Atomic T2 question

[HBO MD]

I was just speaking with a LDS regarding an Atomic T2. He was saying that it is in fact an old Scubapro design which has been surpassed with current designs. He wasn't pushing SP per se, but also stated that there have been legal battles between the 2 companies etc as the Atomic owners/developers were originally affiliated with SP. In any event, if this is true, the Atomic is quite overpriced to begin with, but it would add insult to injury were it known to be an old design.
Anyone know if this is true?
Thanks.

 

[scubafanatic]

...I'm not a reg expert, but do own an M1, and am vaguely famaliar with the Atomic background and agree with most of what you said, however, Atomics are the same price as other equivalent regs, and their 'old' design isn't any older than the present Scubapro MK 25 top-of the line unit...compare prices of a T2 vs. a titanium SP Mk 25 and see! Also, 'old' means de-bugged/mature design that's proven...and Atomic's performance has always been excellent per pretty much any reg review you'll come across...also, most regs out there are just minor variations on rather 'old' original designs as well.

 

[beanojones]

The history is supposedly this. These guys:
About Atomic Aquatics, Inc.

While working at ScubaPro wanted to do an "all out best ever made reg" design based roughly on the mk10/g250 (which many many regs are based on). After doing the mockups and spec samples in Titanium, the bean counters at ScubaPro said that's too expensive, and untried, and green-lighted it, but only in the anodized aluminum finish (the mk20 ultralight).

In frustration, those two guys quit and took their design ideas to a new company they formed just to make that all conquering masterpiece, the T1. And people bought them, proving ScubaPro wrong. (And the titanium first stage caught on fire when using Nitrox, proving ScubaPro right.)

Of course, ScubaPro holds no copyright or patents on the balanced piston design, and balanced second stage design, but they might well have been pissed that they paid Dean and Doug to design a reg, and they took that work to another company. But that's why there are lawyers.

Titanium is ungodly expensive. It's rare enough, and it is very hard to fabricate. So Titanium regs are ungodly expensive, if the first stage is Titanium. Personally I am a Titanium second stage, and sealed diaphragm first stage kind of guy.

Fun fact: The Sherwood SR-1 which everyone loves, is made by Atomic, they say. Which shows that Atomic is at least recognizing that wet spring chambers are not a good idea.

I wish they made a stainless unbalanced piston first stage.

 

[HBO MD]

Thanks.
So the T2 is based rather than a "duplicate" of the mk X and 250? It has evolved past that ; correct? Any ideas in what way?

 

[beanojones]

Thanks.
So the T2 is based rather than a "duplicate" of the mk X and 250? It has evolved past that ; correct? Any ideas in what way?

(Side Note: My own personal second stage is an Apeks TX50, but that has to do with the fact that it just happens to fit my face perfectly. My first stages are also Apeks because they have dry environmental sealing.)

You do not have to worry that in buying Atomic regs you are paying for nothing. They sell to poor dive instructors as well.

I would love to use the Ti2 second stage exclusively for my rental fleet (About 10 sets of gear). I have three of them, and if I could afford it, they would all be Atomic Ti2's. (The second stages, that is.)

Why? Two big reasons:
1. Being Titanium, they don't corrode. For some people, that's not a problem, but I have 'retired' several G250's (and Mk15s) from corrosion. (The Atomic titanium first stage also does not corrode, and is worth it, if you can afford it. I cannot.) Unlike any other manufacturer's gear, the warranty is valid for as long as you own the gear, whether or not you service it. It sounds like a great warranty, but really it's just the simple fact that Titanium does not corrode in seawater. In a regulator, there's some cheap plastic bits, and the expensive metal bits. If the bits are not made of Titanium, they can corrode. And corrosion is not covered under warranty by anyone.

2. The venturi effect adjustment is automatic. As far as I know, Atomic got the patent on this and have protected it well enough that no one else can use it. This means that at depth you get the venturi boost, without having to deal with the crazy free flow. Especially with newer divers, that noise is scary and unnerving. Even with experienced divers, messing around with the venturi adjustment is just a PITA. Most divers just don't ever adjust it because it is a pain. Which leads to un-optimal breathing.

 

[beanojones]

Oops I forgot to mention the other big reason why the Atomic is great for my uses: The 'Seat Saver'.

Another patented innovation is the Seat Saver Orifice. The Achilles Heel of all second stages is a small rubber valve seat on the poppet. In standard designs, this seat is pushed tight against a sharp edged orifice from the day it leaves the factory, eventually making a deep impression in the seat resulting in poor performance and annoying leaks. That's why sometimes your regulator is fine when you put it away and it leaks the next time you use it. Our orifice only contacts the seat when pressurized. When not in use, the orifice automatically retracts away from the seat just enough to prevent damage during storage. This dramatically increases service life and maintains "like new" performance.

What that all means to me is that I have to rebuild the regs half as often as other regs. And if one set sits unused for a couple of months, it won't be leaking when I pull it out.