Anyone else have a problem with a buddy grabbing your primary?

[redacted]

I expect an OOA diver to use my primary. I'm willing to leave the details of the exchange primarily up them.

I do discuss this in advance with a new buddy as I familiarize them with my rig. I explain that they are welcome to any regulator I have but prefer they take my primary. I do point out that my pony is usually off, but I will turn it on if that is what they take.

 

[Codiak]

I've been in to OOA incidents. The first had me donating and the second (Stupidly) was me needing donation, in both cases signs were given, regs were exchnaged and parties acted as rational as could be expected to get to the surface safely.

I my OOA case I was fortunate enough to have a regular shoved INTO my face as I started an emergency accent, (Buddy was distracted and missed the signal, a dive master noticed it and was in route immediately)

 

[FishOutUvH2O]

This is one of those things that I found kind of laughable about my PADI OW training. I just found it hard to swallow that most people having an OOA situation were going to have the piece-of-mind to calmly signal me before they yanked the regulator out of my mouth. And from what I've now seen out in the diving world, I'm even more convinced of it. So, we circumvented that issue by simply telling people not to bother waisting even more precious time signaling me, and to just simply take the 2nd out of my mouth. And that's the way my normal buddy and I practice OOA drills. Practicing having someone just unexpectedly yanking your 2nd out of your mouth also serves the purpose of getting me in the habit of immediately going for my back-up should my 2nd get yanked out of my mouth for any other reason (such as some knucklehead above me deciding it would fun to drop down unexpectedly and use their fins to remove my 2nd from my mouth) , which to me, seems better than the "blow a small stream of bubbles, while you use your arm to search for where your primary is," method that PADI teaches.

 

[jupitermermaid]

I've had to donate my primary twice. In both instances, the divers let me know they were OOA; the first time a woman diving with my group (not my buddy) showed me her SPG and had a wild look in her eyes. She did not grab my primary, but waited till I gave it to her. We ascended to the top together, skipping the safety stop due to her anxiety. The second time a guy swam up to me (again, not a buddy) and gave me the OOA signal. I gave him my primary and we ascended together. He was calm enough that we even did a safety stop using my air because I had plenty left and he was comfortable with it. We had been at 70'-80' for almost 40 minutes, and I really didn't want to skip it unless I had to. I've never had anyone just grab it out of my mouth, but I don't think I'd have a problem with it if a diver panicked and grabbed it from me.

 

[timle]

I've been in to OOA incidents. The first had me donating and the second (Stupidly) was me needing donation, in both cases signs were given, regs were exchnaged and parties acted as rational as could be expected to get to the surface safely.

I'm glad your experiences were mostly positive in a negative situation. Hoewver it isn't always that way.

I my OOA case I was fortunate enough to have a regular shoved INTO my face as I started an emergency accent, (Buddy was distracted and missed the signal, a dive master noticed it and was in route immediately)

The way you wrote the first paragraph actually makes the OOA incident look text book. However this paragraph tells a vastly different story. A signal was give, A signal was missed, you chose to go to the surface instead of to your buddy - who was most likely closer that the surface - I have no idea how shallow you were. Or even to the dive master who must have also been very close to get to you so rapidly.

It just goes to show how easily - even in an example given as positive outcome - things don't go quite to plan - and a backup plan had to be put into action.

 

[jh_MacLeod]

Because your primary is known good working and your buddy is probably wanting to take a breath really soon now. You are in better shape to deal with an issue should you switch to your secondary and discover it not working.

The[y] regularly ran out of air? ouch I would have been even more POd.

As I said, I think I understand the logic. But it is exactly here that this logic breaks down for me. You know how on an airline flight they always tell you to put the air mask on yourself first before trying to assist a child or someone else? That's how I think of this situation. If I donate my primary to some nearly-panicked diver and then suck on a non-working secondary, I'm going to have a heck of a time trying to get a breath on my primary again.

He didn't say that he and his buddies regularly ran out of air, but that the way they trained for that situation was for the AOA person to simply take the primary. In fact, he used almost the same words that you used above (that the AOA person needs it now, and the donor is better able to deal with a secondary that might not be working). Personally, I would rather keep my primary air where it is, while I help the buddy deploy and activate my secondary, with a hose length hose appropriate for diving conditions.

When I switched over to a BP/W, I considered going to the long primary hose. But for the type of diving I typically do, I just don't need that length. If I had gone with the short primary hose I originally considered using, this incident would have made for an even more awkward situation.

John

 

[carrielsal]

During an OW class I had a pony bottle with the reg bungeed around my neck and a traditional Octo. Before getting in the water with the student, I had shown my pony, gave a short explanation, and told him that the reg on the bungee was only for me and the hose on it was not long enough to share. We went down to practice several skills, the last skill being air sharing.
During the skill the student gave the signal for OOA then grabbed the pony octo bungeed around my neck. I decided to just let him go for it, since I didn't want to cause him any additional stress. I pulled out my octo to give him once he realized that wouldn't work.Would you believe he was able to get the reg in his mouth still attached to my bungee? Needless to say, we ascended up close and personal.

Carrie

 

[Codiak]

I'm glad your experiences were mostly positive in a negative situation. Hoewver it isn't always that way.



The way you wrote the first paragraph actually makes the OOA incident look text book. However this paragraph tells a vastly different story. A signal was give, A signal was missed, you chose to go to the surface instead of to your buddy - who was most likely closer that the surface - I have no idea how shallow you were. Or even to the dive master who must have also been very close to get to you so rapidly.

It just goes to show how easily - even in an example given as positive outcome - things don't go quite to plan - and a backup plan had to be put into action.

I was at 35 feet, tasked loaded and buddy missed signal while swimming away from me... Making the surface was guarenteed and I believed safely, 10 feet seperation from buddy moving away from me was not something I wanted to attempt.

I'm not going to go into the details and just say I was already headed up anyway and just didn't do it direct enough.

 

[UCFKnightDiver]

Having someone rip a reg out of my mouth is really not a big deal my bungeed 2nd is literally right there.

 

[Splash-X]

I've had this "out-of-nowhere grabbing" my primary happen to me once, and fortunately I had the presence of mind to calmly comply (then take, clear and use the octopus for myself). But ever since that experience, I've made a point of making it crystal clear to any new dive buddy (before getting into the water), that I will donate my "yellow" octopus, not my primary. I typically dive with a 1.2-meter hose primary (routed under my right arm) and a 1-meter yellow octopus (routed under my left arm and attached clearly to my upper right shoulder strap).

John,

What is one of the major things that you and your buddy do before a dive? If you aren't doing a Pre-dive check with your buddy and going over the topics below then you're always going to have two divers who are expecting different things:

Planned Depth
Planned Time
Contingency Depth
Contingency Time
Buddy Signals
Emergency Procedures (lost buddy, out of air, etc)


So, with that said, if your weren't practicing this prior to the theft of your primary regulator I am in some way glad you learned a lesson to discuss these things with your buddy prior to the dive.


Now, to your question, is it acceptable to ask your OOA buddy to use your yellow-hosed octo? Sure, it is acceptable but don't be too disappointed if your insta-buddy panics and still rips your primary out of your mouth. Often times the mere discussion of what to do won't change what the diver first learned to do when in an OOA situation. In rec diving, as long as you and your buddy have an air source and you both are breathing there isn't much to bicker over.

In most cases your primary regulator is going to breath better than your secondary octo so if the diver is panicking. Who is going to need the better breathing regulator, you or your buddy who is in a panic?


All said, I don't see a problem with you asking a buddy to use your octo instead of ripping your teeth out for the primary but I also don't see a problem if the diver, in the heat of the moment, forgets that you asked that of them.