for an extra five minutes. So for a 25min BT I should have cut tables for 30min but we did not do this for these dives. Would this have kept me from being bent nobody can say but it sure would not have hurt.
DeepSeaExplorer
There was an almost full bottle of 70% at the shop but running numbers 62% would get me out of the water faster than 70%. This is when using one gas and because the 62% can be hit at deeper stops. Also my buddy was using 50% and this kept us on a really close deco schedule.
grazie42
This is a good idea and we did run more conservative the second day. Our BT's were shorter and avg. depths were shallower by a lager margin than the plan plus we left both dives a bit early.
So when I do get back in the water I will be using two gases one being O2 I will also be adding that extra five minutes on to my plans. I will also not be using gators and will be double-checking any gear that could reduce blood flow.
dumpsterDiver
First no when on the boat I was not sure of anything and only breathing O2 to be safe.
Second yes my Trimix instructor was big on movement and stretching during Deco so I do take extra care to do so.
RonFrank
True and both my Doctor and DAN said while they would suspect that the Gator was the cause they could not be sure. But I would say the pain started directly below the ligature mark and I would think that is a big coincidence but you never know.
PerroneFord
My instructors have for whatever reason not been fans of O2. My Trimix instructor has been diving over 37 years with many thousands of Deco dives and the highest % I have seen him use is 70%. Also the chamber Doc really could not say O2 is better or safer. But with that said I will be using O2 on all deeper dives from now on, it cant hurt plus I can add conservatism and not stay in the water longer than I would have to with just one gas.
Also to be totally honest I did not following everything my instructor recommended to us. When doing any deep cold Trimix dives he suggested planning the dive for an extra five minutes. So for a 25min BT I should have cut tables for 30min but we did not do this for these dives. Would this have kept me from being bent nobody can say but it sure would not have hurt.
DeepSeaExplorer
There was an almost full bottle of 70% at the shop but running numbers 62% would get me out of the water faster than 70%. This is when using one gas and because the 62% can be hit at deeper stops. Also my buddy was using 50% and this kept us on a really close deco schedule.
grazie42
This is a good idea and we did run more conservative the second day. Our BT's were shorter and avg. depths were shallower by a lager margin than the plan plus we left both dives a bit early.
So when I do get back in the water I will be using two gases one being O2 I will also be adding that extra five minutes on to my plans. I will also not be using gators and will be double-checking any gear that could reduce blood flow.
DeepSeaExplorer
Contributor
I'm sure you have spent some time reviewing possible causes. (That's something best answered by yourself.)
I would suggest that you reconsider using the Best Mix method for deco gasses. This is most commonly applied to bottom mix, but I've never seen anyone use that method for deco gas, ie 62%. Many don't buy into standard bottom mixes, but almost everyone agrees that it makes sense for deco gas.
I don't want to sound as though I'm knocking anyone because we will never really know the cause, but some times those with many years of experience are not up-to-date on the latest techniques.
I would suggest that you reconsider using the Best Mix method for deco gasses. This is most commonly applied to bottom mix, but I've never seen anyone use that method for deco gas, ie 62%. Many don't buy into standard bottom mixes, but almost everyone agrees that it makes sense for deco gas.
I don't want to sound as though I'm knocking anyone because we will never really know the cause, but some times those with many years of experience are not up-to-date on the latest techniques.
hi jeff .
i am an m1 with cmas i have extended range an do a lot of deco diving . in ireland the rule is 1 deco dive per day . upon re surfacing after a really deep dive we use o2 as a tool for roughly 45 mins .
as you probably know if you bend once you are more sustible to another no matter ho long passes .
i bent 4 years ago after a equipment failer and a ditched weight belt . i am more castious of my own diving practices and those of my dive buddies .
is great to share your experiences with every other diver so others can learn from our mistakes .
safe diving and get well soon
i am an m1 with cmas i have extended range an do a lot of deco diving . in ireland the rule is 1 deco dive per day . upon re surfacing after a really deep dive we use o2 as a tool for roughly 45 mins .
as you probably know if you bend once you are more sustible to another no matter ho long passes .
i bent 4 years ago after a equipment failer and a ditched weight belt . i am more castious of my own diving practices and those of my dive buddies .
is great to share your experiences with every other diver so others can learn from our mistakes .
safe diving and get well soon
dumpsterDiver
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jtivat:
I appreciate the post, but are you sure you really screwed up? We all need to realize that anyone can get bent and being bent doesn't necessaily mean "you screwed up".
Obviously we can all dive safer, but if we remove the stigma of being bent, more people will "admit" symptoms sooner. I'm not a tech diver, but if there was a screw up, it looks to me like it was made post dive while you went to the shop and drove around etc.
OP
dumpsterDiver:
Good point I did screw up post dive and should have called DAN much sooner.
I also believe I screwed up by changing the strap on my gator without figuring out why it was not fitting properly. I had just done three dives with the gator and it fit fine but I was in a hurry to get in the water. So the other lesson to be learned is that this sport is not a race take the time and make sure everything is right before getting in the water. I questioned if I should make this post here on SB because of the depth of the dives but I feel these lessons can apply to any dive.
DeepSeaExplorer:
I am newer to deco diving and would have even something to add to DeepSeaExplorer (please correct me if I am wrong/or if the difference is negligible).
I wouldn't choose to dive a gas different than my buddy on the same dive (BG or deco gas), because then if either of us has a failure using the others gas might induce problems that normally be present.
MSU99
Registered
Jtivat
Though it doesn't do much good now and it's good to hear that your ok. Alpena Regional Medical Center just got a chamber see link to editorial
http://www.thealpenanews.com/stories/articles.asp?articleID=4778
wonder if DAN knows about this? Is there a way of letting them know, Especially if all they have info on is GR, K-zoo and Detroit?
Though it doesn't do much good now and it's good to hear that your ok. Alpena Regional Medical Center just got a chamber see link to editorial
http://www.thealpenanews.com/stories/articles.asp?articleID=4778
wonder if DAN knows about this? Is there a way of letting them know, Especially if all they have info on is GR, K-zoo and Detroit?
OP
MSU99:
Dan at DAN called me today with follow up questions and to see how I was doing. So I asked the question about the Alpena chamber not being listed. He says there are around 750 chambers in the US and only about 230 are listed at DAN. He says many do not either want to treat divers or do not have qualified staff to do so. Many chambers today are used for medical treatments and not for recompression. When I did my second ride there were two older people in the other two chambers for other medical treatments. He also said that he does not recommend making a list of all the chambers and going to the closest, this could cost you time as they will most likely turn you away.
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