BC Innovation

[Thalassamania]

BUOYANCY COMPENSATION: USE OR ABUSE. (1976) Lee H. Somers, Ph. D.

 

[contender]

OK folks, since a few recent threads have panned the attempted "innovations" from Mares and Sea Quest (HUB system, and i3 system)... what do you suggest the companies do to improve BC's and how should they execute those improvements?

I learned on a standard reg setup, and simple jacket style BC with an over the left shoulder LP hose connected to a corregated rubber hose for BC inflation.... and purchased gear very similar to what I learned on.

BC's are fundamentally 4 pieces; a backplate, bladder, straps, and a weight belt. What is there to improve?... cable/hose routing perhaps? Comfort? Bells and Whistles? Honestly, I see the inflator valve and LP hose routing as somewhat inelegant and reminiscent of older technologies (ones that did and still do work).

Personally, I feel getting rid of the ribbed BC fill hose would be nice. I could see the manual oral BC fill to be separate from the LP BC fill valve. the integrated dump valve is unecessary as many BC's have dump valves on both shoulders and one or more at the base for use while inverted. These elements don't need to be co-located. as they are never used together.

So, what else can be improved on modern BC's? What innovation can be driven here at SB?

Cheers,
David

No need to change something that works fine like it is. Most of the BC's out there now have way to many useless features on them.

 

[PhilEllis]

I just got a ladies' Hera BC. It has a hybrid bladder. It has a bladder that is both a back inflate & also some of the bladder wraps around inside of the jacket (all part of the same bladder). The back inflate portion helps with stability when horizontal & the wrap around part helps with better stability on the surface & a little feeling of how full the bladder is. By having a bigger bladder it allows for more lift. I've only dove this BC a couple of times, but can say that I love it! I must say that it is well cut for the female form.

Actually, for a recreational jacket style buoyancy vest, the Oceanic Hera does represent a little innovation. Very adjustable and actually pretty well engineered for the female form. The adjustment of the shoulder width is not that unique. It has been tried by others. But it is a nice touch and an example of how all jackets could be made to allow a little closer sizing for individuals customers.

For the people that love the Backplate and Wings, they appear to want little if any innovation. For those folks, I expect you will see much the same in 20 years that you see now. Tobin has done some pretty serious innovation on the backplate, without changing it in ways that would attract scorn. Other than that , I don't expect to see very much new.

Phil Ellis

 

[halocline]

BC "innovation" has basically little to do with dving and alot to do with marketing. Probably the reason there are so many bloated BCs out there that look like a combination fishing vest/life preserver is that most buyng decisions are made in a store, rather than in the water.

Once divers realize that less is more with BCs, the simple backplate/harness/aircell arrangement begins to look pretty good.

 

[PerroneFord]

most buyng decisions are made in a store [or on the internet], rather than in the water.

Modernized it for ya.

 

[Luis H]

How about a hover switch?

How would you like rigid ballast cylinders where water is pumped in to compensate for wetsuit compression and tank weight loss as you consume the breathing gas?

This can be easily programmed on an integrated computer that read tank pressure and depth. Someone just needs to preprogram wetsuit buoyancy as a function of depth.

This ballast system should automatically keep you neutral at all depth through the dive…hands free. You just use your lungs for fine tuning.

depth integration w/computer. Get neutral @ depth and then...set and forget it.

Yep... that is what I would like to build, but it should maintain neutral buoyancy at any depth.


The old DACOR Nautilus is a rigid ballast (constant volume) system, but has no automatic compensating features (for wetsuit or tank buoyancy chang).

 

[PhilEllis]

BC "innovation" has basically little to do with dving and alot to do with marketing. Probably the reason there are so many bloated BCs out there that look like a combination fishing vest/life preserver is that most buyng decisions are made in a store, rather than in the water.

Once divers realize that less is more with BCs, the simple backplate/harness/aircell arrangement begins to look pretty good.

I agree with you on large part. However, there is one thing that is said over and over on this board and other boards that simply does not bear out when you look at the facts......

While YOU and I and MANY on this board prefer a backplate and wings, the OVERWHELMING majority of recreational divers, EVEN WHEN PRESENTED with both solutions, still choose the standard buoyancy jackets, with all of the gadgets.

Phil Ellis

 

[Thalassamania]

How would you like rigid ballast cylinders where water is pumped in to compensate for wetsuit compression and tank weight loss as you consume the breathing gas?

This can be easily programmed on an integrated computer that read tank pressure and depth. Someone just needs to preprogram wetsuit buoyancy as a function of depth.

This ballast system should automatically keep you neutral at all depth through the dive…hands free. You just use your lungs for fine tuning.

There are three physical approaches, flexable bladders that take on and dump gas (what we call "soft" buoyancy in the submersible biz), rigid containers that use gas pressure to move water out (hard buoyancy) and rigid containers that use a cylinder with a piston that is moved by a worm gear to control the amount of water in the tube. There's no need for the control circuit to look at suit compression or tank contents, just pressure. "Stay Here!" means (with appropriate buffering) keep the first derivative with respect to pressure at zero.

Yep... that is what I would like to build, but it should maintain neutral buoyancy at any depth.

The old DACOR Nautilus is a rigid ballast (constant volume) system, but has no automatic compensating features (for wetsuit or tank buoyancy chang).

It also had a huge amount of drag.

 

[24940]

I think BCs need more tweaking about as much as a hair comb does. How about divers learning basic buoyancy control? It's not that hard to learn and a lot more reliable than a computer driven device that adjusts buoyancy.

 

[Luis H]

I think BCs need more tweaking about as much as a hair comb does. How about divers learning basic buoyancy control? It's not that hard to learn and a lot more reliable than a computer driven device that adjusts buoyancy.

Actually since I have never really “needed” a BC, its reliability is irrelevant. We learned to be neutral before BC was common. The BC just makes the job easier with lots of highly compressible neoprene.

There are three physical approaches, flexable bladders that take on and dump gas (what we call "soft" buoyancy in the submersible biz), rigid containers that use gas pressure to move water out (hard buoyancy) and rigid containers that use a cylinder with a piston that is moved by a worm gear to control the amount of water in the tube. There's no need for the control circuit to look at suit compression or tank contents, just pressure. "Stay Here!" means (with appropriate buffering) keep the first derivative with respect to pressure at zero.

It also had a huge amount of drag.

I kind of figured those were the different styles of ballast tanks, but can you expand on just taking pressure reading? Are you talking just ambient pressure, as in depth?

My intention is not to maintain a constant depth, but to compensate for known buoyancy changes. I don’t want the system to fight the buoyancy I intentionally generate with my lungs.


Actually, can you point me to somewhere for more info on the different ballast tanks/ systems?
Just curiosity, I am no where near to start building or designing. I have too many other smaller projects in front of me.