(Another) Dive goes bad fast.

[Teamcasa]

I'll still stand on the idea that the solution is to initiate an air-share and THEN ascend

But the reality is that the majority of recreational divers have not practiced an air share since it was done a couple of times with an instructor on their knees in the pool. ….Unless you do OOG drills so frequently that you can go into one automatically without even thinking about it, when it comers time for a real one, chances are it will be a mess....

You may well be right, Rick -- but isn't it better to have the mess while the diver with the freeflow still has something to breathe, instead of having it halfway to the surface, where you now have to manage an air-share as a true emergency, in midwater?

There is so much truth here – from seasoned and very skilled divers. The OP and the buddy was not. With new divers, virtually any emergency or gear problem inevitability ends with the affected diver bolting to the surface.

There are only a handful of new divers that can be properly trained to handle an emergency properly the very first time it happens to them. What can be trained is how to make your first 25 or so dives. These dives are the most critical in new diver development and every one of them should include an OOA and freeflow regulator drill at least once, preferably on the first dive of the day.

Sadly the excitement of diving, air management, mask leaks and buoyancy tend to take all of the new divers attention leaving little room for drills. If new divers would dive their first few dives with the likes of Lynne or Rick they would rapidly become better divers.

My advice to new divers, dive your first dives with a mentor, do the drills and your diving experience will not likely end up in the accident and incidents forum.

 

[BarryNL]

My advice to new divers, dive your first dives with a mentor, do the drills and your diving experience will not likely end up in the accident and incidents forum.

Good advice. When I'm diving with my DIR buddies we often do multiple unannounced OOG simulations in every dive (sometimes to the point of irritation ). The point is, any of these drills could be a real incident and we probably wouldn't even notice, the procedure is so well rehearsed and smooth.

 

[Bonairetrip]

Congrats on both making it through a difficult situation and in being introspective about how it could have been handled better.

I would also point out another issue: task loading. Remember when you first learned to drive a car? There seemed to be so much going on. Watch traffic. Signal. Shift at the right time. Don't drop the clutch. Hold your lane. Check your mirror. Watch the signs! Check the other mirror too. Anticipate problems -- is that guy going to cut you off? Yikes.

Yet, over time, much of that becomes second nature. In the diving world, you (OP and buddy) are each a new driver. And it will come with time as well. Some training (I was trained in the old days/ways) where stress training was a bigger part of the training than it is now. So that means incrementalism is now an especially good thing - build on your skills over time. Avoid task loading.

Think about this dive from the perspective of task loading. Newer equipment for each of you (sounds like). Thick gloves also sound like they were new to you. Changing the dive plan. Probably deeeper, colder and with less viz (perhaps making nav more difficult) than you were used to. No instructor or guide around. All of this before your reg (likely) froze up... [And your buddy sometimes (and maybe even his day) carries a camera? With 12 dives under hs belt? Sigh...]

My lessons (in addition to what others have noted):
a) Clear dive plan;
b) Avoid task loading;
c) The thumbs up is not a question, it is an agreed upon command binding to both divers;
d) The concern around a rapid ascent is more than just the bends, it would also be possible to have an AGE or other barotrauma.

Finally, nice job on avoiding a polaris ending to your ascent.

 

[bagz]

Wow!
I read your situation. Glad to see you made it up ok!

Also I read EVERY response (all 6 pages of them) and learned a TON from them all.

One thing I dont think I saw mentioned as an option during your ascent (and this is something my instructor mentioned to us in the pool sessions):

Try 'kinking' the hose to stop or slow a free flow.
Sorta like pinching off a garden hose and controlling the flow with the amout of kink, or pinch.

Is this a valid option? anyone ever tried it?

Thanks!


Jesse

 

[Pugsly55]

Just a few comments...

1. When something like this happens, don't signal your buddy and wait for a response. Signal him while swimming to him. If he doesn't see your signal, you don't wait for him to donate his octo, you take it from him. If he is out of range for you to get to, and/or not paying attention, then do a controlled (as possible) asscent. IF you take the time you took to figure out what is going on, the time he takes to figure out what is happening (indeed, in this case, he never did), then the time for one or both of you to close the distance, your wasting moments you may not have.

2. When testing out new equipment, don't push your limits. A new diver, new equipment, a new place, do a tour of the shallows. You can have fun above 20 feet at Bainbridge, you don't have to go "deep" every time.

3. Seems like you had a free flow on the 1st stage. A 2nd stage free flow would not allow you to hold the reg in your mouth. Its like the exercise you do in training when you hold the purge button in and "drink" air from it.

Everyone who is honest can admit they found themselves or put themselves in situations that they or their buddy were not prepared for. Emergencies don't usually come at comvenient times. Learn from it and move on. The most important thing is that you are alive to learn from it.

 

[DOkie]

I disagree that the correct procedure is to ascend on your freeflowing reg. Signal your buddy and get on his gas; you or he can shut down your valve. If you have calculated gas reserves properly, there will be NO problem with doing this. Once the valve is shut down, a short time may thaw the offending regulator. If not, a coordinated, calm, and QUIET ascent can be done while sharing gas.

If you aren't accustomed to it, the sheer noise and reduced vision of existing in a cloud of freeflowing bubbles is disoriented and disconcerting at best, and highly anxiety provoking. Shutting down the noise and the visual distraction helps everybody get calmer. IF your buddy has the correct reserves, it is NO problem to do an air-sharing ascent, and it is highly likely that you will regain access to your own gas at some point. On the other hand, ascending on the free-flowing reg runs the risk that the tank will run empty during the ascent, creating a need for a CESA (and incidentally most likely requiring the tank get a viz before the shop will fill it again).

Yes, this strategy depends on both divers being able to calmly execute an air-share and ascend while sharing gas, but EVERYBODY should be able to do this -- it is a survival skill.

Although I agree that there are MANY good posts on this thread (i.e. - cold water reg, overworking the reg, etc) this post is EXCELLENT advice. Last year, my husband and I were on a dive using the same brand reg (I won't name names), but at 100 feet I started to free flow. I'm still on the decent line and he's a good 20 feet away. We check each other quite often, so when he turned around, I motioned him back, he went to hand me his reg and BAM another free flow. So now I'm on his pony and he's on his 2nd and we're working on each others equipment. After ascending to 60 feet, we shared the pony while I turned his tank off and when I turned it back on, it was good to go (mine continued to free flow). Ascended further, made our safety stop, and ended the dive feeling pretty damn proud (you always wonder what you would do in those situations). We were so calm that after getting back on the boat, other divers asked what we were doing just hanging around on the line. No one had a clue that we were having problems (we were that focused on the task at hand).

TSandM - thank you for this outstanding post!!!

 

[dumpsterDiver]

Although I agree that there are MANY good posts on this thread (i.e. - cold water reg, overworking the reg, etc) this post is EXCELLENT advice. Last year, my husband and I were on a dive using the same brand reg (I won't name names), but at 100 feet I started to free flow. I'm still on the decent line and he's a good 20 feet away. We check each other quite often, so when he turned around, I motioned him back, he went to hand me his reg and BAM another free flow. So now I'm on his pony and he's on his 2nd and we're working on each others equipment. After ascending to 60 feet, we shared the pony while I turned his tank off and when I turned it back on, it was good to go (mine continued to free flow). Ascended further, made our safety stop, and ended the dive feeling pretty damn proud (you always wonder what you would do in those situations). We were so calm that after getting back on the boat, other divers asked what we were doing just hanging around on the line. No one had a clue that we were having problems (we were that focused on the task at hand).

TSandM - thank you for this outstanding post!!!

That is great that you and your husband handled a freeflow event while descending down an anchor line. I still maintain that it is very unwise to recommend to INEXPERIENCED, RECREATIONAL divers that the regulator should be shut down. In your situation, a redundant air supply makes shutting down a freeflowing regulator much less dangerous. I still have not seen a good reason to shut down a guys ONLY life support system in what the diver must feel is an emergency. Well actually I just thought of one....

I was diving with a buddy once who decided to dive even though his only second stage hose had a large anuerism in it near the second stage. We were diving in only like 20 feet when a tremendous explosion occured and I looked over at him and he still had the reg in his mouth but the hose was 2 inches long and the end was shreaded like an exploding cigar in a cartoon. The hose was whipping around wildly behind his neck.

I found it extremely funny (since I told him to replace the hose) and I grabbed him spun him around and turned off his air. I never considered offering him any of my air, because of the depth, our experience and the fact that I was nearly drowning due to laughter. I then released him and waved good bye as he swam up and ascended.

Maybe it is ok to shut certain people's air off at certain depths, but in the originally described scenario, it seems like a very bad idea.

 

[ianr33]

One thing I dont think I saw mentioned as an option during your ascent (and this is something my instructor mentioned to us in the pool sessions):

Try 'kinking' the hose to stop or slow a free flow.
Sorta like pinching off a garden hose and controlling the flow with the amout of kink, or pinch.

Is this a valid option? anyone ever tried it?

Thanks!

Jesse

Depends which stage is causing the freeflow. If it is the first stage (due to being frozen) then kinking the hose would just result in the excess pressure venting from the backup reg.

 

[Seadeuce]

Kinking a hose is not an option. You just will not be able to get the hose to do so.

I had an LP hose blow on me a few years ago and there was no alternative but to ascend and turn off the air (in that order).

Apeks produce a freeflow control device that attaches to your hose just next to your second stage. It works.


Cheers,


Seadeuce

 

[danvolker]

I believe the inability to handle air sharing with a buddy is a severe indictment against the major training agencies--it involves a combination of having virtually no minimum standards for the coordination and skills potential of each diver ( there are "never evers" who should never be certified) and woefully inadequate basic training where the emphasis by the agencies is on creating the billing cycle of a "new diver", and ignoring the time needed on training of important basics like buddy breathing.....Buddy breathing is such a simple task, regardless of virtually any recreational diving emergency scenario, that it is disgusting that it is not taught to a level of actual competence. To me, the only possible reason it is not taught, is how much time it would take for some people---and for the loss experienced by instructor/shop/agency when a person appears to be too uncoordinated, or too panicked, to be able to successfully perform the drills--or real world simulations.

Back in the 60's and 70's diving was a very simple sport....pretty much the only people who wanted to dive were actual "adventure types", people who were athletes in their own right, and for them, all they really needed was to be told that you can't hold your breath on ascent, and that you come up at the speed of your smallest bubbles. These divers pretty much figured out all the other stuff on their own, except maybe buddy breathing, which some of them had to be shown--and then they had it.... This was a world where divers were pre-selected by their lifestyle to be able to handle diving, and where no one was trying to convince a "never-ever" that they "could be" a diver. Now that we are in a world where everyone is told that they can dive, the very least the agencies should do, is have the decency to teach air-sharing...and if the diver can't be taught this, then they should have the decency to scrub this diver--thereby protecting them from themselves.

DanV