AOW student dies in training: Alberta

[ScubaSteve]

yes it was an PADI AOW class becuase thats the only certification Northwest Scuba does

Where did you get this tid bit? Not unlike many others, I think I have to throw a flag on this play :bs:

Mike is correct, Northwest does PADI OW and AOW (and I would imagine just about every other specialty out there for PADI)...........

This is what their website calls their course offering......sure they could lie but I trust their web content more than CWC in a heart beat.

 

[Jax]

Very sad for those that lost this student.

From personal experience, it does not matter how a student died as much as that s/he died. There's one hell of an impact on the shop and instructors; I cannot imagine the additional grief should they discover the death is unnecessary.

So, a question to the experienced and instructors among you.

What, if anything, could be changed in these basic courses that would help the inexperienced to remember to drop their freaking gear / weights?

 

[coldwatercanada]

i mean the only AOW class they offer is PADI . . . they are a padi store. . . thats what i ment

 

[ScubaSteve]

i mean the only AOW class they offer is PADI . . . they are a padi store. . . thats what i ment

Then that makes more sense. Thanks for clarifying.

 

[coldwatercanada]

they offer the widest variety of padi classes in alberta

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Well I'm not sure how things happen where you live but up here in Canada, people are not allowed to release information UNTIL AFTER the investigation is complete. Releasing details could change the outcome/hamper the investigation so he has no choice but NOT to respond with details. I know this as I used to be an EMT-A. Besides, it's more respectful for the family.

As for Northwest Scuba, they are top notch. I have done almost all my training with Ken and the gang there and they have NEVER taken any short cuts with any of the dives that I have participated in. I'm sad that such an accident has happen. My thoughts go out to the family of the victim and to my scuba friends at NWS and I hope they are all doing ok.

That's completely understandable. And I don't mean to be casting apersions on the dive shop or their staff ... I'll take your word that they're excellent ... but in the absence of anything factual, one shouldn't criticize people for speculating ... because speculation is all we've got to work with.

One fact that we do know is that this was a class ... and when a fatality happens in a class, in the absense of evidence to the contrary, it ultimately falls back on the responsibility of the instructor. That's hammered home in instructor training. The instructor is ultimately responsible for the safety of their students. You maintain control of the class, and don't put your students in a position to have an accident. And you especially don't put them in a position to turn a routine problem into a fatality. This wasn't a beginner ... he was a certified diver. If he was incapable of self-rescue ... if his buddy was incapable of helping get him to the surface ... PARTICULARLY if that buddy was a staff member ... then they were patently unprepared for the dive they were doing.

Unless it can be shown that he had a medical emergency that no one could have anticipated, there's just no other conclusion I can foresee here.

I feel bad for the staff ... a student fatality is any dive instructor's worst nightmare. I'm sure these are good, caring people who want the best for their students.

But unless it was circumstances beyond his control, the instructor is ultimately responsible if an accident occurs. That's why part of the instructor evaluation is class control, and why we're required to maintain a $2 million liability policy.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[coldwatercanada]

Tell you what guys ill make you a deal once the investigations over lets all sit down and have a talk about it hmmmm???? Ill get face to face with anyone on this board just not till we have facts to argue about. Everyones an expert behind there cpu!!! including myself

 

[Blue Sparkle]

Tell you what guys ill make you a deal once the investigations over lets all sit down and have a talk about it hmmmm????

Are the facts published after the investigation is over? I'm not familiar with how it works in Canada, but it seems like usually we never get them (speaking of incidents that happen in numerous locations). It would be great to have the facts printed here.

 

[koyote1111]

What, if anything, could be changed in these basic courses that would help the inexperienced to remember to drop their freaking gear / weights?

I mentioned something related to this in an earlier post. It was removed because it was viewed as "off-topic". During basic ow training, I think that there should be more emphasis on the repetition of skills. In some classes in which I've assisted (and taken), performing a skill to standard simply once was enough. Then it was onto the next skill. If we are to expect beginning divers to remember skills, thus have a better chance of employing them when necessary...repetition is a must!

Perhaps the PADI standards could be revised with regard to specific safety skills. For example, to meet certain standards, the student must demonstrate competency on three separate attempts. This might help a bit.

As I mentioned in the previous post, I don't think that it's very realistic to expect a new diver to be able to perform a necessary skill if they have only performed it a single time during their confined and/or ocean skill testing. Also, during an emergency or stressful situation, it would be very difficult to respond effectively with such little practice.

 

[Thalassamania]

Very sad for those that lost this student.

From personal experience, it does not matter how a student died as much as that s/he died. There's one hell of an impact on the shop and instructors; I cannot imagine the additional grief should they discover the death is unnecessary.

So, a question to the experienced and instructors among you.

What, if anything, could be changed in these basic courses that would help the inexperienced to remember to drop their freaking gear / weights?

I think I answered this in the other half of this thread:

The need (and desire) to practice must be inherent in the training to begin with. One of the biggest problems with most diving instruction is that a student is "taught" to do something, demos it once, and then is moved to the next "skill." The skills are never integrated into a whole and the student is not given a practice model to repeat on his or her own. Saying, "now you need to practice," is meaningless by itself.

A perfect example, except for the start and end of the dive most divers never remove or replace their weights, in fact, they only did it once ... in class. We place belt remove/replace into a practice exercise and our students do it, I'd guess, on the order of 100 times during class as well as have it firmly in mind as part of their practice routines.