... it doesn't seem like a good idea to use Scuba Board for this.Uncle Pug:
Scratch that one.
Alki Jerks strike again
- Thread starter sparkyjames
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Scratch that one.
OP
sparkyjames
Registered
Why you worried the offenders may see it?
Sparky
Sparky
No... I'm concerned that some folks might use it to launch a vendetta or even slander the innocent.
OP
sparkyjames
Registered
Well you know If thouse that dive sites like Alki And Edmonds
the only two I know of , where this is a isue.
I dont dive some of the Seattle area sites just seems to work out that way.
but Ok I respect you and your advice so I would first like to say to any
and all TECH or DIR diver that may be offended by my post I am sorry.
I was not pointing fingers at you or any shops. notice I have yet to name names at all.
I was useing the term to show these guys looked like divers that should have known better.
Uncle P:
if you think this a bad topic then I give you my OK
to delete this thread.
and I wil back you in any thing any one has to say about it.
you know I respect you and value your thoughts as much as I do my mentor Bob B .
I for one have nothing more to add they were wrong and we all know it.
Sparky
the only two I know of , where this is a isue.
I dont dive some of the Seattle area sites just seems to work out that way.
but Ok I respect you and your advice so I would first like to say to any
and all TECH or DIR diver that may be offended by my post I am sorry.
I was not pointing fingers at you or any shops. notice I have yet to name names at all.
I was useing the term to show these guys looked like divers that should have known better.
Uncle P:
if you think this a bad topic then I give you my OK
to delete this thread.
and I wil back you in any thing any one has to say about it.
you know I respect you and value your thoughts as much as I do my mentor Bob B .
I for one have nothing more to add they were wrong and we all know it.
Sparky
seabat
Contributor
Would it be beneficial for underwater markers to be established in a similar fashion as Edmonds?
I have not dove the coves since I moved to Port Angeles in September and usually stayed in the 20 to 40 ft depth range. I do not recall seeing anything similar to Edmonds although I know about the surface markers.
Obviously if someone has the intention of violating the restrictions you won't be able to prevent the act. However, the unintentional straying outside/inside the boundaries in my opinion has the greater risk of accidents. Simply put, if you dont know you're in danger, you don't know you're in danger.
Making the assumption that dives in the coves will mainly be on the bottom to view the marine environment and that no such underwater markers are in place, a set of ropes and cinder blocks marking the boundary may prevent some of (or a majority of) the unintentional violations. I have seen numerous posts about stray divers at the Coves and very few, actually none, at Edmonds since I arrived in the Northwest in 1999. Maybe the size difference of the sites is the reason, but I know when diving at Edmonds I have never been unable to determine where I was underwater with the markers a short swim away in any direction.
If the dive community and the dive shops that use the area for training or "tourism" are concerned about losing the site, it might be more beneficial to show a pro-active approach to increase underwater and boating safety as opposed to relying strictly on a "policing" type of policy.
I have not dove the coves since I moved to Port Angeles in September and usually stayed in the 20 to 40 ft depth range. I do not recall seeing anything similar to Edmonds although I know about the surface markers.
Obviously if someone has the intention of violating the restrictions you won't be able to prevent the act. However, the unintentional straying outside/inside the boundaries in my opinion has the greater risk of accidents. Simply put, if you dont know you're in danger, you don't know you're in danger.
Making the assumption that dives in the coves will mainly be on the bottom to view the marine environment and that no such underwater markers are in place, a set of ropes and cinder blocks marking the boundary may prevent some of (or a majority of) the unintentional violations. I have seen numerous posts about stray divers at the Coves and very few, actually none, at Edmonds since I arrived in the Northwest in 1999. Maybe the size difference of the sites is the reason, but I know when diving at Edmonds I have never been unable to determine where I was underwater with the markers a short swim away in any direction.
If the dive community and the dive shops that use the area for training or "tourism" are concerned about losing the site, it might be more beneficial to show a pro-active approach to increase underwater and boating safety as opposed to relying strictly on a "policing" type of policy.
It is my idea that didn't seem like such a good idea after reflection.sparkyjames:
Some how or other peer pressure needs to be brought to bear, but publically naming folks here on SB is not the solution.
I think your posting this occurance is one important step in galvanizing folks to help stop the incursions into the diver exclusion zone.
Perhaps it will also help us in brainstorming for good solutions.
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Actually, there is a boundary cable in place demarking the restricted zone. It runs more than 1000 feet, from Cove 2 to Cove 3 ... strung between cinder blocks in a manner very similar to the Edmonds trails.
We have tried different approaches to making this cable more visible to divers. The first involved pool floats attached to strings ... that floated about 3-feet off the bottom. They were quite visible. Unfortunately, they also proved to be entanglement hazards because of the amount of diver traffic using the boundary cable as a rope trail (not its intended purpose).
So last year we removed the floats and attached about 200 1-gallon orange juice jugs, zip-tied directly to the boundary cable in an attempt to make it more visible (and float it up off the bottom a bit).
We installed two additional rope trails southeast of the boundary ... one leading to the I-beams and another to the Honey Bear. These are the two most popular attractions in the park, and we figured if we made it easier for people to navigate to these locations, it would encourage them to not plan their dives around the boundary cable. To a degree, this approach was successful.
However, due to the amount of structure alongside ... and just inside of ... the boundary cable, there are still those who think they can break the rules just a little bit and not cause problems. All too often though, once inside the restricted area they get turned around and end up underneath the fishing pier or water taxi berth.
BTW - Edmonds has had several incidents this year involving divers near ... or under ... the ferry terminal. They have also instituted a "no tolerance" policy of fines for divers who are caught in the restricted area. I think the fine is $500 ... and divers have been cited. That's a powerful incentive to not go in there. We have been trying hard not to impose this kind of "incentive" at Alki ... but that might end up being what it takes.
... Bob (Grateful Diver)
We have tried different approaches to making this cable more visible to divers. The first involved pool floats attached to strings ... that floated about 3-feet off the bottom. They were quite visible. Unfortunately, they also proved to be entanglement hazards because of the amount of diver traffic using the boundary cable as a rope trail (not its intended purpose).
So last year we removed the floats and attached about 200 1-gallon orange juice jugs, zip-tied directly to the boundary cable in an attempt to make it more visible (and float it up off the bottom a bit).
We installed two additional rope trails southeast of the boundary ... one leading to the I-beams and another to the Honey Bear. These are the two most popular attractions in the park, and we figured if we made it easier for people to navigate to these locations, it would encourage them to not plan their dives around the boundary cable. To a degree, this approach was successful.
However, due to the amount of structure alongside ... and just inside of ... the boundary cable, there are still those who think they can break the rules just a little bit and not cause problems. All too often though, once inside the restricted area they get turned around and end up underneath the fishing pier or water taxi berth.
BTW - Edmonds has had several incidents this year involving divers near ... or under ... the ferry terminal. They have also instituted a "no tolerance" policy of fines for divers who are caught in the restricted area. I think the fine is $500 ... and divers have been cited. That's a powerful incentive to not go in there. We have been trying hard not to impose this kind of "incentive" at Alki ... but that might end up being what it takes.
... Bob (Grateful Diver)
Grizz
Guest
Jimmie,,
let me know what you find out about Owens beach.
wanna hook up sunday ( Cove2) . it will be my last dive tell i get back from Kona.
fyi I will dive on twin 72's 31.2 %
you have my nummber.....
.....Wes
let me know what you find out about Owens beach.
wanna hook up sunday ( Cove2) . it will be my last dive tell i get back from Kona.
fyi I will dive on twin 72's 31.2 %
you have my nummber.....
.....Wes
I'm not in y'all's area, but the potential fallout from the closure of any dive site makes it a concern.
As a suggestion from afar... most dive shops have a mailing/advertising/email list of their customers and potential customers. Encourage them to include a short article on the problem in their next outgoing correspondence. A heightenend public awareness of the possible consequences may bring the peer pressure to bear that's needed to fix it.
Rick
As a suggestion from afar... most dive shops have a mailing/advertising/email list of their customers and potential customers. Encourage them to include a short article on the problem in their next outgoing correspondence. A heightenend public awareness of the possible consequences may bring the peer pressure to bear that's needed to fix it.
Rick
seabat
Contributor
Thanks for the response Bob. My diving habits never led me to encounter the existing boundary at the coves. At least now I know what to look for if I go diving there again.
Appreciate the info regarding penalties and incidents at Edmonds too. I was aware of the fines, but again my diving habits never led me to pushing the boundary adjacent to the ferry. By the way, as I had never heard of any recent incidents there, is there a published reference? online or otherwise?
With both responses I guess I will go back to the drawing board and think up some other ideas.
Appreciate the info regarding penalties and incidents at Edmonds too. I was aware of the fines, but again my diving habits never led me to pushing the boundary adjacent to the ferry. By the way, as I had never heard of any recent incidents there, is there a published reference? online or otherwise?
With both responses I guess I will go back to the drawing board and think up some other ideas.
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