Air in BC? What do you do?

[calscubagirl]

Actually I dive solo only about half the time but there is no point in putzing around on the surface, DIVE is the KEYWORD and it implies an ACTION. I don't have any ear problems and I don't need to check anything because I have already done that and I don't need to contemplate finning techniques. This is like being on the runway and the tower says to me, "Experimental Vans 0TX, cleard for takeoff", the throttle goes in and the it is GO TIME. Yeah, I check my guages for anomolies and I can do that in a "hot drop". Nothing prevents one from aborting if whatever reason develops, that is no excuse to float around on the surface like a jellyfish checking everything over and over like some sort of scuba diving obsessive compulsive. Y'all a bunch of nannies--lol. N

I know you dive solo but, you remind me of a dive buddy I had not too long ago on a night dive in Catalina. By the time I got into the water, he was gone. I went to call out to him but, no answer. Some other divers said he already went down. I ended up tagging a long with a couple of other divers. My dive buddy was on a race....I was thinking....what's the hurry?? Slow down, relax and enjoy the dive.:14:

To keep this on the same subject......I always add a little air to my BC.

 

[Diveral]

Remember, Nemrod dives solo. It's pretty difficult to orchestrate a good buddy descent, maintaining relative positioning and visual contact, if you hot drop. Descents are one of the places where things go wrong (discovering some equipment malfunction undetected on the surface, or having ear problems, etc.) and in my mind, that's a time when buddies really should try to stay together and in contact. Although there are some conditions (very strong surface currents) where it isn't desirable to group up on the surface, most of the time it is.

That's why you meet on the anchor line or hang bar at 15 - 20 feet when you hot drop. Also when you hot drop you should check all of your gear before entering the water. I normally take a minimum three breaths of the reg before I jump in. On a hot drop I up that to 5-6. For extreme currents we may meet up at 60' or on the wreck. First diver in calls the meet spot based on conditions. Usually we have enough vis that you can see your buddy the entire descent and we are exchanging OK sign from 20 feet apart. All of the dives I have been on where a hot drop was needed were not suitable for inexperienced divers.

AL

 

[Diveral]

I
Knocked out? How are you going to get knocked out? That's just silly. Make your entry and don't bob around on the surface where other divers are making their entries. It's not an issue.

Of course if you want to hang a sign around your neck that screams, "beginner who can't think outside the box," that's one way to do it.

Usually by having another diver jump on your head as you are bobbing on the surface. Or has anyone been conked on the head by the boat ladder while bobbing on the surface behind the boat? It hurts :shiner1: .

AL

 

[redrover]

Walter, and possibly Nemrod ,and more as well,
I see your point but I’m feeling compelled to disagree, to a point. That is; not all dives are the same, or not the same for all. I think the slur that if a person chooses to not enter and sink is a geek is very unkind and displays tunnel vision.

I spoke of a recent dive where I put in a lot of air. It was a new to me shore ledge entry. I’d entered from the beach before and knew the area I was entering was shallow with a lot of large rubble, very near the mouth of a harbor (who knows what boats may be dumping off on the way in that washes up to shore). It was moderately rough with waves crashing up onto the top with a 12 to 16” step down, with enough force I as well as the other 2 divers weren’t comfortable we could stay sitting on it to put fins on. The waves were sweeping up and past the ledge into a small cove of big lava boulders.
With my HP80’s, if I get off balance I stand a 80% chance I’m going to hurt myself badly because I cannot recover balance with that weight (much more recovery room with my AL50’s.) From my experience the amount of power in the waves was plenty to throw me off balance with nothing to hold onto. The ledges or steps were uneven with the outermost edge sloping towards the water.
Recommended entry by accompanying diver who knew the entry was a modified giant step, pushing off and spinning around to land facing the rock wall and fin like halibut away. Once in we would surface swim the shallows out to a descend point.

I will not argue the point about looking like a geek, I do. I cannot help that, I am a geek. Maybe it is because I am a geek I don’t see it, but I don’t think dropping like one of those boulders rolling around in that surf would have been a good idea. I do hope you find my example - plummeting 8’ onto boulders - to be perhaps a bit silly. But I also hope you will see my point, not all entries are the same and ergo not all methods to enter should be exactly the same. That we did in fact bob around in the surf and along the surface in the waves, together for a while before descending. Perhaps to you it would have looked like geeks on parade carrying a banner and bullhorns. However it worked fine and we didn’t seem to be troubled by it. In fact I did not have the feeling I should apologize to anyone for being such a geek, again.

I’m making a presumption here, that you primarily dive specific ways and/or places such as your method indicates a reason for not adding air. Often I see opinions and remarks that seem to be fairly one sided such as boat only or cave only or poor vis only or cold water only. I feel your response is like that, everyone should do what you do in your situation, in every situation no matter how different it may be. I’m surprised at you Walter. Are you also implying any one not doing a final check on the boat (which boat? One of the ones in the harbor, then walk a long way back to the shore entry?) is hanging a sign around their neck that screams, "beginner who can't think outside the box,"?

 

[limeyx]

You are clearly underweight, it's just been hidden by your low air consumption. You really should test your weighting with a 500psi tank. The concern is that you are going to have trouble holding your safety stop when you hold it the most (i.e. at the end of a dive long enough and deep enough for even you to get low on air).

If you are truly neutral at 1500psi, you probably need another two pounds.

I'll add my vote to the chorus that says to enter the water with air in your BC unless the specific conditions for that dive necessitate otherwise. There are some things you can't easily check on the boat or that may happen during the entry that you don't want to have to deal with while plummeting to the bottom.

Agreed on the underweighting issue.

There's a really good article I read a while back (dont have a link) about a very experienced diver in doubles, jumped in with an empty wing and his gas turned off.

They found him drowned at about 160 feet with full tanks

I'd say add some weight and inflate the BC on the way in.

To the person who commented regarding the current -- it's way better to be scattered by a current than drowned (in my opinion anyway)

 

[Diveral]

Agreed on the underweighting issue.

There's a really good article I read a while back (dont have a link) about a very experienced diver in doubles, jumped in with an empty wing and his gas turned off.

They found him drowned at about 160 feet with full tanks

I'd say add some weight and inflate the BC on the way in.

To the person who commented regarding the current -- it's way better to be scattered by a current than drowned (in my opinion anyway)

You get scattered off Cape Hatteras or Cape Lookout in the Gulf Stream, they might find you before you die of dehydration or exposure but it's not assured. They might not ever find you, wouldn't be the first.

 

[Nemrod]

I roll and go and if I have a buddy or buddys then we have it worked out that they will do the same and we will meet on the anchor line at 30 feet or whatever we decide is appropriate BUT we are NOT bobbing about the surface having other diver land on my head as my buddys drift off over the horizon.

BUT, your right, if my buddys decide to inflate their BC units and float away, after a bit of waiting on them on the anchor line I am quite likely to continue my dive, they will be fine, they got on life jackets pumped full of air. After we pull anchor hopefully we will find them. N

 

[AquaHump]

Walter, and possibly Nemrod ,and more as well,
I see your point but I’m feeling compelled to disagree, to a point. That is; not all dives are the same, or not the same for all. I think the slur that if a person chooses to not enter and sink is a geek is very unkind and displays tunnel vision.

I spoke of a recent dive where I put in a lot of air. It was a new to me shore ledge entry. I’d entered from the beach before and knew the area I was entering was shallow with a lot of large rubble, very near the mouth of a harbor (who knows what boats may be dumping off on the way in that washes up to shore). It was moderately rough with waves crashing up onto the top with a 12 to 16” step down, with enough force I as well as the other 2 divers weren’t comfortable we could stay sitting on it to put fins on. The waves were sweeping up and past the ledge into a small cove of big lava boulders.
With my HP80’s, if I get off balance I stand a 80% chance I’m going to hurt myself badly because I cannot recover balance with that weight (much more recovery room with my AL50’s.) From my experience the amount of power in the waves was plenty to throw me off balance with nothing to hold onto. The ledges or steps were uneven with the outermost edge sloping towards the water.
Recommended entry by accompanying diver who knew the entry was a modified giant step, pushing off and spinning around to land facing the rock wall and fin like halibut away. Once in we would surface swim the shallows out to a descend point.

I will not argue the point about looking like a geek, I do. I cannot help that, I am a geek. Maybe it is because I am a geek I don’t see it, but I don’t think dropping like one of those boulders rolling around in that surf would have been a good idea. I do hope you find my example - plummeting 8’ onto boulders - to be perhaps a bit silly. But I also hope you will see my point, not all entries are the same and ergo not all methods to enter should be exactly the same. That we did in fact bob around in the surf and along the surface in the waves, together for a while before descending. Perhaps to you it would have looked like geeks on parade carrying a banner and bullhorns. However it worked fine and we didn’t seem to be troubled by it. In fact I did not have the feeling I should apologize to anyone for being such a geek, again.

I’m making a presumption here, that you primarily dive specific ways and/or places such as your method indicates a reason for not adding air. Often I see opinions and remarks that seem to be fairly one sided such as boat only or cave only or poor vis only or cold water only. I feel your response is like that, everyone should do what you do in your situation, in every situation no matter how different it may be. I’m surprised at you Walter. Are you also implying any one not doing a final check on the boat (which boat? One of the ones in the harbor, then walk a long way back to the shore entry?) is hanging a sign around their neck that screams, "beginner who can't think outside the box,"?

:lol:

WOW talk about one sided. it seems to me that some one wanted to know about wether or not to keep air in there BC becouse thats what they got tought in class. Now the only point you have is that some one should have asked what kind of diving she does.
If asked most people will answer to there exp. Most divers dive off boats and that is the answer that was given. Now if you feel bad becouse some one hurt YOUR feelins. GET OVER IT.

 

[chip104]

Both negative and buoyant entries are common depending on the type of dive, the type of diver, and the dive conditions. I don't understand why it has to be one way or the other.

 

[Walter]

I’m surprised at you Walter. Are you also implying any one not doing a final check on the boat (which boat? One of the ones in the harbor, then walk a long way back to the shore entry?) is hanging a sign around their neck that screams, "beginner who can't think outside the box,"?

The boat from which you are diving. She was specifically asking about giant stride and back roll entries from a boat. Beach entries are another question entirely. If you are swimming on the surface to a descent point, I'd recommend a little air in the BC.

Do you also object to advice about rigging tag/current lines on boats because they don't apply to beach diving?

I don't understand why you'd want to sit on a rock ledge to don your fins, but then I haven't seen the entry point you describe. Were I to dive at that location, I'd listen to folks experienced in diving that site, I'd examine it myself and I'd make my decision based on my evaluation of all factors.

I’m making a presumption here, that you primarily dive specific ways and/or places such as your method indicates a reason for not adding air.

I dive from boats - big and little, some have swim platforms and ladders, some have one, but not the other, some have neither. I dive from shore - sand beach, rock beach, no beach, dock, steps, I've rappelled in full SCUBA to the water, I've made giant stride entries from water level and from 15 feet high. I've dived wet suit, dry suit, no suit, warm water, cold water, modern gear, vintage gear.