All about Halcyon wings

[JohnF]

I think Halcyon made a good decision here. They recognized a design flaw and addressed it. What it means for us as consumers is that you need at ADD the cost of a STA if you're comparing Halcyon to other competitors. As STA's are not cheap, this can mean a significant difference in the all-in price.

Hantzu

How many other wing manufacturers use builtin STA's?

JohnF

 

[SA-Diver]

The Halcyon Eclipse needs an additional STA.
The Halcyon Pioneer can still be used without the STA and
is still supplied with the built in rods and cam straps.

See http://www.halcyon.net/mc/pioneer.shtml

 

[Laser]

I use a Koplin STA with my pioneer even though I have the model that doesn't need an STA. Feels more stable, and spreads out some needed weight.

 

[cornfed]

Did you take the rods out of your wing or did you leave them in?

 

[Laser]

I left them in, and it works fine.

 

[Big-t-2538]

How many other wing manufacturers use builtin STA's?

JohnF

There are none that I'm aware of....

Halcyon was the first (I think) and I believe that they came to the conclusion that the set-up wasn't ideal. Thus, they went back to the STA-less style wing.

 

[docmartin]

i am more than a bit confused that some seem to suggest halcyon saw the pioneer's integrated sta as a design flaw and reversed itself. the facts are the pioneer is still sold with an integrated sta (fancy terminology for two rods). i have not heard of any plans to eliminate the integrated sta and go back to the old design. the eclipse is a different model from the pioneer. it is not its successor and does not replace the pioneer. it is meant for people who are looking for some added puncture resistance. bottom line: they now have a choice of a singles wing with and without integrated sta. i don't think that's a statement that one is better than the other. for what it's worth, imo the pioneers with integrated sta work great.

 

[jplacson]

Actually, Halcyon doesn't see any problem with the integrated STA on the Pioneer. And I have no problems using my Pioneer, I've even found that my regulator hits my head a lot less with the tank sitting closer to me. (The reg would hit the upper-back of my neck, rather than the back of my skull if I raise my head up completely)

True, the tank used to wiggle around a bit, but I found that I had to fully deflate the bladder first before slipping in my tank... then adjust the cams. Now I can get it just as secure as when I used to have an STA.

Docmartin is right though, the Eclipse wasn't meant to replace the Pioneer, since the Pioneers still have a smaller profile. The Eclipse is just like a Pioneer with another bag over it. I find the Eclipse kinda bulky actually, since I'm on the small side. I wouldn't mind having one though :lol:

 

[hantzu701]

Actually, Halcyon doesn't see any problem with the integrated STA on the Pioneer. And I have no problems using my Pioneer, I've even found that my regulator hits my head a lot less with the tank sitting closer to me. (The reg would hit the upper-back of my neck, rather than the back of my skull if I raise my head up completely)

True, the tank used to wiggle around a bit, but I found that I had to fully deflate the bladder first before slipping in my tank... then adjust the cams. Now I can get it just as secure as when I used to have an STA.

Docmartin is right though, the Eclipse wasn't meant to replace the Pioneer, since the Pioneers still have a smaller profile. The Eclipse is just like a Pioneer with another bag over it. I find the Eclipse kinda bulky actually, since I'm on the small side. I wouldn't mind having one though :lol:

My buddy dives the Pioneer w/out a STA and is pretty happy with it. When I watch him dive, I see that the wing flops as he moves. When I have worn his bp/wing, I am bothered by the flop. I guess I should clarify that its not a flop, but the wing shifting. My buddy had to fiddle with the cams to get the tank tight, but he has been happy with the Pioneer. He feels that the wing is secure and was surprised that I thought that the wing flops a little.

As for the Eclipse vs Pioneer, I stand corrected. For some reason I thought that the Eclipses were replacing the Pioneers. If this is the case, then I think this is bad. If the rods are so great, why not put it in the Eclipse?

New product eliminates bad design. Old product keeps the bad design. Why? Is the Pioneer the next Ford F-150 Classic?

Perhaps I am biased, but I still think that they need to re-think these plastic rods or go back to a STA. Just my humble opinion.

 

[jplacson]

The wing shifts? in what way? All my dive buddies dive Pioneers... some use the older one with an STA, but a lot use the newer one... I don't notice any shifting during the dive. The wings do flap around the tank when deflated, that's about it. I even feel that the tank is more secure without the STA since most people just route the cam bands through the STA and not the BP like on the Pioneer. My cam bands go through the wing and BP before wrapping around the tank, and since the wing itself is bolted onto the BP, I can't see anyway the tank should or can shift...unless the cams were tightened while the wing was partially inflated. (This happened to me the very first time I dove without an STA) The second time around, I completely deflatted my wing, then tightened my cams... the reason for this is that without the STA, the tank sits about 2" closer to the wing, so if partially inflated, the rods don't touch the tank and may cause some tank shifting.

It's a bit of a hassle if you're used to the STA, but I find my balance a lot better without the STA. Not by much, it just "feels" like my rig is smaller.