(Another) Dive goes bad fast.

[wedivebc]

I haven't read all the posts but I have a couple of comments. An up signal is a non-negotiable command. You must make an agreement with your dive buddies that when the thumb goes up the dive is over. No questions asked!
Another item is I would continue to breath off a free flowing reg for as long as there is air in the tank. It is going to blow off the same amount of gas anyway, you might as well use some of it. What benefit does turning off the valve provide other than slowing the acsent?

 

[Seadeuce]

If a reg freeflows you CAN breathe from it. Allow the excess air to go out the side of your mouth.
You will have very cold teeth on reaching the surface, but the reg will get you up.
On the other hand it is easier for you to switch to your own octopus/Air II/AutoAir or whatever AAS you may have, then do an ascent while watching your contents gauge.

Having someone else turn off your air is not the best idea. If he/she overtightens the valve you may not then be able to turn it back on.

If you want to have it turned off, do it yourself.

BTW if you have to vomit underwater, then purging the reg and allowing the excess (plus detritus) to escape by the corner of your mouth will avoid any intake of water.
Slightly off-topic here, but underlines the feasibility of breathing from a purged/freeflowing reg.

You only have to worry when the freeflow stops



Seadeuce

 

[DiverChix]

If a reg freeflows you CAN breathe from it. Allow the excess air to go out the side of your mouth.
You will have very cold teeth on reaching the surface, but the reg will get you up.
On the other hand it is easier for you to switch to your own octopus/Air II/AutoAir or whatever AAS you may have, then do an ascent while watching your contents gauge.

Having someone else turn off your air is not the best idea. If he/she overtightens the valve you may not then be able to turn it back on.

If you want to have it turned off, do it yourself.

BTW if you have to vomit underwater, then purging the reg and allowing the excess (plus detritus) to escape by the corner of your mouth will avoid any intake of water.
Slightly off-topic here, but underlines the feasibility of breathing from a purged/freeflowing reg.

You only have to worry when the freeflow stops



Seadeuce

Having been sick underwater and having to purge underwater...I appreciate the information that can help someone else in that situation.

 

[DOkie]

This post stresses the ability to breathe off of a free flowing regulator which is a skill that I think needs to be taken seriously by new divers. I can't count the number of times I've had someone say "there's no way" or "I could never do that". Quite a few years back, I was one of those people looking at my husband saying "NO WAY" even though I had learned this skill in class. Thankfully, he had the patience to encourage me to do it regularly during shallow dives (he had been diving for many years prior to that). This isn't a skill that was stressed during my OW, but more like a side note (oh, by the way... now you give it a try). Now when I hear the "No Way", I stress to new divers that it is a very important skill to learn and become confortable with.

That being said (whether right or wrong) my opinion for turning off the air still stands. Even with an experienced diver, a free flow can heighten your anxiety. Now take a new diver (or even a narc'd diver) in (what I consider to be) the most peaceful environment a person can find themselves in and add not only visual (bubbles) and audio (bubbles flowing VERY fast) stimuli, but also the stress of thinking their life support is out of their control. It's like taking your drivers training test in the country and BAM your in a 10 car pile up on the interstate. Why shouldn't a buddy help take control of the situation, provide the other diver with air, and reduce the stimuli by turning off the air which will in turn reduce the stress level. As someone pointed out, by turning off the air and ascending, you have a pretty good chance that the free flow will remedy itself and therefore the diver can return to their own air source. The objective of any underwater emergency is to get it under control as quickly and safely as possible. I just don't see continuing to breathe off of a free flowing regulator when there is an alternative air source as doing that.... Out of air yet?... Nope.... Now?..... Nope.... Now?.... Ummmm N...O....P...E..... GIVE ME YOUR AIR!!!!

 

[dumpsterDiver]

.... Why shouldn't a buddy help take control of the situation, provide the other diver with air, and reduce the stimuli by turning off the air which will in turn reduce the stress level. As someone pointed out, by turning off the air and ascending, you have a pretty !!!

Answer: Simple because if the diver is too scared of bubbles to function and use a simple diving skill (like breathing from a freeflowing reg) , then what will happen if the donor and the distressed diver get separated? If they get separated, the guy with his tank turned off will be DEAD!!!

 

[peterbj7]

I haven't read all of this thread so I apologise if I'm repeating what someone else has said. This incident raises several issues in my mind:-

1) You with zero post-certification dives and your buddy with just 12 should not be diving together with no-one else, certainly not in very tough conditions. I know the agencies say you can, but IMO it's foolish. With the very elementary nature of most basic training these days you aren't equipped yet to recognise let alone manage most emergencies. You were lucky.

2) Most recreational agencies don't teach any self-rescue skills at the basic level. But that's when you may need them most, before you've had a chance to build up any experience. IMO this is a serious deficiency.

In this circumstance, had it been my regulator that was free-flowing, I would have taken off my BC and put it on my front. Simultaneously I would have turned the tank off. Ideally I'd then breathe from my buddy's octopus for a few moments, while I calmed down (!) and to give the reg a chance to thaw out. It often does happen. I'd then crank open the valve - it's unlikely the reg would immediately freeflow - and take a breath from the reg. If it again started to freeflow I'd turn the valve back off. Either way, if I'd done something to provoke the freezing-up (like pressing the purge button) then I'd trust it for a few more breaths, and if it didn't freeze I might put the BC back on again. If it showed it was going to freeflow again I'd keep it on my front and make my ascent like that.

This may be filling you with horror, which actually is my point. I've often done this as a drill and I've had students do it. Once you've done it a couple of times successfully you'll choose to do it when necessary without a moments pause for thought.

Without appropriate training you sound as if you did keep your head, so you may be an ideal candidate for more advanced training. I don't mean the stuff dished out by recreational agencies, but I'm thinking more of something like IANTD. Teaches you to manage and succeed when otherwise you might give up.

 

[Benny-c]

1) You with zero post-certification dives and your buddy with just 12 should not be diving together with no-one else, certainly not in very tough conditions. I know the agencies say you can, but IMO it's foolish. With the very elementary nature of most basic training these days you aren't equipped yet to recognise let alone manage most emergencies. You were lucky.

2) Most recreational agencies don't teach any self-rescue skills at the basic level. But that's when you may need them most, before you've had a chance to build up any experience. IMO this is a serious deficiency.

My sentiments exactly!!

 

[crosing]

I had an incident once in Bainbridge quarry where my buddy had a freeflow. We were down by the Pennsy cement mixer at 50 feet. I looked over at him and he gave me the out of air signal. That got my attention quick! I swam over and gave him my long hose and I switched to my back up which was on a necklace around my neck.

He had turned his own valve off before signalling me so I didn't know what the problem was. I grabbed his BC inflated mine and swam him up to one of the 20 foot platforms where we did a 3 minute safety stop before heading up to the surface. I did not know what had happened until we got to the surface. Luckily everything went well.

 

[crosing]

Those deaths last year in Gilboa which were the result of freeflowing regs prompted me to switch to doubles. I dive in Bainbridge weekly and the bottom temp is always between 38 and 41.