Apeks HP Seat failure: rumor or fact?

[rddvet]

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A ScubaBoard Staff Message...

This thread was split off from the needle valve discussion in NEEDLE VALVES

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Just a side note. My wife and I have done quite a few dives on unblocked 1st stages with the fathom needle valve. Sadly the reason is we've been plagued with the dreaded HP seat issues on Apeks regs that Apeks seem to deny exists. So we always had a backup unplugged reg ready to go. We've both done dives down to about 130ft with the unblocked regs. Neither of us were bothered by it, but I have to adjust alot more than she does. If I was doing much deeper dives I would definitely want a blocked 1st, but for shallower dives it's preferred, but not an absolute deal-breaker necessity.
As stated above, I've had tons of issues with Apeks regs and I can't stand them at this point. We've been slowly converting over to the Halcyon (same as a scubapro) diaphragm 1st. Martin at tecme can make plugs for that reg and they're cheap and he ships fast. I've been absolutely happy with the halcyons. The only issue is that for very deep dives that I don't do anyway (200ft plus), it's best to have a stronger spring. As far as I know, they're only available for Apeks regs.

 

[GF99/99]

(not sure why I cant get that above quote to go away. Please ignore that part)


Just a side note. My wife and I have done quite a few dives on unblocked 1st stages with the fathom needle valve. Sadly the reason is we've been plagued with the dreaded HP seat issues on Apeks regs that Apeks seem to deny exists. So we always had a backup unplugged reg ready to go. We've both done dives down to about 130ft with the unblocked regs. Neither of us were bothered by it, but I have to adjust alot more than she does. If I was doing much deeper dives I would definitely want a blocked 1st, but for shallower dives it's preferred, but not an absolute deal-breaker necessity.
As stated above, I've had tons of issues with Apeks regs and I can't stand them at this point. We've been slowly converting over to the Halcyon (same as a scubapro) diaphragm 1st. Martin at tecme can make plugs for that reg and they're cheap and he ships fast. I've been absolutely happy with the halcyons. The only issue is that for very deep dives that I don't do anyway (200ft plus), it's best to have a stronger spring. As far as I know, they're only available for Apeks regs.

Just out of curiosity what exact issues are you having with Apeks regs?. I probably a dozen first stages (maybe more) and have never had any issues with any them I have them on 2 different rebreathers both blocked and unblocked, also dive them as bail out reg, OC regs, etc. Also majority of my dive buddies have just as many as I do and I cant say any of use have had any issues other than normal wear and tear.

 

[vioch]

Also own by myself (and within the team) a lot of Apeks over a decade without any issues...

 

[rddvet]

Just out of curiosity what exact issues are you having with Apeks regs?. I probably a dozen first stages (maybe more) and have never had any issues with any them I have them on 2 different rebreathers both blocked and unblocked, also dive them as bail out reg, OC regs, etc. Also majority of my dive buddies have just as many as I do and I cant say any of use have had any issues other than normal wear and tear.

The only issue (technical issue that is) I have is blown HP seats. It's finally stopped happening because supposedly apeks secretly changed something in their service kit. But the issue is always blown hp seats on both blocked or unblocked firsts (all on ccr). Between my wife and I think we've have 4 or 5 now. @kensuf has had alot of them as well. Not sure what number he's up to. We also have several friends with the same issue. I think in my little group of friends and acquaintences, we have over a dozen HP seat failures. Not sure what age everyone's regs are, but my wife and mine are 3 years old. The seat failures happened mostly over the first 2-2.5 years. As I said above, something changed in the service kits, because as of our last services last year (servicing due to hp failure) we haven't had an issue. Of course now that I said that, I will.

Besides that I have several other reasons I now despise Apeks. I will not lie, I'm a scubapro fanboy but that doesn't factor into my thoughts. All of my din regs from various brands from scubapro to dive rite, to hog all thread onto the tank valve easy peasy like butter. Every single one of my wife's and my Apeks regs suck to screw on. They absolutely love to crossthread halfway through screwing on then you have to back out and start again. I have never had that issue regularly with any reg other than apeks. And I'm talking 4/5 times one of us screws a reg on, we end up wanting to scream at it. Another nitpicky thing is when your hand are wet and cold after a dive, the metal nubs for screwing on the din wheel hurt like a mother. Never much of an issue other than with the apeks regs.

When I got our apeks regs with our ccr's I was very excited because I always wanted to spend some time with apeks regs and see how they compare to scubapro since they're basically head to head top of the line competitors. Over the 3 years I've come to hate the apeks regs.

 

[GF99/99]

The only issue (technical issue that is) I have is blown HP seats. It's finally stopped happening because supposedly apeks secretly changed something in their service kit. But the issue is always blown hp seats on both blocked or unblocked firsts (all on ccr). Between my wife and I think we've have 4 or 5 now. @kensuf has had alot of them as well. Not sure what number he's up to. We also have several friends with the same issue. I think in my little group of friends and acquaintences, we have over a dozen HP seat failures. Not sure what age everyone's regs are, but my wife and mine are 3 years old. The seat failures happened mostly over the first 2-2.5 years. As I said above, something changed in the service kits, because as of our last services last year (servicing due to hp failure) we haven't had an issue. Of course now that I said that, I will.

Besides that I have several other reasons I now despise Apeks. I will not lie, I'm a scubapro fanboy but that doesn't factor into my thoughts. All of my din regs from various brands from scubapro to dive rite, to hog all thread onto the tank valve easy peasy like butter. Every single one of my wife's and my Apeks regs suck to screw on. They absolutely love to crossthread halfway through screwing on then you have to back out and start again. I have never had that issue regularly with any reg other than apeks. And I'm talking 4/5 times one of us screws a reg on, we end up wanting to scream at it. Another nitpicky thing is when your hand are wet and cold after a dive, the metal nubs for screwing on the din wheel hurt like a mother. Never much of an issue other than with the apeks regs.

When I got our apeks regs with our ccr's I was very excited because I always wanted to spend some time with apeks regs and see how they compare to scubapro since they're basically head to head top of the line competitors. Over the 3 years I've come to hate the apeks regs.

Sorry to hear you had such a bad experience. I guess I have just gotten lucky and never had any HP seat issues over the years nor have any of my dive buddies. And I cant say I have had threading issues or seen this either.

Nothing wrong with scubapro/halcyon they make a great product. I agree that the full 360 spinning on turret is better and the spindle nut on the second stages is much better. These are my two minor complaints about the Apeks regs.

 

[rjack321]

To confirm, several I've had a couple Apeks HP seat failures as well in the recent past (3yrs). Never had one until recently so something has changed.

The most recent one was on my blocked DS4 which runs at about 115psi IP because my Kiss MAV has a rather oversized orifice. I.e. its not 0.035" like its supposed to be so I had to turn down the IP to keep my O2 rate at 0.7 LPM. So its not like I was working it hard.

 

[kensuf]

Just out of curiosity what exact issues are you having with Apeks regs?. I probably a dozen first stages (maybe more) and have never had any issues with any them I have them on 2 different rebreathers both blocked and unblocked, also dive them as bail out reg, OC regs, etc. Also majority of my dive buddies have just as many as I do and I cant say any of use have had any issues other than normal wear and tear.

HP seat failures. I'm at around 8 failures right now.

Edited to add, the problem seems to have started around 4 years ago. There was a change in the material or manufacturing of the HP seat. I've found a workaround, which was to use a seat from another reg, but that's probably not the best solution. Rumor has it that Apeks recalled all of the service kits in 2021 and has a new seat now.

 

[Marie13]

I have the same problem screwing my din Apeks DSTs (4-5 years old) into my valves every single time. Major PITA. Never knew anyone else had the same issue. Almost tempted to go with my Dive Rite regs just for that issue and sell the Apeks.

 

[grantctobin]

The only issue (technical issue that is) I have is blown HP seats. It's finally stopped happening because supposedly apeks secretly changed something in their service kit. But the issue is always blown hp seats on both blocked or unblocked firsts (all on ccr). Between my wife and I think we've have 4 or 5 now. @kensuf has had alot of them as well. Not sure what number he's up to. We also have several friends with the same issue. I think in my little group of friends and acquaintences, we have over a dozen HP seat failures. Not sure what age everyone's regs are, but my wife and mine are 3 years old. The seat failures happened mostly over the first 2-2.5 years. As I said above, something changed in the service kits, because as of our last services last year (servicing due to hp failure) we haven't had an issue. Of course now that I said that, I will.

Besides that I have several other reasons I now despise Apeks. I will not lie, I'm a scubapro fanboy but that doesn't factor into my thoughts. All of my din regs from various brands from scubapro to dive rite, to hog all thread onto the tank valve easy peasy like butter. Every single one of my wife's and my Apeks regs suck to screw on. They absolutely love to crossthread halfway through screwing on then you have to back out and start again. I have never had that issue regularly with any reg other than apeks. And I'm talking 4/5 times one of us screws a reg on, we end up wanting to scream at it. Another nitpicky thing is when your hand are wet and cold after a dive, the metal nubs for screwing on the din wheel hurt like a mother. Never much of an issue other than with the apeks regs.

When I got our apeks regs with our ccr's I was very excited because I always wanted to spend some time with apeks regs and see how they compare to scubapro since they're basically head to head top of the line competitors. Over the 3 years I've come to hate the apeks regs.

I’m at 2, third one has held without problems for 14months

HP seat failures. I'm at around 8 failures right now.

Edited to add, the problem seems to have started around 4 years ago. There was a change in the material or manufacturing of the HP seat. I've found a workaround, which was to use a seat from another reg, but that's probably not the best solution. Rumor has it that Apeks recalled all of the service kits in 2021 and has a new seat now.

 

[J-Vo]

I've been using DSTs/DS4s for over 20 years and began using the service kits from John at NES several years ago. Haven't had a single HP seat failure. A few of them are approaching 4/5 years in service.

As for the binding hand wheel, I only have that problem with the satin finish handwheels. The crome plated ones are fine.