An age-old question: ways to 60m.

[Boarderguy]

For other readers coming here to learn:

This is more evidence of a clear lack of training. @Boarderguy is basing his gas switch on whether he’s getting cold or not. This indicates the lack of a clearly defined objective that validates the decompression obligation, one that seems to have been generated in a casual way, and also indicates a lack of thermal planning for the known or expected exposure.

A properly trained technical diver defines an objective, develops a focused gas plan for the profile, tracks his decompression obligation, switches to the better gas at the earliest opportunity and plans for thermal needs during the working part and the resting part of the dive.

@Boarderguy You’ve chosen clown shoes and underwear as your costume for this show, not me.



This thread has become about you and your desperate obstinacy. Two things that are clear to me are that none of us can coach or advise you to graduate from your hillbilly tendencies and you have no credibility in the Technical Forum.

The power to be better is in your hands.

View attachment 906889

Having gas for deco and using it when the plan was for back gas is stupid? You're really an idiot. Make a plan, follow it, divert only if your contingencies allow for it and you're able to.

Enjoy your tiny box of acceptable deviation and experience.

s

 

[greatwhite1]

So you think new divers are diving to 60m?

Of course they are Dear. X

 

[rddvet]

I just recently got AOW, DPV, and nitrox to make the dive ops happy when I go on boats. I've been diving since 2000 as an OW going wherever and to whatever depth the dive called for. My formal training consists of those above, but I've done a lot of informal with tech instructor acquaintances amd tech friends. The information is readily available to those who seek it out. I'm just the type that refuses to pay the cert agencies unless I have to.

I am not sure how I missed this earlier, but if this is true your opinion and thoughts are completely invalid here and you should not be posting in the technical forum. This is truly the eptiome of the Dunning-Kreuger effect and Normalization of Deviance. You truly have no idea what you don't know.
I've been fairly cordial, but if the above is true you should shut the f up and not post in this forum because you don't know what the f you're actually talking about. I've been wondering how a "technical" diver is saying such stupid stuff. Now i know. You're not actually a technical diver. You're an OW diver who thinks they know what they're talking about. Which is probably the most dangerous of all divers.
I have 22 years experience as a VFR certified private pilot. I have hours of IFR experience that I've received via mentorship from an instructor friend as well as doing IFR approaches with highly skilled pilots aiding and teaching. I have no "formal training" in IFR flight. I would never attempt to fly a plane in IFR conditions or even fly via IFR protocols in VFR conditions unless under the direct supervision of a professional. I'm not stupid or arrogant enough.
Mods may not like my comments, but the reality is you truly have no basis for the things you say because you have half of the information, and that is dangerous as f--k so I don't care if its not what the mods want posted. You should not be posting your thoughts or opinions here in relation to technical diving. Want to ask a question and learn, go for it. Want to tell someone how you would do a technical dive as someone with no technical training? I say shut the hell up and keep it in your diary. The mods should consider removing your posts because they are dangerous for people interested in tech divers.
To anyone who does not have technical training but want to learn before going down that path....ignore anything this guy says.
I'm sure you and the guys supporting your posts/ideologies will not like my comments, but I don't care what yall think. Scubaboard is a great place to learn about new things. But unfortunately the double edged sword is you never really know if the person giving the advice knows their ass from a hole in the ground.

 

[rddvet]

See here's the thing. My BSAC instructor in the 1980's would take us to a wreck dive site. If the dive had ripping currents we would either not do the dive, or instead of fighting against current back to the mooring line, simple ascend with the current pop our DSMB and have the boat pick us up.

Simply you should have ended the dive and not gone to 140 feet and into deco where you said you had 12 minutes of deco time, and all of this in a ripping current. Maybe you forgot the basic commonsense not to continue with a dive you were struggling with in the first place. I've seen this in Maldives with a newly minted DM and his GF with 25 dives who just followed what her BF did. Did not end in disaster but the DM had to share air from a guide to get him to a deco stop. He was removed from our group.

If I go on a dive I don't fight against the currents. Maybe I'm older and wiser lol Thing is though I go to dive in ripping currents in Lombok. I call these adventure dives.... Only 21% there and no chambers nearby,... dive at your own risk of course. The hammerhead cleaning station is at 50m in strong currents. It's a blast and by the time you are on the surface the boat if far far away still at the site where you started the dive from. Good thing my dive torch is very powerful and the boat captains can see if quite easily.

I'm happy you promote the trimix option for the OP and for others. As I get older I plan not to do too many deeper than 45m dives on air. Maybe a scooter is a good idea for diving against ripping currents?

My point was people do stupid stuff when they don't know any better and I was using a personal example from many years ago when I was younger and dumber. Now seeing boarderguy has no technical training, my point rings even more true.

 

[greatwhite1]

Never heard PSAI narcosis management course. Who is Hal Watts?
Where have you been over last 25yrs in technical diving.
I bet you do not know the difference between hypoxic and hyperoxia(normoxic)! Look it up.

He isn't a technical diver.

 

[Boarderguy]

To anyone who does not have technical training but want to learn before going down that path....ignore anything this guy says.

So because I chose to not pay exorbitant fees, I don't have tech training? Because I don't hold the illustrious cert cards, my experience is invalid? I've been diving a long time and have trained with many. I have studied and made decisions based on what I've been taught and learned. You are a card chaser, and think like many others here that you can only do something once you've paid the tax to the scuba industry. The cert cards i hold are only so that I may dive on local boats that require aow and to get O2 fills. My bonus card (dpv) is because a friend wanted to do the course and needed a buddy for it.

Experience matters. Paths matter. Pieces of plastic do not

 

[flymolo]

You are a card chaser

Just a minor point but “card chaser” describes something other than someone who only dives within the limits of their certification.

But I like how this thread continues to devolve. Keep going!

 

[rddvet]

So because I chose to not pay exorbitant fees, I don't have tech training? Because I don't hold the illustrious cert cards, my experience is invalid? I've been diving a long time and have trained with many. I have studied and made decisions based on what I've been taught and learned. You are a card chaser, and think like many others here that you can only do something once you've paid the tax to the scuba industry. The cert cards i hold are only so that I may dive on local boats that require aow and to get O2 fills. My bonus card (dpv) is because a friend wanted to do the course and needed a buddy for it.

Experience matters. Paths matter. Pieces of plastic do not

I'll just ignore you again. like I used to. You're clueless as hell. And discussions with you are pointless
Maybe mods should do some cleaning up on this thread.
But yes I stand by my words. Your thoughts and comments are invalid and you should just shut up.

 

[Boarderguy]

I'll just ignore you again. like I used to. You're clueless as hell. And discussions with you are pointless
Maybe mods should do some cleaning up on this thread.
But yes I stand by my words. Your thoughts and comments are invalid and you should just shut up.

You're just hurt that you needed someone to hold your hand and explain slowly about gas density and tissue loading. Being able to read and understand what's described is invaluable. Being and to execute what you've learned, also invaluable. Needing someone to watch over you and ensure you don't die when doing simple dives, that's not me. I'll pay for training if I go the CCR route because they can/will kill you. OC tech dives, much more forgiving and easy to accomplish with my own restrictions.

 

[crofrog]

So because I chose to not pay exorbitant fees, I don't have tech training? Because I don't hold the illustrious cert cards, my experience is invalid? I've been diving a long time and have trained with many. I have studied and made decisions based on what I've been taught and learned. You are a card chaser, and think like many others here that you can only do something once you've paid the tax to the scuba industry. The cert cards i hold are only so that I may dive on local boats that require aow and to get O2 fills. My bonus card (dpv) is because a friend wanted to do the course and needed a buddy for it.

Experience matters. Paths matter. Pieces of plastic do not

It's possible to be an autodidact, and certifications don’t guarantee competence. But, @Boarderguy , dismissing decades of research on gas density, and narcosis doesn’t make you a diving savant. It makes you a reckless gambler with a PADI AOW card. You call open-circuit tech dives “forgiving.” That’s not confidence it’s cluelessness dressed as swagger. True autodidacts bridge knowledge gaps with humility, not hubris.

The purpose of training is to make sure you've at least been introduced to concepts. Training with instructors exposes gaps in self-taught knowledge, hones decision-making, and reduces the odds of a fatal mistake. Your dismissal of it as unnecessary for “forgiving” OC tech dives ignores how unforgiving 60m on air can be when things go south. It’s preparation, not babysitting.