BCs and Weights for Novice Diver

[JerryR]

I am about to purchase my first BC and am looking at the Zeagle Escape or Brigade, but have some concerns. I am a novice with about 15 dives in South Africa and Thailand. I have been reading with great interest the integrated weight systems and rip cords and weights falling out and getting the BC back on the boat with and without weights, etc., etc., As I have always rented my equipment I have only used a belt.

I have read the thread on this subject from three years ago, http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?t=55290&highlight=Belt+vs+Integrated+System

So, a few basic questions on current models of integrated weight systems:
1. Which is recommended for novice divers? belt or system? I know what people were thinking three years ago, but have things changed?
2. As a novice I am concerned about the Zeagle and surface flotation and "turtle backing" (face up or face down? - turtles are face up on their back, but with back flotation, aren't I face down - which is my real concern!!).
3. Which other BC should I look at that is comparable? One that gives me the back flotation for underwater, but helps hold me up like a bobber on the surface...

Thanks,

 

[DiveTub]

I am about to purchase my first BC and am looking at the Zeagle Escape or Brigade, but have some concerns. I am a novice with about 15 dives in South Africa and Thailand. I have been reading with great interest the integrated weight systems and rip cords and weights falling out and getting the BC back on the boat with and without weights, etc., etc., As I have always rented my equipment I have only used a belt.

I have read the thread on this subject from three years ago, http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?t=55290&highlight=Belt+vs+Integrated+System

So, a few basic questions on current models of integrated weight systems:
1. Which is recommended for novice divers? belt or system? I know what people were thinking three years ago, but have things changed?

Zeagle have not changed, and why would they? Still the best weight system on the market, I would never wear a weight belt, uncomfortable, hurt your back and a genuine PITA.

2. As a novice I am concerned about the Zeagle and surface flotation and "turtle backing" (face up or face down? - turtles are face up on their back, but with back flotation, aren't I face down - which is my real concern!!).

Its Bollocks, just chuck a bit of weight in the rear pockets to balance things up at the surface, you are only going to go facedown if you are wearing too much weight at the front and over inflate the BCD to compensate.

3. Which other BC should I look at that is comparable? One that gives me the back flotation for underwater, but helps hold me up like a bobber on the surface...

Thanks,

I don't know of any other wing style BCD that comes close to Zeagle in fit, form, function or quality of build

Cheers
Chriso

 

[herman]

I totally agree Chriso. The only issue with the Ripcord system is small weights will work their way out but if you use the yellow weight bags (know by most as yellow thingies ) that is not a problem...and they make life easier.
While I see no need to use a weight belt, you can still use one with an weight intergrated BC, Zeagle or otherwise. Do a search on this board on Zeagle, you will find very few people who do not like them. By the way, one of Zeagles head hanchos is a active member of this board. He hears complaints and concerns loud and clear....and will address them. Something no other manufacturer does.

And before I forget WELCOME to the board.

 

[JGBrown]

Just my 0.02 as another starting diver:
I have a zeagle Back inflating BCD
I like the flexibility of the back inflate, combined with integrated system AND a belt, I keep 14 lbs in the pouches and 24 on my belt.
I find that keeping it all on the BC puts too much weight on my shoulders on land, and in the water tips me face first underwater all the time. I don't use the back pouches for weight, otherwise I have to fight to stay horizontal, its not an issue for rolling and getting stuck back down but rather the weight is higher up my body and also makes me go face first.

Putting it all on the belt is also unpleasant, I use a combination of curved solid weights and bullet weights on a solid rubber belt, it keeps me upright at the surface, but is still easy to lie back if I want to float around on my back or front, and the rubber belt has enough give to form around my body when walking unlike the heavy nylon one I started with, I find nylon belts very painful, and soft weights downright annoying(they shift, or the put all the weight on my hips, which is also uncomfortable)


So I guess my answer would be both, for me spreading the weight around is much more comfortable, and allows me to float horizontal, vertical or at an angle underwater.
But setting up my belt changed it from miserable and painful to as unoticeble as 24lbs of lead can be.
Using both also means that if for whatever reason something fails or I have to dump weight, I don't lose all my weight in one go.

My buddy who is infinetly more experienced then me dives fully intergrated and swears by it, however the weights on his backplate/wing sit lower on his body, and even with that, and negative fins he has to wear ankle weights to stay in trim.
He really doesn't enjoy our long walks, I find them much more tolerable with the weight spread around

 

[Chris Brown Tech]

Hi JerryR,

We all went through this when we first started . I was recommended a similar system by my instructors and was also told all the rubbish about face down at the surface from other divers.

Many years and many $$$$$ later, I have now concluded that you cant beat a backplate and wing. Dont bother with a zeagle or any other rec / tech crossover half jacket half wing type BC. One of my instructors has a Zeagle and it has the most complicated weight integration system I have ever seen!

The most important aspects of a good BC are its simplicity, ability to control buoyancy easily and minimal failure points (fastex style clips and velcro)
so - my recommended checklist:

1) - how many lbs of lift? Anything over 30 for a single tank is not required
2) - Does it have a removeable/ repairable bladder that has only a rear dump and inflator hose?
3) - Does it have 2 tank bands with stainless (not plastic) fittings?
4) - Will it meet all your future diving needs, i.e. can you use it with double tanks, will it be suitable for video/photography/deep/tech? Can you put a bigger wing on it at a later date?

If you really dont want a backplate and wing, go for a simple jacket that is good quality 1000 denier ballistic nylon with steel D rings, that is lightweight. Heavy BC's ruin your trim and are a pain to dump air from. More D rings, pockets & gimmicks = more drag and buoyancy problems.

PM me if you would like any more info.

Cheers!

 

[akscuba]

Many years and many $$$$$ later, I have now concluded that you cant beat a backplate and wing. Dont bother with a zeagle or any other rec / tech crossover half jacket half wing type BC. One of my instructors has a Zeagle and it has the most complicated weight integration system I have ever seen!

I too recommend the BP/W option, but I want to correct this misconception about Zeagle's weight system. I have used a Zeagle, and it took my LDS about 2 minutes to show me how to use it. And it took less time than that to put the cord back into place after dumping weight. It's not really any more complicated than sticking weights in a pocket, and certainly takes less time and hassle than a belt.

If you don't get a BP/W, *definitely* at least consider a Zeagle. Back-inflate BCs are more more streamlined. I personally found my Zeagle to be much nicer than a jacket BC. See if your LDS will rent one to you. Some of them may carry back-inflate BCs just so their customers can try them before they buy.

 

[RoyN]

Get a BC that you plan on using for the rest of your life. Going with a beginner will just cost money and thats exactly what happened to me. Went from the Oceanic Probe LX, to the Scubapro Knighthawk, and now to the Scubapro S-tek. Right now, very happy with the S-tek and gonna stay with it.

 

[judestudio]

I too recommend the BP/W option, but I want to correct this misconception about Zeagle's weight system. I have used a Zeagle, and it took my LDS about 2 minutes to show me how to use it. And it took less time than that to put the cord back into place after dumping weight. It's not really any more complicated than sticking weights in a pocket, and certainly takes less time and hassle than a belt.

If you don't get a BP/W, *definitely* at least consider a Zeagle. Back-inflate BCs are more more streamlined. I personally found my Zeagle to be much nicer than a jacket BC. See if your LDS will rent one to you. Some of them may carry back-inflate BCs just so their customers can try them before they buy.

Second to that.

My sister and I are both novice divers, we just did our OW a few months back. After 3 months intensive research of a BC, she got a Zeagle Lazer (same as the guy's Stilleto), and I got a BP/W rig from DSS. To me, those are on the top ranks for back inflation BC and BP/W. Best value for money, and don't forget the after-service that comes with. Zeagle comes with lifetime warranty!

Get a BC that you plan on using for the rest of your life.

Can't agree more. If properly cared for, your gear should last a long long time.